Iron out a dragon disciple build


Advice


Hey guys I've come across information to make a DD build. With multiple sources I came up with sorc4/ paladin divine hunter2/ scaled fist unchained monk1/ dragon disciple8/ eldritch knight5. I'd like opinions and do's and don'ts for this. I'm having issues in figuring out whether to use weapons or natural attacks for this. I was considering heavy on melee with magic to back me up to buff and from time to time blow stuff up. Pathfinder only no 3rd party. We rolled stats 16 16 15 15 13 13. I appreciate the Info ahead of time.


What level are you starting/finishing at?

Grand Lodge

Wow those are good rolls. It equates to a 40 point buy. You want to prioritize Str and Cha, so put your 16s there. Supplement them with a race that has both Cha and Str as racial bonuses - Angelkin Aasimar, Dual Talent human, Nagaji, Kindred-Raised half-elf, Suli, or Pitborn Tiefling all work.
Throw your 15s on Dex and Con and 13s in Int and Wis.

You don't gain too much after 4th level of Dragon Disciple and unless you're playing in a seriously tough campaign you honestly don't need any more ability boosts than what you're getting through 4 levels. Unless you REALLY want 1/day form of the dragon I, I just don't think it's worthwhile. You're already giving up so many spellcasting levels. Personally I say you just go right into Eldritch Knight after 4 levels, and skip the monk level too, putting another level in Eldritch Knight, for a total spread of Sorc 4/Paladin 2/D.D 4/EK 10. That way you're at 16 spellcasting levels by 20th, as opposed to just 14 spellcasting levels. Just barely able to cast 8th level spell. As nice as having Cha to AC is, you're better off using Mirror Image, Displacement, and other buff spells to mitigate damage rather than AC. If you're really set on Monk, consider dropping the two levels of Paladin and instead go for a 5th level of Sorcerer. *edit*You still need full martial weapon prof, though, so maybe just 1 paladin/1 monk. You're dipping that for your saves, but 1) You'll have decent saves already thanks to Sorc and D.D shoring up Will and Monk/E.K with Fort and Ref and 2) as long as you are good aligned, you can purchase scrolls of Bestow Grace to benefit from cha-to-saves for a few minutes whenever you need to buff. You just need decent UMD for that.

I'd stick with using a manufactured weapon as your primary weapon of choice, but it's always handy to have natural weapons as a backup. With the Sorc 4/Pal 2/ DD 4/ EK 10 you're at 17 BAB, which is not bad at all.

I'd also pick up Quicken spell in order to swift action buff some low-level stuff, like mirror image, if you plan on going right into combat. Empower Spell is nice for Fireballs and Spell Focus (evocation) helps make targets fail more often. Power Attack is a must have, of course, and Spell Penetration helps make up for lost caster levels for SR.


MrCharisma wrote:
What level are you starting/finishing at?

This is a backup we are 4 right now never went to 20 but that is always the goal.


Syries wrote:

Wow those are good rolls. It equates to a 40 point buy. You want to prioritize Str and Cha, so put your 16s there. Supplement them with a race that has both Cha and Str as racial bonuses - Angelkin Aasimar, Dual Talent human, Nagaji, Kindred-Raised half-elf, Suli, or Pitborn Tiefling all work.

Throw your 15s on Dex and Con and 13s in Int and Wis.

You don't gain too much after 4th level of Dragon Disciple and unless you're playing in a seriously tough campaign you honestly don't need any more ability boosts than what you're getting through 4 levels. Unless you REALLY want 1/day form of the dragon I, I just don't think it's worthwhile. You're already giving up so many spellcasting levels. Personally I say you just go right into Eldritch Knight after 4 levels, and skip the monk level too, putting another level in Eldritch Knight, for a total spread of Sorc 4/Paladin 2/D.D 4/EK 10. That way you're at 16 spellcasting levels by 20th, as opposed to just 14 spellcasting levels. Just barely able to cast 8th level spell. As nice as having Cha to AC is, you're better off using Mirror Image, Displacement, and other buff spells to mitigate damage rather than AC. If you're really set on Monk, consider dropping the two levels of Paladin and instead go for a 5th level of Sorcerer. *edit*You still need full martial weapon prof, though, so maybe just 1 paladin/1 monk. You're dipping that for your saves, but 1) You'll have decent saves already thanks to Sorc and D.D shoring up Will and Monk/E.K with Fort and Ref and 2) as long as you are good aligned, you can purchase scrolls of Bestow Grace to benefit from cha-to-saves for a few minutes whenever you need to buff. You just need decent UMD for that.

I'd stick with using a manufactured weapon as your primary weapon of choice, but it's always handy to have natural weapons as a backup. With the Sorc 4/Pal 2/ DD 4/ EK 10 you're at 17 BAB, which is not bad at all.

I'd also pick up Quicken spell in order to swift action buff some low-level stuff, like mirror image, if...

I was considering prestigious spellcaster I think that's what it's called to off set prestige class loss of spell casting and also considering magical knack trait I think it's called to offset more loss.


If you play in a setting with spellcaster guilds (such as Golarion), you might also be able to get the full casting progression (CL plus spells per day and spells known) of 3 additional sorcerer levels via Esoteric Training achieved at 35 Fame (see Inner Sea Magic). Which costs a tiny amount of gp and a bit of downtime investment, but is pretty easy to achieve in most Golarion guilds (and likely most games including those guilds).

Also, if you want to focus heavily on the melee side, I recommend you enter DD through bloodrager levels instead. This may grant you more gish-focused abilities and plenty of melee power.

Regarding the weapon vs natural attack question, the answer depends on the power level of your game and of course what you're trying to achieve. From a pure optimization perspective, if you're simply looking to maximize your DPR nothing beats a natural attack supercharger, but if you're looking to focus on control and party defense you'll want a reach weapon and likely invest in for example dirty trick combos.


Your build looks similar to mine, though I prefer going for all 10 levels of Dragon Disciple.
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Stats: We want charisma really high, dexterity really high, strength and constitution decently high, and Int/Wisdom are stats we can safely keep low. I prefer to have higher Intelligence than Wisdom on this character, as our Will Save will be swole, but its up to you. If I was going to spitball, 13, 18, 14, 10, 7, 18 for a 25 point buy if you are going Aasimar (Plumekin) or 13, 18, 14, 10, 7, 16 if you are going human. The extra bit of Dexterity is going to help us a ton early on.

First level is a level in Sorcerer, used to make it our favored class (we want this for endgame if we go human). We grab our basic kit, Shield, Expeditious Retreat/Enlarge Person, and the Cantrip associated with our Draconic bloodline (Ice, Acid, or Electricity are best because it lets us use our cantrip in place of our crossbow and do better with it most of the time). We want Weapon Finesse as our feat so we can rely on our dexterity to carry our attack rolls for a while.

Second level is Scaled Fist Monk, we grab Dragon Style because its hysterical later on. Now we can flurry of blows, and we're damn hard to hit.

Third and Fourth levels are Divine Hunter Paladin, we want our Divine Grace, a few uses of Lay on Hands to sustain us, and cheating Precise Shot as a bonus feat is just the icing on the g+@$#$n cake. Our 3rd level feat is free, so pick up something fun. Use this feat to grab Favored Prestige Class.

Fifth Level is tricky one because can't become a Dragon Disciple until 6th level at the earliest and its a bit better to time it as our 7th level. This is why I actually have come to like a second level of Monk, it gives us a Bonus Feat, some more BAB, and Evasion which will come in handy later on down the line. We grab Dragon Ferocity so our punches will hit like bricks.

Sixth level is a Sorcerer level, it feels kinda bad as we could go into Dragon Disciple right here but timing our presteige into DD at level 7 makes our feats like up better. This level is pretty dead, it'll feel bad to play but it makes the next level amazing.

Seventh level is Dragon Disciple 1 and its amazing. We get Mage Armor online, our armor and energy resistance go up, we take prestigious spellcaster and are suddenly in business. Our "dead" levels of Sorcerer at 11 and 15 now line up perfectly with levels at which we acquire feats. This means that we get 10 caster levels out of Dragon Disciple without ever experiencing a weird lopsided progression.

This progresses us all the way to Level 16 just building up Dragon Disciple. If we took Magical Knack way back when then our Caster Level is now 14 and our BAB is +12. Our Bloodline is at level 12, and frankly at this point we want more Bloodline and Spell Progression. Another 4 levels of Sorcerer to finish our career to level 20 give us a BAB of +14 (1 short of a full 3/4th caster) and a whopping 18 levels of sorcerous spellcasting (albiet only 16 levels of Sorcerous spell choices). This means we trade 1 BAB for 2 levels of spellcasting, HOT DAMN. Additionally, this is where being a human REALLY shines through, as we use our Favored Class Bonus on these last 4 levels to grab extra spells giving us +1 5th, +2 6th, and +2 7th level spells learned ontop of what we should normally possess.


ShroudedInLight wrote:

Your build looks similar to mine, though I prefer going for all 10 levels of Dragon Disciple.

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Stats: We want charisma really high, dexterity really high, strength and constitution decently high, and Int/Wisdom are stats we can safely keep low. I prefer to have higher Intelligence than Wisdom on this character, as our Will Save will be swole, but its up to you. If I was going to spitball, 13, 18, 14, 10, 7, 18 for a 25 point buy if you are going Aasimar (Plumekin) or 13, 18, 14, 10, 7, 16 if you are going human. The extra bit of Dexterity is going to help us a ton early on.

First level is a level in Sorcerer, used to make it our favored class (we want this for endgame if we go human). We grab our basic kit, Shield, Expeditious Retreat/Enlarge Person, and the Cantrip associated with our Draconic bloodline (Ice, Acid, or Electricity are best because it lets us use our cantrip in place of our crossbow and do better with it most of the time). We want Weapon Finesse as our feat so we can rely on our dexterity to carry our attack rolls for a while.

Second level is Scaled Fist Monk, we grab Dragon Style because its hysterical later on. Now we can flurry of blows, and we're damn hard to hit.

Third and Fourth levels are Divine Hunter Paladin, we want our Divine Grace, a few uses of Lay on Hands to sustain us, and cheating Precise Shot as a bonus feat is just the icing on the g~!@#$n cake. Our 3rd level feat is free, so pick up something fun. Use this feat to grab Favored Prestige Class.

Fifth Level is tricky one because can't become a Dragon Disciple until 6th level at the earliest and its a bit better to time it as our 7th level. This is why I actually have come to like a second level of Monk, it gives us a Bonus Feat, some more BAB, and Evasion which will come in handy later on down the line. We grab Dragon Ferocity so our punches will hit like bricks.

Sixth level is a Sorcerer level, it feels kinda bad as we could go into Dragon Disciple right here but timing our presteige into DD at...

So did you not think about eldritch knight or is that really a bad idea bc of the loss of bloodline progression?

Grand Lodge

Given the features of respectively Dragon Disciple and Eldritch Knight, the latter don't bring enough to justify the inclusion in the concept. The last levels of DD would give better features, while there would be nothing to lose putting the remaining levels on Sorcerer. It would mean less hp, but better will saves, and more spell slots/levels.


It might help to know why you wanted to quit Dragon disciple at 8. Level 9 gives you wings, which is just convenient, but level 10 gives you a stronger dragon form and the ability to use it twice per day. I guess if you were going with a weapon build, then the improved dragon wouldn't be as big of a deal, but if you are going with a natural weapons build, it's a pretty big upgrade.


Melkiador wrote:
It might help to know why you wanted to quit Dragon disciple at 8. Level 9 gives you wings, which is just convenient, but level 10 gives you a stronger dragon form and the ability to use it twice per day. I guess if you were going with a weapon build, then the improved dragon wouldn't be as big of a deal, but if you are going with a natural weapons build, it's a pretty big upgrade.

This was all based on information I found and alot of people say either go 4dd or 8dd never 10. I was confused for a while bc of the wings and more beafy dragoness.


The reason why most folks saay dd8 not 10. Is because if you are pure sorcerer, and do dd8 sorc 12. You still get lv 9 spells which is quite a power house. But you are already dipping 3 levels in not casters. So thats out the window anyway. So you might as well maximize the DD's benefits and the dragon durability factors.

I haven't built a DD for a while. but my favorite is still a Dex based Sorc+Full DD. but I haven't built one since some great combinations came out. Still my favorite prestige or multiclass optioni n the game.

These days I might go with an inspired swash buckler dip. For a dex based rapier that I use for defense some defense. Hard to pass up 2paly nd that new scaled though yup... I might need to build another now.
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skimmed and didn't see this question but

What do you want out of the DD?

Are you wanting a caster who can fight. or a fighter who can cast?
or are you wanting a monster of a dragon with some magic?

In general I thinnk I'd skip Eld Knight. You're already losing 3 caster level/ spell levels. So you won't really be relying on DC based spells. I'd opt for more DD. and basically form a Breath of Fire style character.
Focus on direct damage no DC attack spells, buffs (that you or your team mates like), or ultility spells (a bit more awkward for sorcerers's limited spell list but it never bothered me).

So ultimately.. What would you like to do as a DD?
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Its not just the combat bonuses and HP you get from going to DD10, or the extra 30ft flight/+2 AC/Bloodline Feat/2 free bloodline spells from progressing your bloodline, and its not even the favored class bonus handing you four free high level spells known. Instead, going EK means you never learn 8th level spellcasting because you sacrifice a level of spellcasting upon entering the class. That is the real reason I'd suggest avoiding EK. In exchange all you get is a little bit of extra HP, +2 BAB, and an additional iterative attack you'll never use because at max level you'll spend every single fight as a Dragon.

If you really want to go for the Spellblade aspect of being an Eldritch Knight with the might of a Dragon Disciple, you're better off going as an Eldritch Scion Magus. Lots of viable builds there, including just going straight ESM 10/DD 10 which leaves you with 14 BAB and 6th level spellcasting instead of 8th level spellcasting. The benefits include, however, gaining access to wearing armor while spellcasting, the ability to take Mage Armor at level 1 without regrets, and being able to channel magical energy through your natural attacks for some sick damage (take Natural Spell Combat with claws as your selected weapons so you can still spell combat as a dragon). Part of the capstone is wasted, sadly as you will already possess blindsense 60ft by then. Losing spell levels hurts the magus more than the sorcerer, interestingly, but you can still dip around if you care to do so. My advice, if you dip at all, is the Two Level Dip.

The Two Level Dip:
- The Two Level Dip costs the magus 0 spell casting levels with Magical Knack BUT does cost them two levels of spell slots, a Magus Arcana, 1 point from our Eldritch Pool, and counting as a 5th level Fighter for feats. What we gain from this dip is increased tankyness with two levels of Paladin to get Divine Grace, Lay on Hands, and Smite Evil. We can cast spells in light armor so being a Monk is kinda meh. Since we are a Magus, we specialize in touch spells and can skip out on Precise Shot so we can choose a Paladin Archetype other than Divine Hunter though its still probably the best one around.


Zwordsman wrote:

The reason why most folks saay dd8 not 10. Is because if you are pure sorcerer, and do dd8 sorc 12. You still get lv 9 spells which is quite a power house. But you are already dipping 3 levels in not casters. So thats out the window anyway. So you might as well maximize the DD's benefits and the dragon durability factors.

I haven't built a DD for a while. but my favorite is still a Dex based Sorc+Full DD. but I haven't built one since some great combinations came out. Still my favorite prestige or multiclass optioni n the game.

These days I might go with an inspired swash buckler dip. For a dex based rapier that I use for defense some defense. Hard to pass up 2paly nd that new scaled though yup... I might need to build another now.
-----
skimmed and didn't see this question but

What do you want out of the DD?

Are you wanting a caster who can fight. or a fighter who can cast?
or are you wanting a monster of a dragon with some magic?

In general I thinnk I'd skip Eld Knight. You're already losing 3 caster level/ spell levels. So you won't really be relying on DC based spells. I'd opt for more DD. and basically form a Breath of Fire style character.
Focus on direct damage no DC attack spells, buffs (that you or your team mates like), or ultility spells (a bit more awkward for sorcerers's limited spell list but it never bothered me).

So ultimately.. What would you like to do as a DD?
------

I want to be a brick sh*& house a beastly dragon who if needs to cast buff spells for himself or blow stuff up pending on the situation.


Ok, I'm going to approach this a bit different. If I am building a DD, I want to get as much dragon as possible. So I would minimize even slight dips into non-bloodline classes. I also wouldn't really even consider being a weapon using build. Your a dragon. Dragons fight with claws, teeth, and magic. Period.

First, a question for your GM. If a PC is draconic bloodrager and draconic sorcerer (they are required to be the same), will DD advance the bloodline for both? RAW isn't completely clear. The GM's I've talked to and the forums seem 70/30 split. With most saying yes.

Second, another question for your GM. Same question about the Robe of Arcane Heritage.

If your GM says yes, then start with at least 1 level of rageshaper draconic bloodrager.

Even if your GM says no to either or both, consider starting with a level of bloodrager. The BaB, hit points, rage, and extra rounds of claws really help you survive and function in the low levels. Plus you will eventually be a raging dragon in combat!

There are 2 ways to do this.

Switch hitter using both spells and melee as appropriate. For this you take 1 level of bloodrager, 4 sorcerer, 10 DD, then the final 5 sorcerer.

Really just a melee machine with the spell casting is mostly just for buffs. This is 4 levels of bloodrager, 1 sorcerer, 10 lDD, then the final 5 bloodrager.


I am also seeing that dragon style feat chain is an ideal grab for this build. Would I just be using unarmed attacks in conjunction with my natural attacks?


ShroudedInLight wrote:

...

First level is a level in Sorcerer, used to make it our favored class ...

I can't remember ever seeing a requirement that your first level has to be your favored class. If it is true, could you tell me where it says that?


ElterAgo wrote:
ShroudedInLight wrote:

...

First level is a level in Sorcerer, used to make it our favored class ...
I can't remember ever seeing a requirement that your first level has to be your favored class. If it is true, could you tell me where it says that?

Sure I...oh, thats crazy. I thought...well, neato. Good to know you can just declare any class your favored class even without a level in it, which seems weird. Guess its like a wish fullfillment thing where little elves dream of being a Wizard when the grow up even when they spend their first few levels into Rogue.

benwin007 wrote:
I want to be a brick sh*& house a beastly dragon who if needs to cast buff spells for himself or blow stuff up pending on the situation.

Yeah, I suggest the Eldritch Scion route then. Just straight ES 6/Dragon Disciple 10 (Again, make sure to enter Dragon Disciple at level 7 so we keep our progression steady) is plenty of murder potential with a minimum of dips. Just straight dragon goodness. Grab Natural Spell Combat as your Arcana at level 3 to ensure you can use your claws to deliver spells and go to town.


ElterAgo wrote:
ShroudedInLight wrote:

...

First level is a level in Sorcerer, used to make it our favored class ...
I can't remember ever seeing a requirement that your first level has to be your favored class. If it is true, could you tell me where it says that?

I feel like that was kind of a thing in 3.0, but back then favored class had something to do with multiclassing. Pathfinder didn’t inherit that.


ShroudedInLight wrote:
ElterAgo wrote:
ShroudedInLight wrote:

...

First level is a level in Sorcerer, used to make it our favored class ...
I can't remember ever seeing a requirement that your first level has to be your favored class. If it is true, could you tell me where it says that?

Sure I...oh, thats crazy. I thought...well, neato. Good to know you can just declare any class your favored class even without a level in it, which seems weird. Guess its like a wish fullfillment thing where little elves dream of being a Wizard when the grow up even when they spend their first few levels into Rogue.

benwin007 wrote:
I want to be a brick sh*& house a beastly dragon who if needs to cast buff spells for himself or blow stuff up pending on the situation.
Yeah, I suggest the Eldritch Scion route then. Just straight ES 6/Dragon Disciple 10 (Again, make sure to enter Dragon Disciple at level 7 so we keep our progression steady) is plenty of murder potential with a minimum of dips. Just straight dragon goodness. Grab Natural Spell Combat as your Arcana at level 3 to ensure you can use your claws to deliver spells and go to town.

I've never played a magus before do you really need to stay that class? Or is dipping in pally for saves and bab and monk for feats and bab a bad idea still?


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Maps, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

Don't forget the Favored Prestige Class and Prestigious Spellcaster feats if you want to boost your spellcasting ability. For four feats, you can take all 10 levels of Dragon Disciple without losing any spellcasting ability (as each instance of Prestigious Spellcaster negates one level lost to a lack of "+1 level of existing class" in the Dragon Disciple progression.


Sure, a Magus is pretty easy to understand. Their main gimmick is that they are basically spellswords. They can wear armor, cast spells, and channel their spells through their melee attacks. The Magus has better BAB growth, so we don't need to dip to boost our chance to hit, Magus has more HP than a sorcerer so again we don't need to boost it, the magus can cast spells while wearing armor so we don't need to take levels of Monk, and the Magus relies heavily on its spells to augments its melee damage so we want as many spellslots as we can get our hands on.

The short answer is: No, we don't really want to dip. We do not gain nearly as much from doing so as the Sorcerer build.


ShroudedInLight wrote:

Sure, a Magus is pretty easy to understand. Their main gimmick is that they are basically spellswords. They can wear armor, cast spells, and channel their spells through their melee attacks. The Magus has better BAB growth, so we don't need to dip to boost our chance to hit, Magus has more HP than a sorcerer so again we don't need to boost it, the magus can cast spells while wearing armor so we don't need to take levels of Monk, and the Magus relies heavily on its spells to augments its melee damage so we want as many spellslots as we can get our hands on.

The short answer is: No, we don't really want to dip. We do not gain nearly as much from doing so as the Sorcerer build.

If going with magus how would we go about it? Sword or natural attack or both? Consider dragon style? Or focus on spell DC and weapon feats?


You probably want to skip dragon style since we don't get unarmed strike naturally. Whether you want to go claw or blade is up to you (though if you were running this guy from level 1 you'd have to use a blade for the first 3 levels) but I'm going to build for claws. After all, you said you wanted to go full dragon and what kind of dragon relies on their Sword (except as a handy backup weapon).

As far as feats go, I'd suggest investing in Combat Casting and Intensified Spell to pair with Shocking Grasp once you have access to 2nd level spells (If we forgo any dips we can take the Magical Lineage trait and be casting Intensified Shocking Grasps as level 1 spells which is PRETTY GOOD). We unfortunately need to invest into Intensified Spell earlier than we would like, but thats life.

As far as Magus Arcana, our level 3 Arcana is Natural Spell Combat and then it gets tricky. See, we need to take Natural Spell Combat with every type of Natural Attack we want to attack with during spell combat. Since our goal is to eventually be casting Form of the Dragon 2 and stomping on people, we need to select Natural Spell Combat a lot. We nearly manage to keep pace, we get to incorporate our Bite Attack at the same level we get it from Dragon Disciple, same with the Wings, but sadly we lose out on Spellcombat Full Attacks with a tail for 1 level.

This leaves us with a 19th level feat and the 19th level Magus Arcana to choose (alongside an extra level 1 feat if you go Human).

Magus 1-6/Dragon Disciple 7-16/Magus 17-20
Trait:
Magical Lineage: Shocking Grasp
1: Combat Casting
3: Favored Prestige Class: Dragon Disciple
5: Intensified Spell
7: Prestigious Spellcaster
9: Extra Magus Arcana (Natural Spell Combat: Bite)
11: Prestigious Spellcaster
13: Extra Magus Arcana (Natural Spell Combat: Wings)
15: Prestigious Spellcaster
17: Extra Magus Arcana (Natural Spell Combat: Tail Swipe)
19

Magus Arcana:
3: Natural Spell Combat: Claw
6: Close Range
19:

End Result: At 17th level we morph into a Dragon as a SWIFT ACTION (basically, Quickened Form of the Dragon 2) and make a full attack w/ Claw, Bite, Wing, Wing, Tail + casting a free spell. If our spell is a touch attack, we get to make a free Bite. If we took Close Range as our 6th level Magus Arcana (which we damn well should, all the good high level spells are ranged touch attacks) then we get to do silly things at this point like delivering Disintegrate with the same round as our attack pattern. Along the way we got +10 Strength from Dragon Disciple and Form of the Dragon so we hit like a g~++~&n bus.


ShroudedInLight wrote:

You probably want to skip dragon style since we don't get unarmed strike naturally. Whether you want to go claw or blade is up to you (though if you were running this guy from level 1 you'd have to use a blade for the first 3 levels) but I'm going to build for claws. After all, you said you wanted to go full dragon and what kind of dragon relies on their Sword (except as a handy backup weapon).

As far as feats go, I'd suggest investing in Combat Casting and Intensified Spell to pair with Shocking Grasp once you have access to 2nd level spells (If we forgo any dips we can take the Magical Lineage trait and be casting Intensified Shocking Grasps as level 1 spells which is PRETTY GOOD). We unfortunately need to invest into Intensified Spell earlier than we would like, but thats life.

As far as Magus Arcana, our level 3 Arcana is Natural Spell Combat and then it gets tricky. See, we need to take Natural Spell Combat with every type of Natural Attack we want to attack with during spell combat. Since our goal is to eventually be casting Form of the Dragon 2 and stomping on people, we need to select Natural Spell Combat a lot. We nearly manage to keep pace, we get to incorporate our Bite Attack at the same level we get it from Dragon Disciple, same with the Wings, but sadly we lose out on Spellcombat Full Attacks with a tail for 1 level.

This leaves us with a 19th level feat and the 19th level Magus Arcana to choose (alongside an extra level 1 feat if you go Human).

Magus 1-6/Dragon Disciple 7-16/Magus 17-20
Trait:
Magical Lineage: Shocking Grasp
1: Combat Casting
3: Favored Prestige Class: Dragon Disciple
5: Intensified Spell
7: Prestigious Spellcaster
9: Extra Magus Arcana (Natural Spell Combat: Bite)
11: Prestigious Spellcaster
13: Extra Magus Arcana (Natural Spell Combat: Wings)
15: Prestigious Spellcaster
17: Extra Magus Arcana (Natural Spell Combat: Tail Swipe)
19

Magus Arcana:
3: Natural Spell Combat: Claw
6: Close Range
19:

End Result: At 17th level we morph into a Dragon...

Why nature spell all natural attacks? Wouldn't you just need to be able to do it to one natural attack? What do you know that I don't?


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Quote:
Each time he selects this arcana, he selects another natural weapon. For example, a magus could select this arcana twice, choosing claw attacks and bite attacks. This would allow him to use a full-round action to make all of his claw attacks with his free hand and all of his bite attacks in addition to casting a spell.


benwin007 wrote:
Why nature spell all natural attacks? Wouldn't you just need to be able to do it to one natural attack? What do you know that I don't?
ShroudedInLight wrote:
See, we need to take Natural Spell Combat with every type of Natural Attack we want to attack with during spell combat. Since our goal is to eventually be casting Form of the Dragon 2 and stomping on people, we need to select Natural Spell Combat a lot.
Melkiador wrote:
Natural Spell Combat wrote:
Each time he selects this arcana, he selects another natural weapon. For example, a magus could select this arcana twice, choosing claw attacks and bite attacks. This would allow him to use a full-round action to make all of his claw attacks with his free hand and all of his bite attacks in addition to casting a spell.

To put it simply, if we want to full attack as a Dragon with Claw, Bite, Bite w/Touch Spell attached, Wing, Wing, Tailslap then we need to take Natural Spell Combat a lot.

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