Starfinder Society Season 2 Guide Update (Feedback Wanted!)


Starfinder Society Roleplaying Guild

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Starfinder Society Developer

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Hey folks!

I just wanted to create a new thread dedicated to checking in with the community (all you beautiful folks) on what you'd like to see in the next rendition of the Starfinder Society Roleplaying Guild Guide.

Since this is a thread where I'm looking for feedback, it also makes sense for me to establish a few guidelines so that we're all on the same page for what I'm looking for.

-This is not the place for "corner case rulings" and by that, I mean that there's always a ton of calls for clarifications on very niche or specific cases, which is nice to have, but tends to bloat the guide. I already think the existing guide is a bit too big and would (eventually) like to trim it down if I have the chance.

-Our goal is to include material in this guide that will help everyone out. So if there's something specific that's causing issues or is just outright wrong, then let us know.

-Revisions to core rules for Society play are something I'll accept on a case by case basis. Specifically, I'm already looking at the Mystic Xenodruid connection's spell list to get an update.

-I'd like to get a sense on factions and if the existing options suite is up to snuff and if there's any problems or changes we should address in future updates. If some options aren't working well / working too well then I'd like to get a sense of those in case we need to review them.

-As a heads up, I doubt we'll see any new factions added with this update. Not 100% locked in, but I suspect we'll be sticking with our current roster.

Don't worry too much about the scope of these updates for your local groups, as I suspect this is going to be similar to the Guide 1.5 update in terms of the types of revisions that we're making. I'll endeavor to keep a proper change log on these that can be shared when the guide goes live.

I think a big part of this update is going to be bringing the storyline up to snuff and introducing the concepts for the (as of yet unannounced) Season 2 of Society play.

Everyone is encouraged to help me out and post their thoughts here!

So, that's all I've got. Thanks in advance, everyone!

Grand Lodge

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Pathfinder Starfinder Society Roleplaying Guild Subscriber

Thurston - one way to cut down the size, at least in my opinion, would be to remove the society ships from the guide and have them placed in the Community Use area.


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I guess a clarification of what constitutes a new character, and how to order chronicle sheets when you have things like race boons, capstones, etc., especially in relation to GM babies.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Starfinder Society Roleplaying Guild Subscriber

Along the lines of what Dracomicron mentioned, any special situations or guidelines that apply to GMs when applying credit for an adventure, such as when a player would get one of a number of possible options on a boon (1-17 Devolved comes to mind)

Starfinder Society Developer

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Good catch on the Capstone / Order of Operations on "GM Babies"

I'll see about maybe adding something in the guide. If not, it's getting added to a growing stack of non-guide-based errata/clarifications I want to eventually get out there!


Thurston Hillman wrote:

Good catch on the Capstone / Order of Operations on "GM Babies"

I'll see about maybe adding something in the guide. If not, it's getting added to a growing stack of non-guide-based errata/clarifications I want to eventually get out there!

Nice!

I am still 1 scenario away from the total chaos of having to apply your 1-98 boon, Exo-Guardians capstone, and Scoured Stars Veteran to a new character, so no pressure.

NO PRESSURE.

NO PRESSURE THURSTY.

Dataphiles ****

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I agree with Loki, it might behoove the whole to have a separate file with the pregens that is the starships.

* ⦵⦵⦵⦵

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Starfinder Superscriber

+1 on starships in their own PDF instead of the guide. It'd be great if they were in a ready to print/laminate state, eg using the starship template from CRB p524.

Closely connected to the guild guide, it would be nice to get an updated format for reputation on chronicle sheets (and likewise instructions for filling them out in the guide).

We have GMs *still* putting the amount of reputation earned on the left side of the "_|_". Some even initial the right side.

Grand Lodge

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Pathfinder Starfinder Society Roleplaying Guild Subscriber

Now that I am at home with the guide in front of me, I have a few more items to add. I apologize in advance if this response seems lengthy or as though I am nitpicking, as neither is my intention (I was an internal auditor in a prior career).

Under resources on p. 5, paizo.com/starfindersociety/clarifications seems to go only to the main SFS page. This link should be updated or removed. This link also appears on p. 21, under 4. Class.

On p. 7-8, in speaking of which character receives credit for using a pregen, one section says any character of a lower level or a 1st level, while the other area on Applying Credit states that you cannot apply credit to your character until it reaches the level of the pregen you used. Can the language between sections be cleaned up for some greater clarity?

P. 13 - 14 on infamy deals specifically with character actions in a game session, however, is that option also available if a player is the issue instead of the character, or is a conversation with a VA / VL / VC the only sanctioned option for player issues? Is there guidance given to address this type of issue that is available to a VA / VL / VC?

On p. 16 Step 11 for the Chronicle Sheets, this, and an explanation of the Chronicle sheets, in general should either appear in player specific sections, or at least appear as a reference in player sections, as this requirement is “buried” in the GM section, which may be skipped by those who have no desire to be a GM. It also puts the onus then on the player to voluntarily present the information, and their character, for review.

With respect to the Mnemonic Editor on p. 29 under basic purchases, due to the limitation in the rule book of changing choices made only from the last 2 levels, should this also then necessitate a requirement in the player section to record all choices made at leveling in order to validate a legal use of the Mnemonic Editor?

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Starfinder Society Roleplaying Guild Subscriber

There should also probably be some verbiage added on how to apply a chronicle sheet to 2 characters, such as race boons on a sheet, where an existing character is used to earn it and a new one is created to spend the boon.

**

loki.the.mischievous wrote:
There should also probably be some verbiage added on how to apply a chronicle sheet to 2 characters, such as race boons on a sheet, where an existing character is used to earn it and a new one is created to spend the boon.

That language is usually on the specific Chronicle with the boon.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Starfinder Society Roleplaying Guild Subscriber
Blake's Tiger wrote:
loki.the.mischievous wrote:
There should also probably be some verbiage added on how to apply a chronicle sheet to 2 characters, such as race boons on a sheet, where an existing character is used to earn it and a new one is created to spend the boon.
That language is usually on the specific Chronicle with the boon.

Looking at the Skitter Shot chronicle sheet, for instance, it shows you earn the boon playing as the character that went through it, but never mentions needing to also have a copy kept with the new character to apply the personal boon. This is what I mean about earning on one and applying to another.

**

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I understood. There are several cross-character boons in SFS and PFS.

To me, that’s an error of the Skittershot boon and not something to spend word count on in the guide, especially since an unknown future chronicle might implement a boon differently than what the guide might say.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Starfinder Society Roleplaying Guild Subscriber

Fair enough. Whichever way Thurston decides to handle and address works for me.

The Exchange ***** ⦵⦵ Venture-Lieutenant, North Carolina—Charlotte aka eddv

I would like it if there was an official boon tracking sheet somewhere where you cannlist your boons and Mark that you've slotted them to make it so I dont need to fiddle with a spreadsheet

Grand Lodge *

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Pathfinder Starfinder Society Roleplaying Guild Subscriber
Arc Riley wrote:
We have GMs *still* putting the amount of reputation earned on the left side of the "_|_". Some even initial the right side.

Uh oh - I am one of those GMs who is apparently doing this wrong. How are other GMs using the __|__ section? I've been putting Rep Gained on the left, and then new total on the right.

So for example if I've got 5 rep with Second Seekers (Jadnura) at the start of a scenario, slot my SS(J) champion boon, and the scenario grants +1 extra SS(J) rep at completion for being a good little Starfinder, I'd fill that out like:
Second Seekers (Jadnura) +3|8


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Pathfinder Starfinder Society Roleplaying Guild Subscriber
Kishmo wrote:

How are other GMs using the __|__ section?

...
I'd fill that out like:
Second Seekers (Jadnura) +3|8

Your way is the way that makes sense to me, but is not the intended way currently. There was a whole thread about it a while back.

⦵⦵

Starfinder Superscriber

I fifth the suggestion of separating out the ships from the guide.

I'm looking at the guide right now about the reputation thing and it says to put reputation earned in W (the left side of _|_) and new total rep in X (the right side of _|_), so it might look like Wayfinders 2|6, which is what I'm doing. If that's not the correct way to do it, that should really be cleared up in the guide.

For clarification, the order of operations on pages 15-16 for filling out the chronicle and the order of operations on page 52 for 'After the Adventure' A-are redundant, and B-do not match. I think these should be combined and simplified, if possible. The order on page 15-16 is practically impossible for SFS Online and makes chronicles during a convention window tricksy at best.

If you can fit it in, one suggestion I would have for an addition to the guide (or possibly in the same community use package as the ships) would be a printable tracking sheet for tracking scenarios completed on a character. A lot of people have made some very useful ones online, but it would be nice to have something for the meatspace folks that's easy to show in that regard.

Starfinder Society Developer

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Had a very productive meeting last night and a few things are on the docket:

-We're going to look at moving the ships into their own Community Use Document

-We're going to spitball a few more ideas and put together a likely 2 page section that has one page with a blank "Boon Slot" sheet and then another page explaining an example of slotting boons.

There's some other items that I'm not quite ready to announce yet. But please continue with the feedback as it's something we'll be looking into in the coming weeks!

As always, I'm here and listening! :)

-Thursty

Sovereign Court **** Venture-Lieutenant, Netherlands—Leiden aka Ascalaphus

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Guide 1.1 page 8 wrote:

The character may use the credits and Fame that she has earned on the Chronicle sheet for the current adventure to

help pay for condition removal, assuming she has completed enough of the adventure to earn the Chronicle sheet.

Aren't you supposed to always gain a sheet? Even if the mission is an abject failure you still gain a sheet and can't play the scenario again. It'll just be a sheet with almost everything crossed out.

Guide 1.1 page 8 wrote:
When applying credit, any Reputation gained during an adventure can be applied only to a faction for which the character receiving the credit already has a champion Faction boon. The only exception to this is any instance where the adventure specifically grants additional Reputation for a specific faction (such as a scenario with the Faction tag).

So if you play a pregen and assign the credit to a 0-XP new character number for which you haven't made a character yet, he doesn't gain reputation? That seems harsh. Now that we generally don't require characters to be a particular faction to earn scenario boons, is this really necessary?

Guide 1.1 page 8 wrote:
Shortly after beginning a scenario, the GM will call for the players to slot their boons. This typically occurs following the mission briefing, giving the players some heads up on what boons might be relevant to the scenario. In some cases, the GM will actively advise the players of pertinent boons they may have earned from Chronicle sheets on previous scenarios.

What happens in practice a lot is that the GM forgets to call for players to slot boons. Then halfway during the scenario someone wants to use a boon and we have a "well did you slot that?" "you never told us when to slot stuff" awkward moment. I've also sometimes had to drag advice out of the GM about slotting particular boons. I think this should be improved in two ways:

1) Establish a standard moment for boon slotting in the Guide: after the briefing, questions for the VC and knowledge checks, before anything else. This does mean that boons that give knowledge bonuses aren't available during the mission briefing, on the other hand you can use everything you learn from the briefing to choose boons.
2) Adopt a standard subsection in scenarios for slotting boons, like this:

hypothetical scenario text wrote:

Once upon a time, in a universe far far away, VC Forasmuch strides into the room (....) Some questions the PCs may ask:

What should we do about the dingus? You should bring it back in one piece.

Boons
Advise the PCs to slot the "big block of cheese" boon. Since this scenario doesn't include starship combat, they don't need to slot starship boons.

Guide 1.1 page 12 wrote:

MULTI-SESSION ADVENTURES AND EXTENDED PLAY

Roleplaying Guild characters can played in only one scenario or Adventure Path at a time. Characters are considered to be playing in a scenario or Adventure Path until they receive a Chronicle sheet for sanctioned content.

Consider adding a note that GM credit can be assigned to a character that's still locked in a scenario, and that it will be applied after the scenario's chronicle.

Also, how to handle this with APs run in campaign mode? Is the character that will eventually receive the credit locked down, even though the character in campaign mode is completely different (maybe even a different game system)?

Guide 1.1 page 16 wrote:

DEALING WITH AFFLICTIONS

(...)

Note: Any affliction that would result in an unplayable character must be resolved at the table once the game ends. This typically involves the remove affliction spell, either cast by a fellow PC or purchased as a service from an NPC. A character who does not resolve such conditions should be marked as dead.

Is my understanding correct that unlike PFS, in general you do not have to clear afflictions before the end of the session to survive?

Actually, page 18 gives more details about which conditions must be cleared. The section on page 16 should be harmonized with it, or at least include a reference to it.

Guide 1.1 page 19 wrote:
Magic, hybrid, and technological items that can be used less often than once per day (such as once per week or once per month and so on) are considered to be usable once per adventure.

So if a scenario involves a scene on Akiton, then two weeks travel to the Veskarium where the next scene happens, you can't use a "once per week" item in both scenes? This is a rather stealthy deviation from the normal rules, what's the purpose? Is it actually intended to mean that all of these things recharge in between adventures, because an indeterminate (but long enough) amount of time passes in between scenarios?

Guide 1.1 page 19 wrote:

WHERE TO BUY EQUIPMENT AND SPELLCASTING SERVICES

For simplicity’s sake, players can make purchases in a settlement up to the listed Maximum Item Value, adhering to the Always Available Items list below.

This raises the question of "when" to buy stuff. If the settlement limit matters, it makes sense to make use of the indeterminate amount of time in between scenarios to shop at Absalom Station.

That in turn raises the question when buying stuff is supposed to happen anyway: in between game sessions, at the beginning of a session, or at the end of it? The rigid "hand this sheet back and forth and back and forth" procedure for filling out a chronicle sheet (page 16, step 8) would also like to know.

Guide 1.1 page 19 wrote:

BENEFITS OF REPUTATION

A character’s Reputation with her faction represents her renown and status within her faction. For every 10 points of Reputation she has accumulated with a particular faction, that character gains a cumulative +1 circumstance bonus on Diplomacy checks against members of that faction.

I wonder how many people know this? Diplomacy checks against NPC faction members are so vanishingly rare, you might as well scrap this rule and instead call it out explicitly in a scenario where it matters. Much bigger chance that it'll be used.

--------- BOONS ---------

Consider renaming the hireling boons into "Hireling, Basic" instead of "Basic Hireling" etcetera, so they all come together in the listing instead of being scattered nonconsecutively throughout.

Guide 1.1 page 32 wrote:

Fusion Guild Contact (Social Boon)

You’ve garnered some contacts in Pact World organizations dedicated to the construction of weapon fusions.
Prerequisites: Exo-Guardians Tier 3
Cost: Varies (see below)
Benefit: When you purchase this boon, select a weapon fusion (Starfinder Core Rulebook 192) with an item level equal to 2 × your Exo-Guardians Reputation Tier. This boon costs a number of Fame equal to half the item level of the weapon fusion, rounding up.

While this boon is slotted, you gain a fusion seal for that specific weapon fusion for the duration of the scenario. You do not keep the fusion seal, but you can gain it again in any adventure in which you slot this boon.

Special: You can purchase this boon multiple times. Each time you purchase this boon, select a different weapon fusion.

I am having trouble understanding how this works/is supposed to. What does the item level here signify? Is it the level of the fusion, or the level of the weapon it can be applied to?

Suggested rewrite:

Benefit:Wen you purchase this boon, select a weapon fusion (Starfinder Core Rulebook 192) with an item level up to 2 x your Exo-Guardians Reputation Tier. This boon costs a number of Fame equal to half the item level of the weapon fusion, rounding up.

When you slot this boon, you borrow a fusion seal of the chosen weapon fusion from the Exo-Guardian's armory.

The first time each adventure that you use this fusion seal, it becomes effective immediately after installation, instead of the normal 24 hour activation time. This fusion seal is expensive enough that you may apply it to any appropriate weapon.

You do not keep the fusion seal after the adventure, but you can gain it again in any adventure in which you slot this boon.

Guide 1.1 page 38-39 wrote:
When you select this boon, it does not apply to your current character. Instead, select one of your Starfinder Society characters with 0 XP.

Can you apply capstone boons to GM credit characters? To characters who've only had pregen credit? To characters who have had only AP credit?

Owing to the still fairly small catalog of SFS scenarios and the shorter length of AP volumes, people are playing a lot of APs and using those to build SFS characters and level them without burning the whole SFS scenario catalog on 1-2 PCs.

Personally right now I'm looking at the weird situation where I might get credit for an AP that I could only apply to a new (#XXX-705) character a few weeks before I get real close to earning some capstone boons.

--- STARSHIPS ---

Please always include the following in statblocks:
* Range of direct fire weapons.
* Speed of tracking weapons.
* Capacity of limited fire weapons.

We get 3 pages with a picture of the Drake in a row. Surely we could bundle that to one page with a Drake and Pegasus picture, and expand the statblock pages so that the statblocks are a true one-stop resource for using them?

--- After the adventure ---

The steps on page 52 imply that Downtime happens after XP (and potential level up). Does that mean you'd roll Day Job checks with a higher skill rating? Also, what does it mean for the timing of using a mnemonic editor (and which levels are still in its edit window)?

Sczarni ***** ⦵⦵

Starfinder Charter Superscriber

I am definitely in favor of updating the Reputation section. Some variation of:

[Faction] [Rep Gained] + [Current Rep] = [Final Rep]

And we really do need at least another two lines added. You're required to track all of your Reputation, and yet there's no location do it.

Pathfinder Society made an effort to update the Chronicle Design every Season. In addition to fixing the current problem with the layout of Reputation, I would like a [subtotal] box placed above the [credits spent] box.

Makes auditing easier for GMs, but I'd find it helpful as a player moreso, since it needs to be written somewhere.

I support splitting up the Starship section, and printable "pregen"-style versions of them, but also separating the Factions.

I ran a Quest for new players this weekend, but The Commencement is the game that explains Factions (or at least some of them). If I had a smaller pamphlet I could have given them on Factions, I feel it would have been more digestible than "go read the Guide".

Sczarni ***** ⦵⦵

Starfinder Charter Superscriber
Lau Bannenberg wrote:
1) Establish a standard moment for boon slotting in the Guide: after the briefing, questions for the VC and knowledge checks, before anything else.

This won't work, since there are (at least 3) boons you must slot before the scenario even starts.

Lau Bannenberg wrote:
Can you apply capstone boons to GM credit characters?

Thurston has said "no", but that's one of the clarifications he wants to place into an errata type of thread, and not the Guide.

Silver Crusade ***** ⦵⦵ Venture-Captain, Germany—Bavaria

Thurston Hillman wrote:

Good catch on the Capstone / Order of Operations on "GM Babies"

I'll see about maybe adding something in the guide. If not, it's getting added to a growing stack of non-guide-based errata/clarifications I want to eventually get out there!

I really wish that we could find another solution for this problem, it seems to create more problems to track and it has kinda killed my motivation to reach that tier any time soon.

Arc Riley wrote:

+1 on starships in their own PDF instead of the guide. It'd be great if they were in a ready to print/laminate state, eg using the starship template from CRB p524.

Closely connected to the guild guide, it would be nice to get an updated format for reputation on chronicle sheets (and likewise instructions for filling them out in the guide).

We have GMs *still* putting the amount of reputation earned on the left side of the "_|_". Some even initial the right side.

Someone already did the work and added the ship stats to that ship "character sheets" though I am not aware of an updated version. Personally, I would want (and will have to create for myself) a version of the ship stats that includes the short statblock version and an extended version on a ship sheet.

Some of the things I really would want to see is to add weapon ranges and ideally number of ammunition to the starship stats (since I usually have to look it up or annotate those stat blocks).

loki.the.mischievous wrote:


P. 13 - 14 on infamy deals specifically with character actions in a game session, however, is that option also available if a player is the issue instead of the character, or is a conversation with a VA / VL / VC the only sanctioned option for player issues? Is there guidance given to address this type of issue that is available to a VA / VL / VC?

Local VOs can usually reach out to other VOs if they have a local situation, while I can't necessarily comment on the status and availability of that advice, I doubt that it has to be in the guide.

The short version for non-VOs likely would be "Don't be a jerk or potentially suffer consequences"

Thurston Hillman wrote:

Had a very productive meeting last night and a few things are on the docket:

-We're going to look at moving the ships into their own Community Use Document

-We're going to spitball a few more ideas and put together a likely 2 page section that has one page with a blank "Boon Slot" sheet and then another page explaining an example of slotting boons.

There's some other items that I'm not quite ready to announce yet. But please continue with the feedback as it's something we'll be looking into in the coming weeks!

As always, I'm here and listening! :)

-Thursty

If possible I would like to see as much information on those ships stablocks as possible.

A boon tracking sheet is a neat idea, but could we maybe get a SFS inventory tracking sheet? I have been using my PFS sheets, but I think that for the purposes of SFS "Bulk" is something that would make it easier to audit.
Since being encumbered can be pretty critical in SFS, at least some basic tracking option seems reasonable.

Silver Crusade ***** ⦵⦵ Venture-Captain, Germany—Bavaria

Lau Bannenberg wrote:
Guide 1.1 page 8 wrote:

The character may use the credits and Fame that she has earned on the Chronicle sheet for the current adventure to

help pay for condition removal, assuming she has completed enough of the adventure to earn the Chronicle sheet.

Aren't you supposed to always gain a sheet? Even if the mission is an abject failure you still gain a sheet and can't play the scenario again. It'll just be a sheet with almost everything crossed out.

Guide 1.1 page 8 wrote:
When applying credit, any Reputation gained during an adventure can be applied only to a faction for which the character receiving the credit already has a champion Faction boon. The only exception to this is any instance where the adventure specifically grants additional Reputation for a specific faction (such as a scenario with the Faction tag).

So if you play a pregen and assign the credit to a 0-XP new character number for which you haven't made a character yet, he doesn't gain reputation? That seems harsh. Now that we generally don't require characters to be a particular faction to earn scenario boons, is this really necessary?

Guide 1.1 page 8 wrote:
Shortly after beginning a scenario, the GM will call for the players to slot their boons. This typically occurs following the mission briefing, giving the players some heads up on what boons might be relevant to the scenario. In some cases, the GM will actively advise the players of pertinent boons they may have earned from Chronicle sheets on previous scenarios.

What happens in practice a lot is that the GM forgets to call for players to slot boons. Then halfway during the scenario someone wants to use a boon and we have a "well did you slot that?" "you never told us when to slot stuff" awkward moment. I've also sometimes had to drag advice out of the GM about slotting particular boons. I think this should be improved in two ways:

1) Establish a standard moment for boon slotting in the Guide: after the briefing, questions for...

As usual, I find myself agreeing with Lau, regarding the Fusion Guild contract, I would like to see a clarification, that fusion seal if a sufficient level to be attached to any weapon the character owns (though I am seeing an argument that it should also apply to found weapons - but that situation is so rare that I really would not worry about it).

And I absolutely agree that the 24 hours should not apply here, since that would make it absolutely pointless if you slot your boons after the briefing.

Silver Crusade ***** ⦵⦵ Venture-Captain, Germany—Bavaria

Nefreet wrote:

I am definitely in favor of updating the Reputation section. Some variation of:

[Faction] [Rep Gained] + [Current Rep] = [Final Rep]

And we really do need at least another two lines added. You're required to track all of your Reputation, and yet there's no location do it.

Pathfinder Society made an effort to update the Chronicle Design every Season. In addition to fixing the current problem with the layout of Reputation, I would like a [subtotal] box placed above the [credits spent] box.

Makes auditing easier for GMs, but I'd find it helpful as a player moreso, since it needs to be written somewhere.

I support splitting up the Starship section, and printable "pregen"-style versions of them, but also separating the Factions.

I ran a Quest for new players this weekend, but The Commencement is the game that explains Factions (or at least some of them). If I had a smaller pamphlet I could have given them on Factions, I feel it would have been more digestible than "go read the Guide".

I think, that a change to an ITS style sheet could work where players could keep a running total of their fame and rep, their fame purchases and uses of certain boons that can only be used once per tier.

***** ⦵⦵

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What problem is keeping captstones off of DM babies trying to solve? That ruling just seems really weird to me.

* ⦵⦵⦵⦵

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Starfinder Superscriber
Kishmo wrote:
Uh oh - I am one of those GMs who is apparently doing this wrong. How are other GMs using the __|__ section? I've been putting Rep Gained on the left, and then new total on the right.

The correct way is the previous total on the left, new total on the right. See Guild Guide v1.1 page 15.

The problem with this and why so many people are getting it wrong is the guide specifies that you START by handing each player a blank chronicle sheet and having them fill out the top line, the previous XP, Fame, Credits, all the factions you earned reputation for and the previous totals at the bottom. The amount of reputation gained isn't written anywhere, the player is suppose to write the old total and the GM is suppose to write the new total.

In reality, GMs usually take a blank sheet and fill out the member/PC number, how much XP, Fame, Credits, and Reputation earned. They initial it, cross out anything they didn't earn, and hand them to players who usually walk away and tabulate the rest at home.

Myself - I write (eg) "Wayfinders +2" at the bottom, with the bonus on the "Faction" line, and let players fill out the old and new reputation.

The important point is that this really needs to be cleaned up. Very few GMs are actually reading the guild guide's instructions for filling out a chronicle sheet.

Silver Crusade ***** ⦵⦵ Venture-Captain, Germany—Bavaria

BigNorseWolf wrote:
What problem is keeping captstones off of DM babies trying to solve? That ruling just seems really weird to me.

I sincerely hope to not misrepresent anyone, but I have been given to understand that there is a certain element of worry when to comes to retraining and moving those boons around in that short window before hitting level 2.

Personally, I assume that you buy those boons and assign them to a character if that character changes race/class etc. before hitting level 2 I am okay with that.

Silver Crusade ***** ⦵⦵ Venture-Captain, Germany—Bavaria

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Arc Riley wrote:


Myself - I write (eg) "Wayfinders +2" at the bottom, with the bonus on the "Faction" line, and let players fill out the old and new reputation.

I do the same, a fair number of my tables are online and this just reduces my workload as GM.


Sebastian Hirsch wrote:
BigNorseWolf wrote:
What problem is keeping captstones off of DM babies trying to solve? That ruling just seems really weird to me.

I sincerely hope to not misrepresent anyone, but I have been given to understand that there is a certain element of worry when to comes to retraining and moving those boons around in that short window before hitting level 2.

Personally, I assume that you buy those boons and assign them to a character if that character changes race/class etc. before hitting level 2 I am okay with that.

Also logically it doesn't make sense to apply a capstone to the start of a sponsored neophyte's career when they are actually quite experienced already. Just because you haven't played your GM baby yet, doesn't mean they were simply born as a Level 3 Operative or whatever. Presumably they've been out there having adventures prior to you starting play with them, which defeats the intent of the capstones.

Now, if you apply the capstone and THEN start giving them GM credit, I don't see anything wrong with that.

* ⦵⦵⦵⦵

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Starfinder Superscriber
Sebastian Hirsch wrote:


I do the same, a fair number of my tables are online and this just reduces my workload as GM.

Geesus, I didn't even consider online games! Trying to follow the steps in the Guild Guide with online players would be a nightmare!

Contrast to demo nights like I'm running tomorrow; I'll bring a few regular partially-filled out chronicle sheets and a bunch of fully filled out chronicle sheets with new member cards stapled to them along with a member# sticker to slap on the sign-up sheet. I've used this process since last Free RPG Day and it works great (for this specific situation).

So..

I'd suggest replacing the chronicle sheet section entirely; instead of step-by-step rules, just have a blown-up chronicle sheet in the middle of the page and instructions for what-goes-where.

Let the GMs figure out a process that works for their situation that gets the chronicle sheets filled out to the appropriate state.

Sczarni ***** ⦵⦵

Starfinder Charter Superscriber

Oh, and we really need to amend the current ruling on handling UPBs.

I love Thurston and everything else he's done, but I actively violate the prohibition on UPBs needing to be purchased in lots of 1000 (and I tell everyone else I meet that I don't enforce it).

Just because UPBs are listed as "1000 = 1 bulk" does not mean they're only available in lots of 1000. The Core Rulebook is clear that they are ubiquitous and handled no different than credits.

I've always thought that was an erroneous ruling and it really needs to be reconsidered.

* ⦵⦵⦵⦵

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Starfinder Superscriber
Nefreet wrote:
Oh, and we really need to amend the current ruling on handling UPBs.

That was fixed in Guild Guide v1.1, see page 52:

Quote:

Crafting: You can spend your Downtime to craft an item following the rules presented on page 235 of the Starfinder Core Rulebook. A character must use the skills listed in this section of the book and cannot use the Profession skill to craft equipment. It is assumed that between adventures, you have access to the tools and workshop necessary to craft equipment.

To craft an item, you must acquire the requisite number of UPBs. You can purchase UPBs at a rate of 1 UPB for every 1 credit spent. You cannot scavenge parts from equipment you own or collect during a scenario. Any equipment crafted between sessions should be marked on the Chronicle sheet to indicate that it was crafted.

Sovereign Court **** Venture-Lieutenant, Netherlands—Leiden aka Ascalaphus

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Nefreet wrote:
Lau Bannenberg wrote:
1) Establish a standard moment for boon slotting in the Guide: after the briefing, questions for the VC and knowledge checks, before anything else.
This won't work, since there are (at least 3) boons you must slot before the scenario even starts.

Isn't that a bit of a problem with those boons, because the current Guide says:

"Shortly after beginning a scenario, the GM will call for the
players to slot their boons. This typically occurs following the
mission briefing, giving the players some heads up on what boons
might be relevant to the scenario."

So there is a standard moment for it, and it's intended for it to be an actual moment, not a gradual rolling process all through the briefing. Most boons that are intended for use before or after a scenario are in fact slotless.

The problem I'm signalling is that the moment is often overlooked in practice.

Nefreet wrote:
Lau Bannenberg wrote:
Can you apply capstone boons to GM credit characters?
Thurston has said "no", but that's one of the clarifications he wants to place into an errata type of thread, and not the Guide.

I think that's a bad idea. Capstone boons are something that comes entirely from the Guide, as is GM credit. It's a question that affects a large audience (most GMs). So why hide it away somewhere else in a sticky thread or FAQ?

Sovereign Court **** Venture-Lieutenant, Netherlands—Leiden aka Ascalaphus

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Dracomicron wrote:
Sebastian Hirsch wrote:
BigNorseWolf wrote:
What problem is keeping captstones off of DM babies trying to solve? That ruling just seems really weird to me.

I sincerely hope to not misrepresent anyone, but I have been given to understand that there is a certain element of worry when to comes to retraining and moving those boons around in that short window before hitting level 2.

Personally, I assume that you buy those boons and assign them to a character if that character changes race/class etc. before hitting level 2 I am okay with that.

Also logically it doesn't make sense to apply a capstone to the start of a sponsored neophyte's career when they are actually quite experienced already. Just because you haven't played your GM baby yet, doesn't mean they were simply born as a Level 3 Operative or whatever. Presumably they've been out there having adventures prior to you starting play with them, which defeats the intent of the capstones.

Now, if you apply the capstone and THEN start giving them GM credit, I don't see anything wrong with that.

I disagree with this. That sounds like making rules for a vague sense of "realism" or "logic" while those rules to solve a vague an not very important problem have much more damaging effects.

What damaging effects? Dis-incentivizing GMing.

If I GM right now and put the credit on #XX-705, then I can't attach a capstone to that character. If I wait until I first get the capstone in place and then go and earn GM credit, that means the GM pool was smaller for a couple of months just for "making the flavor more logical".

But who enjoys this "logic"? If you're sitting down to play with me while I trot out my GM baby for the first time, does it really improve your enjoyment of the game if the baby got the capstone first and the GM credit second?

Sovereign Court **** Venture-Lieutenant, Netherlands—Leiden aka Ascalaphus

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Sebastian Hirsch wrote:
BigNorseWolf wrote:
What problem is keeping captstones off of DM babies trying to solve? That ruling just seems really weird to me.

I sincerely hope to not misrepresent anyone, but I have been given to understand that there is a certain element of worry when to comes to retraining and moving those boons around in that short window before hitting level 2.

Personally, I assume that you buy those boons and assign them to a character if that character changes race/class etc. before hitting level 2 I am okay with that.

How are capstones really different from race boons in that regard?

Wouldn't it make things a lot simpler if we created one set of clear standard rules for "things that must be applied to a character around the start of its career"?

Because we have a variety of things to be applied at the start;
- Capstone boons
- Some charity boons
- Race boons
- Boon like the Scoured Stars boon that let you start with more XP

They bump up against the "rebuild until 4XP" principle, especially the boons that let you start with 3XP.

***** ⦵⦵

Nefreet wrote:


I've always thought that was an erroneous ruling and it really needs to be reconsidered.

I thought they got rid of that in 1.1

***** ⦵⦵

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Dracomicron wrote:


Now, if you apply the capstone and THEN start giving them GM credit, I don't see anything wrong with that.

That makes absolutely no sense. At all. There is no discernible play difference between a DM baby poppping into existance at 2 with a capstone because their player capstoned and then dm'd vs one that cannot because they dm'd and then capstoned.

Sczarni ***** ⦵⦵

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Starfinder Charter Superscriber
BigNorseWolf wrote:
Nefreet wrote:


I've always thought that was an erroneous ruling and it really needs to be reconsidered.
I thought they got rid of that in 1.1

Didn't catch that until just now ^_^

⦵⦵

Starfinder Superscriber
Arc Riley wrote:
Geesus, I didn't even consider online games! Trying to follow the steps in the Guild Guide with online players would be a nightmare!

As someone who runs nigh-exclusively online, I can confirm that it is impossible to follow the steps in the guide in online play unless you want it to take several weeks to get chronicles done.

What generally happens is that we send out a reporting sheet where players pre-fill their info before the game starts, they usually only fill out part of it, and we take that information after the game and send them partially completed chronicles.

In an ideal universe, I'd have some sort of online tool that they could fill in a form and it would pre-generate the sheet for me and all I have to do is fill in the GM stuff and sign it. But a las, this is not that universe.

Sovereign Court **** Venture-Lieutenant, Netherlands—Leiden aka Ascalaphus

It would be very helpful if the procedure for filling out chronicle sheets was revised so that a lot of back-and-forth is eliminated. That would bring the rules a lot closer to the practice at 99% of tables.

Grand Lodge ***** ⦵⦵ Venture-Captain, Online—PbP aka Hmm

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Chronicle reporting online is painful. I have developed a Pre-Game questionnaire that I tweak a bit for each PBP adventure, and I ask them well before the adventure starts. My pregame questionnaire includes everything but cash expenditures, which keep changing before and during the adventure, and so are more pain than it is worth for me to track.

Instead, I suggest that most people use a blank ITS spreadsheet, and link to it in their online character sheets. This allows all the money to be tracked without me having to fuss over the new expenditures. This ITS, developed by Bret, also tracks reputation so it's pretty sweet.

Here is Charli's ITS so you can see what one looks like when it has been filled out a bit more.

Now... I thought it was +2 | NEW TOTAL NUMBER in those boxes below. If it was old number | new number than I have been doing these wrong.

What I would like, more than anything else, is a filled out chronicle sheet for a fictitious adventure that we can all eyeball. An example with bonus faction rep would make things much easier.

Hmm

Sczarni ***** ⦵⦵

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Starfinder Charter Superscriber

There's plenty of room for one more box on the reputation line.

Something like this.

"A+B=C" would honestly solve everyone's problems.

Sczarni ***** ⦵⦵

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Starfinder Charter Superscriber

And please get rid of the "GM Initials" boxes.

All you need to do is include a line instructing that "shaded areas are GM only", like this.

That allows for the right side column to be thinned down and eliminates roughly 30 instances of carpel tunnel.

Silver Crusade ***** ⦵⦵ Venture-Captain, Germany—Bavaria

Nefreet wrote:

And please get rid of the "GM Initials" boxes.

All you need to do is include a line instructing that "shaded areas are GM only", like this.

That allows for the right side column to be thinned down and eliminates roughly 30 instances of carpel tunnel.

Seems like a good suggestion, I am not going to sign an unfinished chronicle sheet anyway.

Liberty's Edge **** ⦵⦵

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Hello all!
And thanks for coming to get feedback.

Quote:
We're going to look at moving the ships into their own Community Use Document

If you do this, which I too think would be a very nice idea, would it be possible to maybe add the range of all the weapons? (maybe it's just me, but I find the players are often at a loss to know this, and sometimes find it hard to locate the info' - I see a lot in SFS who do not read the Building Starships section in detail, since you cannot build your own).

Right now it is as such:
Attack (Port) heavy laser net (5d6)
And I feel it could be useful to add the range in there, like:
Attack (Port) heavy laser net (short range, 5d6)
Or something of the sort.

This would be a nice addition to the scenarios for me, but at least for the SFS vessels.

Thanks for the great game and community!

Grand Lodge *

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Pathfinder Starfinder Society Roleplaying Guild Subscriber
Thurston Hillman wrote:
We're going to look at moving the ships into their own Community Use Document

If possible, it'd be awesome if that Community Use Document had a re-issue of the super-helpful Starship Actions by Role Cheat Sheet (like pages 29-34 from the Into the Unknown quest!) with the new updated Starship DCs!

Sovereign Court **** Venture-Lieutenant, Netherlands—Leiden aka Ascalaphus

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Kishmo wrote:
Thurston Hillman wrote:
We're going to look at moving the ships into their own Community Use Document
If possible, it'd be awesome if that Community Use Document had a re-issue of the super-helpful Starship Actions by Role Cheat Sheet (like pages 29-34 from the Into the Unknown quest!) with the new updated Starship DCs!

Yeah, a complete one-stop starship package would be amazing!

***** ⦵⦵

Nefreet wrote:

There's plenty of room for one more box on the reputation line.

Something like this.

"A+B=C" would honestly solve everyone's problems.

The DM filling out the part B part would solve the shuffle problem.

Starfinder Society Developer

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I'll see what I can do about the starship file and making some quality of life adjustments. Keep in mind the timing on doing all these updates coincides with a bunch of other things (conventions and major releases), so while I appreciate the desire to (and would personally really like to) make a bunch of quality of life changes, it can't come at the expense of our schedule.

Anywho, keep the feedback coming, but don't want people to come with pitchforks when not all these requests don't make it in.

-Thursty
(Temporary Expectations Manager)

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