[PaizoCon] The Preview Banquet


Pathfinder Second Edition General Discussion

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If I were a lich I might wear a shaped breastplate to avoid being misgendered, since that must get old real quick.


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WatersLethe wrote:
If I were a lich I might wear a shaped breastplate to avoid being misgendered, since that must get old real quick.

I'm thinking most liches have bigger fish to fry, but that would be a neat quirk for a lich - to be extremely self-conscious about its gender expression.


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Desna's Avatar wrote:
WatersLethe wrote:
If I were a lich I might wear a shaped breastplate to avoid being misgendered, since that must get old real quick.
I'm thinking most liches have bigger fish to fry, but that would be a neat quirk for a lich - to be extremely self-conscious about its gender expression.

With unlimited age, they can acquire a lot of quirks. Reminds me of a story I heard at a convention about an old school D&D game where the PCs explored the tomb of a clean-freak lich. He had skeletons going around dusting and mopping the floors and such. The funnier part of the story was when they found a small closet with brooms, buckets, mops, rags and a bottle of some liquid. A player was convinced that the bottle was a potion.

Player: "I take out the stopper and sniff it."
GM: "It smells like ammonia."
Player: "I taste it."
GM: "It burns your tounge, it's terrible. Tastes like ammonia."
Player: "I chug the whole thing!"
GM: "..."
Meanwhile the lich is scrying the whole scene "They drank my ammonia?"

/sidetrack


Alternatively, the lich slew a female hero, realised her armour was better than anything else he owned, but either lacked the crafting skill to reshape it, or more-likely; didn't care about what it looked like.


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FedoraFerret wrote:
Women can become liches too, Staffan.

Sure, but look at the lich's face. The lich in question has either decomposed enough to become skeletal, or is dessicated enough that they're just skin and bones. There shouldn't be any breasts left.

Silver Crusade

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Still better fashion choice than black t-shirt + utilikilt.


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I feel like since it's real hard to tell the difference between a man's skeleton and a woman's skeleton, a lady lich might have to take exceptional steps to express her femininity. I mean, you can put on a dress but that's basically what wizard robes are anyway (you're probably not going to go sleeveless when your arms are literally just bones regardless.)

Like this might be the one case where boobplate isn't completely absurd.

Silver Crusade

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Staffan Johansson wrote:
FedoraFerret wrote:
Women can become liches too, Staffan.
Sure, but look at the lich's face. The lich in question has either decomposed enough to become skeletal, or is dessicated enough that they're just skin and bones. There shouldn't be any breasts left.

Which would have absolutely no bearing on the metal breastplate.


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Spellmonger wrote:
Staffan Johansson wrote:

What I want to know is why the lich in the bestiary has boobs.

Because that is what a breastplate worn by a lich looks like...?

Wait... that's supposed to be armor, not clothing? Even less reason, then. Boob plate is inherently a bad idea, and I was hoping Pathfinder art had moved away from such silliness.

I mean, I'm not opposed to art showing cleavage on the right characters, but preferably not ones who are supposed to be armored. Save that for Seoni and Seltyiel, not Seelah.


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Staffan Johansson wrote:
Spellmonger wrote:
Staffan Johansson wrote:

What I want to know is why the lich in the bestiary has boobs.

Because that is what a breastplate worn by a lich looks like...?

Wait... that's supposed to be armor, not clothing? Even less reason, then. Boob plate is inherently a bad idea, and I was hoping Pathfinder art had moved away from such silliness.

I mean, I'm not opposed to art showing cleavage on the right characters, but preferably not ones who are supposed to be armored. Save that for Seoni and Seltyiel, not Seelah.

Maybe it's a statement of superiority. "Ha! I'm undead, I don't have vital organs. I CAN wear a boob-plate and get away with it!!!"

Silver Crusade

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Staffan Johansson wrote:
Boob plate is inherently a bad idea,
This we agree on.
PossibleCabbage wrote:
a lady lich might have to take exceptional steps to express her femininity.

On the one head I can see that, on the other it's still boobplate.

*shrugs*

I wonder if we're finally gonna get that Liches pinup calendar Jason has been pushing for?


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Didn't we JUST go through this in the other thread that veered wildly off topic?

Liberty's Edge

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I'm pretty sure that's clothing rather than armor (or at least stylized armor not intended to actually protect). Relevant gear is listed on Bestiary entries and the Lich has no armor listed.


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So it's a shiny corset?
Liches pinup calendar confirmed...

Silver Crusade

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Deadmanwalking wrote:
I'm pretty sure that's clothing rather than armor (or at least stylized armor not intended to actually protect). Relevant gear is listed on Bestiary entries and the Lich has no armor listed.

Or a simple art miscommunication, which has been known to happen. Nothing major in this piece all things considered.

Back to yours I'd lean towards stylized , with the shoulder and neck pieces.


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Rysky wrote:
Deadmanwalking wrote:
I'm pretty sure that's clothing rather than armor (or at least stylized armor not intended to actually protect). Relevant gear is listed on Bestiary entries and the Lich has no armor listed.

Or a simple art miscommunication, which has been known to happen. Nothing major in this piece all things considered.

Back to yours I'd lean towards stylized , with the shoulder and neck pieces.

Wayne Reynolds said he drew the iconic Oracle before it was decided she wore a breastplate. I imagine they may have been considering a different mystery or revelation for her since many of them allowed you to replace armor.

Dark Archive

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Checking all the pics in google drive, there is another(not undead featuring) pic where boobplate is depicted. Sooo yeah, that type of art will still be a thing :(

Silver Crusade

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The usual problem: you write a brief that says "female, armoured, no boobplate", the artist turns in one with a boobplate, there's no time to order new art and even if there was, art is expensive as hell.

Paizo ran into the same problem with "OUR ELVES HAVE SPOOKY EYES, SEE REFERENCE" and "OUR GNOMES ARE WEIRDER" multiple times over, not to mention the "PLEASE DRAW A NORMAL WOMAN/MAN, NOT SOME IDEALIZED STATUE" briefs many times before. It's something you gotta live with, especially if you have "GenCon or bust" deadline for the book.

Silver Crusade

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Gorbacz wrote:
The usual problem: you write a brief that says "female, armoured, no boobplate", the artist turns in one with a boobplate, there's no time to order new art and even if there was, art is expensive as hell.

This is when you break out the bolding and underlining.

And a stapler.


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Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

I remember similar things to what Gorbacz mentions happening with the Exalted 3rd Edition art, which got talked about on the forums a lot there. One thing brought up is how hard it can be for certain artists to get past their internal bias.

I seem to remember someone (I don't remember if it was there or here) sharing a story about making an artist request for a picture of a group of "elves; variety of different races/skin tones", and the majority of the submissions having like, green or blue-skinned elves alongside Caucasian-looking elves, but no African-looking elves or any other realistic skin tones except white.

So I can definitely see "artist thinks boob plate is how armored women look, submits that despite specifications to the contrary" being a thing.

Silver Crusade

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Rysky wrote:
Gorbacz wrote:
The usual problem: you write a brief that says "female, armoured, no boobplate", the artist turns in one with a boobplate, there's no time to order new art and even if there was, art is expensive as hell.

This is when you break out the bolding and underlining.

And a stapler.

Well, if your artists is from Indonesia or Bulgaria (spoiler alert: both have highly competitive fantasy art freelancers who charge just enough less than US/CAN folks to grab a lot of orders), make sure you label them correctly.

I can help you with the Cyrillic in case of Bulgarians.

Silver Crusade

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Gorbacz wrote:
Rysky wrote:
Gorbacz wrote:
The usual problem: you write a brief that says "female, armoured, no boobplate", the artist turns in one with a boobplate, there's no time to order new art and even if there was, art is expensive as hell.

This is when you break out the bolding and underlining.

And a stapler.

Well, if your artists is from Indonesia or Bulgaria (spoiler alert: both have highly competitive fantasy art freelancers who charge just enough less than US/CAN folks to grab a lot of orders), make sure you label them correctly.

I can help you with the Cyrillic in case of Bulgarians.

I hadn't even considering labeling, but I'll keep that in mind.

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