Things I'm looking forward to in a new edition;


Pathfinder Second Edition General Discussion

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Silver Crusade

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Also I don't want the writers destroying themselves with overtime and crunch.

Liberty's Edge

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And besides, quick and dirty conversions of the existing classes to PF2 is a relatively easily crowd-sourced solution that really isn't that hard for the fans to do. The pro game designers can do elegant ones later, if it fits the game :)


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Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

Technically speaking, I believe the traditional saying allows you to pick two out of good, fast, and cheap. :P

But strong agreement that I'd rather converted material take its time and be done right.


Pathfinder Pathfinder Accessories, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber
Set wrote:
Rysky wrote:
And I very much want them to not rush everything to get stuff out asap. I rather they, ya'know, actually work on stuff.
Yeah, as the old saying goes, you can have it good, you can have it fast, or you can have it cheap. Pick one.

It's pick two, not one. But I agree that I'd rather have quality content that takes a while than have poor content that is rushed.


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Set wrote:
Rysky wrote:
And I very much want them to not rush everything to get stuff out asap. I rather they, ya'know, actually work on stuff.

Yeah, as the old saying goes, you can have it good, you can have it fast, or you can have it cheap. Pick one.

I pick good. I'd much rather have a *good* Kineticist, or whatever, than just one pumped out so that they'd have one out there in time for launch.

Plus if they dropped, like, FORTY or so base classes right at launch, the book would weigh fifty lbs, and cost all the moneys. I'll take the installment plan, please. :)

And, IMO, the classes that probably *should* get priority are the ones already cooked into the setting. We know Alchemists are a big deal, because of the Sun Orchid Elixir and Thuvia. Gunslingers are a thing in Alkenstar, and Numeria. We know there are Witches, they are all over Irrisen. But if there aren't any Cavaliers or Hunters or Shifters or Mesmerists available right this second? There's no setting area neglected by those showing up a few books down the road.

It's a little bit ironic that the rush to backfit the Summoner into the setting via the Godcallers of Sarkoris, combined with the newly available adventure area of post-Worldwound Sarkoris, makes the Summoner *more* relevant to the setting lore than, say, the Inquisitor or even the Magus! I'm sure that wasn't intended. :)

I agree, rushing to pump out all of the PF1 classes would probably result in sub-standard classes. And those setting-tied classes are the ones that should probably get priority. I do love the Inquisitor and Magus, but I can understand them not being in the first batch. Gunslinger, witch, summoner and oracle should probably be in the first set. I hope the Summoner can keep the original summoner's concept of building your own creature instead of the watered down outsiders from the ironically named Unchained Summoner. There's room for eidelons that are basic angels, devils, elementals and the llike as well, but the truly unique eidelons were great, and fitting for the Sarkorin 'Gods.'

One of the things I'm looking forward to in this edition is some of the flawed classes getting a second shot to fulfill their potential. Summoner was cool, but did have some balance issues, bringing back the flavor and concept with better balance would be nice. Similar with Kineticist. It was almost awesome, but had a few problems that kept it as a bit of a one-trick pony and had scaling issues with burn. And shifter is a cool concept that just wasn't done well enough. I'd like to see how a PF2 medium would work, the class is cool, but the complexity has been keeping me away.


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I'm excited for GOBLINS! GOBBY GOB KILL! GOBBY GOB DO GOOD! And Alchemists being a part of the base line classes. I REALLY want the GMG so I can start making my own races, feats, weapons, spells, monsters... All of the homebrew... ALL OF IT! And I want a faster paced system, my table is particularly large, so it took 10-20 minutes until you were up again in PF1, which made most people check out and start looking on their phones, so this being faster seems like a massive boon. Also something basic is gonna be great, 2 of our players are very crunch aversive, so having super simple "ya wanna do X? Here's how" at the very start is gonna be grand. Not looking forward to losing my main squeeze (Magi, I weep for you) but they'll come back around eventually. Overall, in the words of Vegeta... I AM THE HYPE!!!!!!!!!!!


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Doktor Weasel wrote:
I agree, rushing to pump out all of the PF1 classes would probably result in sub-standard classes.

While I don't want rushed [see 1st edition Advanced Class Guide], I'd be all for a quick and dirty conversion guide: hints and tips on how to use the existing rules to emulate rule elements not in the game yet. Something to full the gap until the new rules come out.

nick1wasd wrote:
I'm excited for GOBLINS! GOBBY GOB KILL! GOBBY GOB DO GOOD!

I know some are excited for this, but I can see the horde of goblin players coming and it makes me think I'd rather see the old horde of dual-scimitar wielding drow with cat pets... :P

I fear the go to race for people looking to cause trouble with be goblins 'cuz that's what a goblin would do!!!'. Normally, I'm all for giving players a choice, but with this I think "I'm looking forward to" seeing DM's exclude goblins from character creation.

Silver Crusade

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Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Because the horde of people playing Scottish accent beer-drinking dwarven warriors with names like Thorgrin Ironshield or uppity elven archers with names Sylvadrylliel Moonbow or featureless human fighters named Bob aren't a thing. :)


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Gorbacz wrote:
Because the horde of people playing Scottish accent beer-drinking dwarven warriors with names like Thorgrin Ironshield or uppity elven archers with names Sylvadrylliel Moonbow or featureless human fighters named Bob aren't a thing. :)

None of those want to start fires or kill your animal companion. ;)

While any trope can be annoying sometimes, it really bugs me when it's a trope that's supposedly fairly rare but isn't. A single exiled drow is fine, but when they become more common that the average human it breaks my reality filter. In the year between PF1 and PF2, I can't imagine PC type goblins became super common but I'm worried it will seem like that in play.


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I look forward to releasing some PF1 options in a different order than they did in PF1. Like there's no reason we need to release the new Inquisitor, Magus, and Summoner before we roll out the new Occultist. Like the first 3 ancestries post-release are Leshy, Hobgoblin, and Lizardperson.

Some of the latter options in PF1 didn't seem to be as fully accepted as some of the earlier ones since they were "new and weird" or "people had given up on bloat" or whatever.


PossibleCabbage wrote:

I look forward to releasing some PF1 options in a different order than they did in PF1. Like there's no reason we need to release the new Inquisitor, Magus, and Summoner before we roll out the new Occultist. Like the first 3 ancestries post-release are Leshy, Hobgoblin, and Lizardperson.

Some of the latter options in PF1 didn't seem to be as fully accepted as some of the earlier ones since they were "new and weird" or "people had given up on bloat" or whatever.

I think with classes, they'll push for popular ones first so I think earlier ones will win out over newer, less accepted, ones in the schedule. Now that might mean a different release than PF1, but I'd be surprised if occult won out over things like the magus.

For myself, I'd love to see some of those newer classes imagined. Make shifter a class entirely based around at will/encounter powers, make a Kineticist built around focus and elemental cantrips, ect.

Dark Archive

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Doktor Weasel wrote:
I agree, rushing to pump out all of the PF1 classes would probably result in sub-standard classes. And those setting-tied classes are the ones that should probably get priority. I do love the Inquisitor and Magus, but I can understand them not being in the first batch. Gunslinger, witch, summoner and oracle should probably be in the first set. I hope the Summoner can keep the original summoner's concept of building your own creature instead of the watered down outsiders from the ironically named Unchained Summoner. There's room for eidelons that are basic angels, devils, elementals and the llike as well, but the truly unique eidelons were great, and fitting for the Sarkorin 'Gods.'

Agreed, I would love for something more compatible with the concept of the Godcaller, and yet for there also to be a more flexible option, similar to the pre-unchained-Summoner (perhaps based around the Protean or Aeon, outsider types that are already kind of varied in form or natural shapechangers). A Godcaller archetype that made the Summoner's magic divine, instead of arcane, and the class features more priestly, would be a crazy cool concept, for instance, and push this version of the Summoner closer to the in-world lore.

Quote:
One of the things I'm looking forward to in this edition is some of the flawed classes getting a second shot to fulfill their potential. Summoner was cool, but did have some balance issues, bringing back the flavor and concept with better balance would be nice. Similar with Kineticist. It was almost awesome, but had a few problems that kept it as a bit of a one-trick pony and had scaling issues with burn. And shifter is a cool concept that just wasn't done well enough. I'd like to see how a PF2 medium would work, the class is cool, but the complexity has been keeping me away.

Yeah, I have almost identical quibbles with these specific examples. :)

I love the concept of the Kineticist (or other all-day blasters like the 3.5 Warlock) or the Shifter or the Medium, and don't really care for the way they turned out (too fiddly with the different durations of the different mechanics, for the Shifter, don't like Burn at all, for the Kineticist, etc.).

I'd want the Shifter, for example, to be much, much simpler. Add a critter feature to a 'wild shape,' it stays up the length of the wild shape, and the wild shape is usable in smaller increments, like 10 minutes, not 'okay, my 1st level shifter used his one hour of power today to be almost as good a fighter as the fighter was *all day long,* and now he's an exp sponge leeching off of everyone else for the next 23 hours...'

And, this is just my own quirky deal, I wouldn't mind terribly if the Alchemist class had the slightest damn thing to do with *alchemy.* Yanno, alchemist's fire, tanglefoot bombs, thunderstones, that sort of thing. :) Make it an AT that savagely cuts down on extracts and / or bombs and can raise the effectiveness / DCs of those options to keep them level-appropriate, grant the class a pool of 'crafting points' every day to make these advanced alchemical goodies (so they don't have to throw their WBL at enemies and cry) and make them something that only the mid to high level alchemists can use, so they can't just sell DC 45 tanglefoot bags or 4d6 alchemist's fire (that they made for free, and will turn back to pumpkins the next day when their craft pool resets...) for quick bucks. (Being able to use one's daily alchemy pool to create daily doses of poison for 'free' that are worth nothing and expire at the end of the day could also be a nice way to avoid the 'I stab him with my wallet and we both feel the pain' aspect of those rules.)


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graystone wrote:
I think with classes, they'll push for popular ones first so I think earlier ones will win out over newer, less accepted, ones in the schedule. Now that might mean a different release than PF1, but I'd be surprised if occult won out over things like the magus.

I think in some cases, a class might be popular but there might not be a clear vision of how to implement it or how it fits with the way PF2 does classes.

Like sure the Oracle and the Witch are going to show up ASAP, but if you want to take your time with the Summoner, aren't sure if a Magus is strictly necessary, are considering that the Inquisitor might be an archetype, not sure if the Gunslinger needs to be combined with some other classes or just a "good with guns" archetype, etc. then why not slide the Occultist, Kineticist, and Medium in there if you have a good idea for how to implement them.

I mean, a certain amount of "popularity" is just familiarity (which corresponds to release order and "how many people have each book"). Like there's no other reason in PF1 the core rogue was a more popular class than the Inquisitor or the Investigator.

But definitely do the Occult classes before the Hybrid ones, many of which might not be needed anymore.


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Yeah, we don't know how classes from PF1 will come back, the core classes have potential to absorb a lot of old classes now, I can see Hunter being absorbed by Ranger, in the last Know Direction might had a hint that vigilante could become a Rogue racket and so on.


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PossibleCabbage wrote:
I think in some cases, a class might be popular but there might not be a clear vision of how to implement it or how it fits with the way PF2 does classes.

*nods* Yeah, that too. And some classes will need some underlying groundwork before they can work, like gunslinger, before you even get to the point of 'is this a class or an archetype or feat chain?'

PossibleCabbage wrote:
then why not slide the Occultist, Kineticist, and Medium in there if you have a good idea for how to implement them.

Oh, I agree. My point was if they had one slot left for a class and everything else was equal, they'd pick the popular older class vs a newer less popular one.

PossibleCabbage wrote:
But definitely do the Occult classes before the Hybrid ones, many of which might not be needed anymore.

I'd be fine with a lot of the hybrids being multiclass now but investigator seems more than their base classed put together at least.

A second issue I see is that there is overlap in the occult with other classes. Psychic/occultist can be folded into wizard/sorcerer with feats/archetypes/school/ect and spiritualist into summoner. Now Medium... that seems like it'll take a lot of work no matter what they do. Mesmerists might work as a rogue archetype [swap sneak attack for hypnotic/painful stare] and add some mesmerist focus spells.


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Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

One more thing I'm looking forward to: watching old rules elements get updated to the new edition.

I can't wait to see what guns get turned into, as well as the entirety of the Technology Guide.

If they do it right, we could see a feasible way to convert Starfinder into PF2 rules.

Oh, and I can't wait to see what kinds of guides, conventions, and house rules the community starts to put together.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

WatersLethe, yes! I forgot about all the talented people who put a lot of work into making the guides. I'm looking forward to seeing how many of them put their writing skills to work making all that interesting and entertaining.


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Gorbacz wrote:
Because the horde of people playing Scottish accent beer-drinking dwarven warriors with names like Thorgrin Ironshield or uppity elven archers with names Sylvadrylliel Moonbow or featureless human fighters named Bob aren't a thing. :)

I can imagine playing Rise of the Runelords with any of those characters. I can’t imagine playing Rise of the Runelords with an archetypical Golarion goblin.


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There's a long list but here's the short one:

- See the new action economy with a plethora of actions to populate the space we hope to see in the release and going forward

- New Skill Feats and the updates they will bring

- The death of the Christmas Tree

- The death of feat taxes

- Ancestries and Ancestry Archetypes that will undoubtedly follow

- The Bard being full occult, absolutely can't wait

- The new Alchemist system, which has a lot of room for interesting play

- Replicating old heroes and new concepts with hopefully a more organic and less "puzzled together" builds

- My wife's Animal Whisperer Bleachling Gnome Rogue which plans to have a naked mole rat Familiar and an underground network of Rat informers in the sewers she communicates with for her criminal activities

I'm totally thinking I might kick the campaign off with like a written letter to all the players with faux-aged paper to kick the thing off. I'm most excited about being able to bring in new players with a lot more ease than the rules of yore.

Silver Crusade

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Midnightoker wrote:
- My wife's Animal Whisperer Bleachling Gnome Rogue which plans to have a naked mole rat Familiar and an underground network of Rat informers in the sewers she communicates with for her criminal activities

Tell her to be careful around Otyugh turf.


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I'm excited for:

As a player, Goblin PCs with developed options, and generally more balanced races.

As a GM, being less dependent on player power level to place challenges.

For the future, aggressive archetyping to reduce class proliferation. Investigator, Gunslinger, Inquisitor... all better done as archetypes than classes.


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I really want to see the other Wizard Thesis, we only know one right now, when the game is released I want to see all the weird titles that people will give for their thesis.

"How Necromancy Affects Early Corpse Decomposition"

"An Exploration of the Interrelationships between Familiars and Masters"

"All the Feels: Sentiment Analysis Between the Enchanter and the Enchanted"


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Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
Midnightoker wrote:


I'm totally thinking I might kick the campaign off with like a written letter to all the players with faux-aged paper to kick the thing off. I'm most excited about being able to bring in new players with a lot more ease than the rules of yore.

I recently did this for my Vampire game, it got my players hyped as hell for it (so hyped they begged and convinced me to start two weeks earlier than I planned) so I think it is deffo worth the effort.


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Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

I'm excited to have more of those "MY character helped this work out" moments, via the 'Follow the Expert' action. It is very easy to imagine a group feeling like they could accomplish something thanks to a specific player.

Things like a dexterous rogue setting a climbing route for the rest of the party, or a powerful fighter helping athletically hoist people over a wall to get into a private Villa, or even a sneaky ranger helping point out the safe places to step while sneaking through a forest.

There is now the possibility of having a concrete and meaningful way to play out all these situations, and I really like that. Mechanically, all you're doing is letting untrained people add their level to a check, but in game your character is giving the whole party the chance to succeed where they wouldn't stand a chance before. Moments like that are what deepens the connections between PCs at a table, and that makes the game worth playing.


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AvalonRellen wrote:

I'm excited to have more of those "MY character helped this work out" moments, via the 'Follow the Expert' action. It is very easy to imagine a group feeling like they could accomplish something thanks to a specific player.

Things like a dexterous rogue setting a climbing route for the rest of the party, or a powerful fighter helping athletically hoist people over a wall to get into a private Villa, or even a sneaky ranger helping point out the safe places to step while sneaking through a forest.

There is now the possibility of having a concrete and meaningful way to play out all these situations, and I really like that. Mechanically, all you're doing is letting untrained people add their level to a check, but in game your character is giving the whole party the chance to succeed where they wouldn't stand a chance before. Moments like that are what deepens the connections between PCs at a table, and that makes the game worth playing.

Pretty sure Climbing is STR based, so it'll be the Fighter again!! Doin' work with skills for once.


Malk_Content wrote:
I recently did this for my Vampire game, it got my players hyped as hell for it (so hyped they begged and convinced me to start two weeks earlier than I planned) so I think it is deffo worth the effort.

Out of curiosity did you warn them it was coming at all? I sort of thought it'd be fun to surprise them with it.

Rysky wrote:
Tell her to be careful around Otyugh turf.

Unlikely, but hey the monsters gotta eat too.


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Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
Midnightoker wrote:
Malk_Content wrote:
I recently did this for my Vampire game, it got my players hyped as hell for it (so hyped they begged and convinced me to start two weeks earlier than I planned) so I think it is deffo worth the effort.

Out of curiosity did you warn them it was coming at all? I sort of thought it'd be fun to surprise them with it.

Out of the blue. One player had to be told because I put it in an envelope with their birthday card (separately sealed) and they wouldn't open it because it wasn't their birthday yet.


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Evan Tarlton wrote:
kaineblade83 wrote:
Barnabas Eckleworth III wrote:
Shisumo wrote:
I'm looking forward to homebrewing an Eberron conversion. The new rules for ancestries are going to make so many things so much easier.
Ahhh. I thought I was the lone one thinking of Eberron campaign uses for PF2.
That makes three of us now, and I can't wait.
Here's number four.

I'm looking forward to trying a couple different non-Golarion campaign settings. Forgotten Realms is one, but also Norrath of EverQuest. The EQRPG did some fun stuff with D20 back in the day, and the setting is amazing. Cabilis and the Iksar alone are going to be worth converting (the very first Ancestry I'm going to homebrew and share on the forums is the Iksar!).

I want to do a very Breath of the Wild-inspired open-world kind of game. Lots of survival, exploration, and noncombat adventuring. Ancient mysteries to uncover, new vistas to find, all of which I plan to grant XP in the form of quest-style rewards. That's the cool part about it being standardized to 1000 XP. It makes this sort of thing easy.

I'm looking forward to creating monsters of all stripes, because I love to do that. Customizing foes is so much fun to tinker with; being able to build NPCs and stuff the same way, if I choose, is so great. I can't wait.

I'm looking forward to skills mattering now. To having stuff to do besides hit things or blast things. To finding a way to immerse my group and I in a fantasy setting and really breathe life into it, but by blending rules with narrative much more seamlessly than before.

Most of all, I'm looking forward to playing Pathfinder 2nd Edition.


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People seem incredibly confident that this edition will be a lot easier to convert / use for homebrew/other settings

This makes me happy as I have a couple of friends who muse about homebrew settings and it might increase my chances of becoming a player (outside of trying to hunt down PFS)


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Rysky wrote:
Midnightoker wrote:
- My wife's Animal Whisperer Bleachling Gnome Rogue which plans to have a naked mole rat Familiar and an underground network of Rat informers in the sewers she communicates with for her criminal activities
Tell her to be careful around Otyugh turf.

Or make friends with the Otyughs. I've become a bit of a fan of friendly PC interactions with Otyughs after running across one selling items in an AP. They are after all intelligent and generally neutral. So there's no reason they should always be hostile. They could be interesting informants too. Strike up a deal to bring them goodies in exchange for info, and any interesting objects they find in the sewers. I'm sure valuable objects occasionally show up down there. All those rings and coins and such that got dropped down a grate.

But being able to talk with rats is also absurdly useful. Particularly with any kind of investigation. Rats are all over the place and see a lot. I'm running an AP now and the Dhampir Paladin has the ability to speak with rats, wolves and bats. He's managed to solve a few things fairly quickly by talking to both a wolf (captive) and rats. He even adopted a rat and took the feat to take it as a familiar.

Extra points for the naked mole rat. Those are some seriously awesome critters.


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Lanathar wrote:
People seem incredibly confident that this edition will be a lot easier to convert / use for homebrew/other settings

I don't know about easier or confident. But I'm definitely giving serious thought to this. Not in a small part due to goblins being core.

Silver Crusade

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Doktor Weasel wrote:
Rysky wrote:
Midnightoker wrote:
- My wife's Animal Whisperer Bleachling Gnome Rogue which plans to have a naked mole rat Familiar and an underground network of Rat informers in the sewers she communicates with for her criminal activities
Tell her to be careful around Otyugh turf.

Or make friends with the Otyughs. I've become a bit of a fan of friendly PC interactions with Otyughs after running across one selling items in an AP. They are after all intelligent and generally neutral. So there's no reason they should always be hostile. They could be interesting informants too. Strike up a deal to bring them goodies in exchange for info, and any interesting objects they find in the sewers. I'm sure valuable objects occasionally show up down there. All those rings and coins and such that got dropped down a grate.

But being able to talk with rats is also absurdly useful. Particularly with any kind of investigation. Rats are all over the place and see a lot. I'm running an AP now and the Dhampir Paladin has the ability to speak with rats, wolves and bats. He's managed to solve a few things fairly quickly by talking to both a wolf (captive) and rats. He even adopted a rat and took the feat to take it as a familiar.

Extra points for the naked mole rat. Those are some seriously awesome critters.

Yeah, I like the sewer doggos a lot ^w^


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Doktor Weasel wrote:

Or make friends with the Otyughs. I've become a bit of a fan of friendly PC interactions with Otyughs after running across one selling items in an AP. They are after all intelligent and generally neutral. So there's no reason they should always be hostile. They could be interesting informants too. Strike up a deal to bring them goodies in exchange for info, and any interesting objects they find in the sewers. I'm sure valuable objects occasionally show up down there. All those rings and coins and such that got dropped down a grate.

But being able to talk with rats is also absurdly useful. Particularly with any kind of investigation. Rats are all over the place and see a lot. I'm running an AP now and the Dhampir Paladin has the ability to speak with rats, wolves and bats. He's managed to solve a few things fairly quickly by talking to both a wolf (captive) and rats. He even adopted a rat and took the feat to take it as a familiar.

Extra points for the naked mole rat. Those are some seriously awesome critters.

That video is hilarious.

I'm not going to lie, this take on Otyughs is something I must have missed.

Rysky wrote:
Yeah, I like the sewer doggos a lot ^w^

Rofl.

Guess I'm going to have to do a few rewrites to the adventure... this is too fun.

Silver Crusade

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Yay! More fun!

I didn't catch the link, all of his videos are awesome.

And so are the sewer doggos ^w^


Not much. It seems like a pretty straight downgrade from 1e across the board, and it's completely incompatible with my homebrew setting.


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Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
sherlock1701 wrote:
Not much. It seems like a pretty straight downgrade from 1e across the board, and it's completely incompatible with my homebrew setting.

There's something funny about this comment. Maybe it's the fact that it obviously misses the point of the thread?

It's like the kid who waits an hour in line at the mall to meet Santa, but when its his turn he says "I don't believe in Santa" and walks away.


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WatersLethe wrote:
sherlock1701 wrote:
Not much. It seems like a pretty straight downgrade from 1e across the board, and it's completely incompatible with my homebrew setting.

There's something funny about this comment. Maybe it's the fact that it obviously misses the point of the thread?

It's like the kid who waits an hour in line at the mall to meet Santa, but when its his turn he says "I don't believe in Santa" and walks away.

And it doesn’t provide any tangible examples or explanations so is not only off topic but immensely unhelpful

Also a very tough argument to make. There may be things to not like about the new editions but labelling a straight downgrade across the board is hyperbole. If nothing else the new action economy and degrees of success are straight improvements (even if you discount the critical hit part , degrees on saves are both more interesting and balanced )


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WatersLethe wrote:
sherlock1701 wrote:
Not much. It seems like a pretty straight downgrade from 1e across the board, and it's completely incompatible with my homebrew setting.

There's something funny about this comment. Maybe it's the fact that it obviously misses the point of the thread?

It's like the kid who waits an hour in line at the mall to meet Santa, but when its his turn he says "I don't believe in Santa" and walks away.

Well, 'not much' IS a valid answer to the question the thread asks. ;)

Lanathar wrote:
There may be things to not like about the new editions but labelling a straight downgrade across the board is hyperbole.

"Seems" makes it an opinion of his: for him it "seems" that way. For him it might be that way, especially if it doesn't work with the game he plays. What you see as "straight improvements" doesn't force others to feel the same or make it true for how they play the game.


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Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
graystone wrote:

Well, 'not much' IS a valid answer to the question the thread asks. ;)

The thread doesn't ask a question though. Someone started saying things they're looking forward too, and others joined in.

Saying you're not looking forward to anything is a bit like going out of your way to go to a wine tasting to tell everyone you don't like wine.


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AFAIK there are no safe spaces on the Paizo forums where only positive opinions are allowed. You could always ask Paizo customer service to consider making them. But complaining about people contributing to a thread is even less constructive then the post you are all complaining about.

[EDIT]FInally if you want to be able to voice your opinions without engaging in a discussion, go make a blog. This is forum where people are permitted to voice their opinions and discuss the topic at hand, which is "things I'm looking forward to".

And just so I'm not accused of being off topic: I'm looking forward to a simpler set of rules then PF1e with more character customisation then D&D 5e has. Ideally in a ruleset that doesn't read or play like D&D 4th ed.


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*scratches head*

(If we are talking about the same thing as your first paragraph seem to defend sherlock’s post whilst the second seems to be an argument against it) :

I think there would have been less complaining if said post had actually explained the negative and engaged with the discussion

Walking in, dropping a bomb and the walking out doesn’t really help anyone. Especially with hyper general comments that could easily be trolling as there is not enough information in them to prove that the poster knows anything about 2E at all

No one is saying negative opinions are not allowed - but substance is appreciated . Otherwise WaterLethe’s metaphors are very much appropriate


Oh and on the third paragraph I agree pretty much word for words including the 4E vibe concerns


WatersLethe wrote:
The thread doesn't ask a question though. Someone started saying things they're looking forward too, and others joined in.

Sure sounds like WaterLethe is advocating that only positive things be said in this thread. AFAIK that isn't how Paizo's forums work.


WatersLethe wrote:


Saying you're not looking forward to anything is a bit like going out of your way to go to a wine tasting to tell everyone you don't like wine.

But how will wine enthusiasts know that beer is obviously the better choice if they aren’t told so?

As for things i’m looking forward to? Persistent Damage. I fell in love with DoT damage after playing Battle Chasers and making a simple DoT build. When i tried to see what i could make in 1e everything i found was negligible due to magic healing. Rogue and Alchemist have some good support for the concept and with the new rules it’s actually viable.

@John Lynch - nobody is saying ‘only good things have to be said’. It’s possible that Sherlock was responding to a question previously said but didn’t mention it in their post; making their post stick out all the more. They are welcome to their opinion and if they don’t find much interesting then sorry to hear. At the very least i’d Suggest they post in the Hombrew Worlds thread where they at least have a welcome opportunity to explain about their Homebrew and why the new edition doesn’t fit as well. Personally that would seem more constructive then posting it here.


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Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

Also, I didn't say you can't say negative things. I just said it's funny, like actually humerous, in this instance.

Like going 'round the table at Thanksgiving and getting to this one guy who throws up his hands and says he's not thankful for anything, harrumph!


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I'm excited to try weird multiclass combos like wizard/ranger that were awful in PF1.


John Lynch 106 wrote:

AFAIK there are no safe spaces on the Paizo forums where only positive opinions are allowed. You could always ask Paizo customer service to consider making them. But complaining about people contributing to a thread is even less constructive then the post you are all complaining about.

[EDIT]FInally if you want to be able to voice your opinions without engaging in a discussion, go make a blog. This is forum where people are permitted to voice their opinions and discuss the topic at hand, which is "things I'm looking forward to".

These comments seem weird next to each other. You talk about how people who don't want to engage should go away right after chastising Wasters for engaging (critically) with a previous poster, who themselves weren't really engaging either.

John Lynch 106 wrote:
Ideally in a ruleset that doesn't read or play like D&D 4th ed.

Nah this is pretty much 4e done up prettier. Spellcasters even get AED mechanics.

Dark Archive

Mechalibur wrote:
I'm excited to try weird multiclass combos like wizard/ranger that were awful in PF1.

Yeah, multiclassing in the 3.0-derived Pathfinder was a bit of a dog (as opposed to 2nd and 1st editions of AD&D, in which is was crazy overpowered, potentially, since am elf with two classes at 8th level had the same exp and was adventuring with a 9th level single-classed human, not that human dual-classing was much better in that respect...).

Dark Archive

Jesikah Morning's Dew wrote:
I'm looking forward to trying a couple different non-Golarion campaign settings. Forgotten Realms is one, but also Norrath of EverQuest. The EQRPG did some fun stuff with D20 back in the day, and the setting is amazing. Cabilis and the Iksar alone are going to be worth converting (the very first Ancestry I'm going to homebrew and share on the forums is the Iksar!).

Norrath could be a very fun game world, with both familiar races (elves, dwarves, halflings) and some funky additions of their own (iksar, erudites, etc.).

About the only quibble I've got with the setting is how many of it's evil gods are gods of stuff that nobody would worship, like fear or hate or disease. (Nobody names a day or month or planet after a Greek or Roman or Norse god of those things! Give me sun gods or war gods or love gods or gods of fate. Some of those can be evil, not gods of bad childish sith lord 'these feelings are bad' reductionist psychology!)

Well, that and running across the Karanas to go hunt in Permafrost as my Ogre, based out of Oggok. Good grief. I quit playing the day I lost my bind in the 'pot room' that allowed me to teleport around the world like a druid. Life's too short to spend a hour in game running across a continent or waiting on a dock for the boat, before getting to adventure. I understood why so many people sat outside capital cities camping the guards, back in the day, because adventuring was so darn inefficient, from a time-management standpoint. :)

One huge bonus to off-line play is having a GM who can skip you past the boring parts and zip right to the fun bits!

Quote:
I'm looking forward to creating monsters of all stripes, because I love to do that. Customizing foes is so much fun to tinker with; being able to build NPCs and stuff the same way, if I choose, is so great. I can't wait.

Something cool about various video games and MMOs is that certain monsters have built in mechanics, that make fighting them a mini-game of it's own, and it would be cool to see more of that. Not just 'these orcs have scales and spiky bits,' but something really mechanically different, even if it's an environmental hazard in which they commonly live, or something like that.

No need to hunt down a specific spell, for instance, to create a monster who is 'shielded' by something being done by sub-monsters that have to be killed first to 'render it vulnerable' to attack. Just 'bang,' new monster ability and run with it. Kill the 'firebringer imps' or their healy flames will keep healing the big bad demon faster than you can damage it. (Or make it chanting cultists and a gateway full of Cthulhu-tentacles, and you can chop away at the tentacles all day, but the cultists chants are keeping the gate open and pulling through more, so the party has to kill the cultists first, and only then can deal with the no-longer-replenishing tentacle beasties. Same mechanic/tactics, different flavor.)


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WatersLethe wrote:
The thread doesn't ask a question though.

Look at the thread title once... Do you think it's out of place to reply to a thread about what someone is looking forward to, with what you are looking forward to? So it's an implied question unless the intent is we are to strictly limit ourselves to what the OP was looking forward to and IMO it doesn't seem that way.

Secondly, if you don't think a post isn't productive, the last thing you should do is give it oxygen to burn brighter: flag and/or ignore doesn't spread around what you deem unproductive.

WatersLethe wrote:
Saying you're not looking forward to anything is a bit like going out of your way to go to a wine tasting to tell everyone you don't like wine.

More like he came in, said he liked the wine before they made changes in it and that it no longer paired well with his meals that he's already planned out. Chiding at him as he walks out the door doesn't make the wine taste any better does it?

Lastly, to stay on topic: I can't really say that there is anything I'm looking forward to. IMO it's too early for that because I haven't seen the base rules and how everything shakes out. It's hard to think about what to add on to a base you haven't seen yet.

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