I understand that when a summoned monster is reduced to 0 hp or lower, the monster disappears. However, I'm uncertain what happens when a summoned monster has a specific effect that occurs when the monster reaches 0 hp.
The Viduus can be summoned through the feat "summon neutral monster" as 4th level summon. When it reaches 0 HP it's body turns into a swarm of centipedes and it creates a mind fog centered on the body. The viduus can also undergo this transformation at will. So my question is, what happens when it hits 0 and what happens when it transforms deliberately. I could see anything from it disappearing with no additional effects, to it creating a now permanent swarm and the fog cloud.
I'm sure there are other summonable creatures with effects that occur on death, but this is the one I noticed and caused me to ask the question.
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Summoning: A summoning spell instantly brings a creature or object to a place you designate. When the spell ends or is dispelled, a summoned creature is instantly sent back to where it came from, but a summoned object is not sent back unless the spell description specifically indicates this. A summoned creature also goes away if it is killed or if its hit points drop to 0 or lower, but it is not really dead. It takes 24 hours for the creature to reform, during which time it can’t be summoned again.
When the spell that summoned a creature ends and the creature disappears, all the spells it has cast expire.
A summoned creature cannot use any innate summoning abilities it may have.
When it dies, all its pieces disappear, swarm included. Mind fog is a spell, so it ends.
When it uses its Transformation ability for all practical purposes it dies for a month, so the swarm will disappear and the Mind fog will end.
I can't find anything stating that a summoned creature's spell effects end before their duration is over if that summoned creature is killed. Do you have a reference for that?
|
When it dies, all its pieces disappear, swarm included. Mind fog is a spell, so it ends.
When it uses its Transformation ability for all practical purposes it dies for a month, so the swarm will disappear and the Mind fog will end.
Are you suggesting when a caster dies its spells stop? Because that's not true unless the duration is concentration.
Are you suggesting when a caster dies its spells stop?
Only if the caster is a summoned creature:
When the spell that summoned a creature ends and the creature disappears, all the spells it has cast expire. A summoned creature cannot use any innate summoning abilities it may have.
One could argue that the spell effects linger until the actual duration expires if the monster is killed before that--and it's not a terrible argument given that you can summon multiple monsters with one spell and some may die before others. But I'm gonna go with what I believe to be the intent of the rule.
Well, that is unfortunate. I'd hoped this summon option would have been more useful as a combat option. at least it can erase memories if you need that utility for some reason.
|
|
I can't find anything stating that a summoned creature's spell effects end before their duration is over if that summoned creature is killed. Do you have a reference for that?
I cited the Core Rulebook in the post above yours:
Summoning: A summoning spell instantly brings a creature or object to a place you designate. When the spell ends or is dispelled, a summoned creature is instantly sent back to where it came from, but a summoned object is not sent back unless the spell description specifically indicates this. A summoned creature also goes away if it is killed or if its hit points drop to 0 or lower, but it is not really dead. It takes 24 hours for the creature to reform, during which time it can’t be summoned again.
When the spell that summoned a creature ends and the creature disappears, all the spells it has cast expire.
A summoned creature cannot use any innate summoning abilities it may have.
Reading it again, the effect of the spells cast by the summoned creature should disappear when the summoning spell end, not when the summoned creature dies. so the Mind fog will last a few rounds, while the swarm will disappear, as it is made by pieces of the creature.
Sorry about that. I saw the quoted block and assumed it was just my text quoted as that's a common thing for people to do here for some reason.
It does seem reasonable to assume that all other effects that occur when the creature reaches zero happen before it disappears.
What would you say happens if you use ferocious summons with a Viduus? I assume the swarm still doesn't happen, either because the transformation is the same as dying or because it's close enough to an innate summoning ability to be excluded by the spell.