Grab Greater Grapple fast grapple and pin


Rules Questions


My question goes as fellow. In the fellowing eventuality could I Pin a foe in a single round via fast grapple.

1. Charged dealth damage and successfully grabbed.

2. Full attacked dealth damage and grabbed.

3. Attacked once and Grabbed with move action and swift left.

In short does the grab ability allows to use fast grapple in the same round?


do you mean rapid grappler?

If you do, the answer is no. Greater Grapple doesn't kick in until you're required to make a check to maintain an existing grapple. Which would not be the round that you initiated the grapple in.

The feat Bushwhack on the otherhand does let you do this. The trick with that feat though is you have to catch your opponent flat footed.


So in short no mather what I do I have to paint myself as a sitting duck and let myself be full attacked just so I can start pinning?


kyubi3009 wrote:
So in short no mather what I do I have to paint myself as a sitting duck and let myself be full attacked just so I can start pinning?

I suppose so. But only if the target you're grappling has a light or one handed weapon, even then they attack at a -2 and aren't trying to break free. There are builds that not only keep their full AC while grappling but can even threaten normally.

I mean, isn't your statement true of anyone that goes up into melee?


Rapid Grappler:
Rapid grappler only allows you to do damage with your grapple check, so is no help with pinning.

Meaning in question 1, you can not charge and then swift action pin.

Grab:
Grab gives you a free attempt to start a grapple but does nothing if you are already grappling.

So you can not use multiple attacks in a full round action to make multiple grappling checks. Question 2 is a nope.

Greater Grapple:
There are two interpretations to greater grappling: one that requires that you have a creature grappled, one that requires that you start the turn grappling. Speak to your GM and decide how you want it ran in your game (one interpretation makes grappling much more powerful).

Under the first interpretation, the answer to question 3 is yes. Under the second interpretation, no.

All that aside, grapplers will draw a lot of fire. Focus on defense.

Scarab Sages

There is designer comment on it, though not an official ruling. Mark Seifter said that you can't maintain in the same round in which you establish the grapple. At the time he promised a grapple FAQ/blog, but that never came to pass.

My suggestion is to look into the Snapping Turtle Style chain. Snapping Turtle Clutch allows you to establish a grapple as an immediate action when you are missed by a melee attack. So then you begin your turn grappling and can maintain to pin.

LINK

Mark Seifter wrote:
Even if the enemy moved up to the tetori, you can't maintain during the same round you established. The only way I can think of to pull it off is with Snapping Turtle Clutch to establish off turn and then maintain on your own next turn for the pin and tie up.


I believe that a maneuver master monk with a piercing weapon and hamatula strike should be able to do it.

Hit with piercing
Free grapple
Flurry maneuver to maintain and pin

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