kevin_video |
This is currently the issue. Our paladin (who gifted some magical full plate from his deity's temple), just found a belt of physical perfection. Unfortunately, he's already got too high of a Dex to get much use out of it, but Str and Con will go up. We were wondering if there was any way to bump up an armor's maximum Dexterity besides levels of fighter, hellknight (and variants of), or variant multiclassing? Specifically, in 3.5 there was the +1 armor ability, nimbleness, that increased it by +1. I heard that there's something similar for Pathfinder, but don't know where it is. One of the armory books maybe?
We're only allowed to use Paizo products. No 3PP.
Also, second question, is there a way to turn armor into a mithral set without starting from scratch? Like with lesser wish? We're not in a very good location for buying or selling rare or magical items and materials. Kind of in the boonies and will be for about 2-3 more levels minimum.
MrCharisma |
... in 3.5 there was the +1 armor ability, nimbleness, that increased it by +1. I heard that there's something similar for Pathfinder, but don't know where it is. One of the armory books maybe?
Not that I can see.
Also, second question, is there a way to turn armor into a mithral set without starting from scratch?
Nope, but ...
Like with lesser wish?
I'd probably let that work. You'd have to pay the materials fornthe upgrade. This kinda thing is GM fiat territory though, so check with the GM
kevin_video |
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Nimble Armor from the Adventurer's Armory 2? +2 Max Dex with a penalty of -1 to the AC rating.
Fixed that for everyone.
I did find that, but I was confused on the Armor Adept feat. It lets you ignore 2 drawbacks, but the rules says you're only allowed 1 modification, but then there's a Modification feat that lets you add another modification. It makes no sense.
Gray Warden |
Nimble Armor from the Adventurer's Armory 2? +2 Max Dex with a penalty of -1 to the AC rating.
https://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment/armor/armor-modifications/nimble/
This is pointless, as they would get +1 AC from the higher Dex, and -1 AC from Nimble. So, no net improvement on regular AC, +1 to touch AC and -1 to flat-footed AC.
EDIT. I flat-out misread it.
Since the armor was gifted from his deity's temple, how about the temple "upgrading" it? The Paladin is called back to his temple and, upon paying a small offer of 16k, he is gifted a new mithral armor symbolizing his higher status.
Also, remember that the armor Dex cap affects only AC. This means that, while you will add only +1 from Dex to AC, you will still be able to add the higher Dex to Initiative, ranged attacks and Dex-based skill checks.
kevin_video |
Worthx wrote:Nimble Armor from the Adventurer's Armory 2? +2 Max Dex with a penalty of -1 to the AC rating.
https://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment/armor/armor-modifications/nimble/
This is pointless, as they would get +1 AC from the higher Dex, and -1 AC from Nimble. So, no net improvement on regular AC, +1 to touch AC and -1 to flat-footed AC.
Since the armor was gifted from his deity's temple, how about the temple "upgrading" it? The Paladin is called back to his temple and, upon paying a small offer of 16k, he is gifted a new mithral armor symbolizing his higher status.
Also, remember that the armor Dex cap affects only AC. This means that, while you will add only +1 from Dex to AC, you will still be able to add the higher Dex to Initiative, ranged attacks and Dex-based skill checks.
I think you're reading that wrong. It's +2 Dex and -1 AC, so it's a net of +1 AC, +2 touch, and -1 flat-footed.
We're 3rd level and in a small town. There's no way either of that is going to happen. But we're aware of the Dex adding to other things.
PossibleCabbage |
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I did find that, but I was confused on the Armor Adept feat. It lets you ignore 2 drawbacks, but the rules says you're only allowed 1 modification, but then there's a Modification feat that lets you add another modification. It makes no sense.
When you take the feat you select two modifications, say Jarring and Nimble, so if you were to put on Jarring armor or Nimble armor you would ignore the drawback, but if you were to put on Burnished or Deflecting armor you would still suffer the drawback.
Also with the Modification Master feat in Adventurer's Armory 2, you can have one modification on a suit of armor and then add a 2nd one temporarily, so you could have your jarring nimble armor or your vitalguard double-plated armor or whatever two things you picked for Armor Adept, for an 8 hour period whenever you have a spare hour to tap on it with a hammer.
kevin_video |
kevin_video wrote:I did find that, but I was confused on the Armor Adept feat. It lets you ignore 2 drawbacks, but the rules says you're only allowed 1 modification, but then there's a Modification feat that lets you add another modification. It makes no sense.When you take the feat you select two modifications, say Jarring and Nimble, so if you were to put on Jarring armor or Nimble armor you would ignore the drawback, but if you were to put on Burnished or Deflecting armor you would still suffer the drawback.
Also with the Modification Master feat in Adventurer's Armory 2, you can have one modification on a suit of armor and then add a 2nd one temporarily, so you could have your jarring nimble armor or your vitalguard double-plated armor or whatever two things you picked for Armor Adept, for an 8 hour period whenever you have a spare hour to tap on it with a hammer.
Is that how the master feat works? Only the trainer one mentions the 8 hours. Still a waste of a feat. Should have been an equipment trait or something.
DeathlessOne |
Should be back up now. Might have been a momentary glitch. Or, try alternate site : Swift Iron Style
kevin_video |
Should be back up now. Might have been a momentary glitch. Or, try alternate site : Swift Iron Style
Unfortunately the original link won't work, but the PFSRD definitely does. Made sure to send it his way.
PossibleCabbage |
DeathlessOne wrote:Swift Iron Style will help a little bit.Seems the site is down at the moment.
Fixed Link For some reason Google thinks AoN is on https, which it is not, so throws up an expired cert error.
kevin_video |
kevin_video wrote:Fixed Link For some reason Google thinks AoN is on https, which it is not, so throws up an expired cert error.DeathlessOne wrote:Swift Iron Style will help a little bit.Seems the site is down at the moment.
Weird. But thanks for the fixed link.
Mysterious Stranger |
Paladins are pretty feat starved so spending a feat for a slight increase in AC is probably not worth it. Even if you can get an enchantment added to the armor to get the extra AC it would be kind of pointless, because you could simply increase the bonus of the armor for about the same cost.
In this case it is probably better to just accept that you will not be able to take full advantage of the belt. There comes a point where you are spending more to get something than it is worth. This situation seems to be a perfect example of that.
kevin_video |
Paladins are pretty feat starved so spending a feat for a slight increase in AC is probably not worth it. Even if you can get an enchantment added to the armor to get the extra AC it would be kind of pointless, because you could simply increase the bonus of the armor for about the same cost.
In this case it is probably better to just accept that you will not be able to take full advantage of the belt. There comes a point where you are spending more to get something than it is worth. This situation seems to be a perfect example of that.
He's looking at the Style feat that was suggested. He's looking to tank everything. One of his feats is Antagonize. He's basically looking to draw aggro.
DeathlessOne |
Paladins are pretty feat starved so spending a feat for a slight increase in AC is probably not worth it. Even if you can get an enchantment added to the armor to get the extra AC it would be kind of pointless, because you could simply increase the bonus of the armor for about the same cost.
... Eh? As far as I am aware, Paladins function fairly well without significant feat investment. Most Melee classes do just fine with just taking power attack. Though, I suppose that entirely depends on what kind of game you are playing and how wildly it deviates from the expectation of CR meaning anything.
kevin_video |
If he's looking for a higher AC he could just take Dodge. Yes, the belt still won't be fully utilized, but maybe someone else could use it instead or he could use a different set of armor.
He already has Dodge. Took it at 1st level as his human bonus feat. As for taking different armor, I don't know that his deity or the temple would look too favorably on that.
kevin_video |
You'd think his god would've had the foresight to know the armour would have been unsuitable for his needs.
At 3rd level, and the temple being out in the boonies, guessing that's about as good as we're going to get for the time being.
I’d recommend ‘reskinning’ it as an o-yoroi or similiar. Pay to have it modified etc
I'm not the GM so that's not likely going to happen.
Also, the part we're in is a prewritten adventure.
All I'm asking for is whether or not there are things to adjust the current armor. There is, and he's doing what he can with what's within the written rules. Treat this like you would PFS. We have to.
kevin_video |
So do we know how much his DexMod is going to be over the cap of the armor?
Since if it's "+2 going to waste" just get someone to hammer nimble onto it and you come out ahead.
He's got +2 with the belt. He'd already figured on being a fairly low Dex so he kept it at 13 so he could get Dodge. He'll have 15 now.
Couldn't someone else use the belt?
All of us could, but we 100% believe it's cursed. As a paladin, he's opted to be the sacrifice to try it out. So far, he's good.
You found a Belt of Perfection at 3rd level?
Oh, we 100% fully believe it's cursed. There's no way it's not.
kevin_video |
Dragonborn3 wrote:Couldn't someone else use the belt?All of us could, but we 100% believe it's cursed. As a paladin, he's opted to be the sacrifice to try it out. So far, he's good.
Joe Jungers wrote:You found a Belt of Perfection at 3rd level?Oh, we 100% fully believe it's cursed. There's no way it's not.
In a previous campaign we did, we were 5th level at the time and the BBEG had a lesser quicken metamagic rod. Didn't even think about it being possibly cursed. Oracle found out the hard way. We've learned our lesson. It's why we think this is cursed too.
JiaYou |
I know it sounds like you're down on Enlarge Person, but it's only a -1 to AC for the paladin. Potions of enlarge person would give the paladin reach and a larger damage dice which in my opinion absolutely makes up for simply -1 to AC. Wasn't what you were asking directly but it's something to consider.
Mysterious Stranger |
The amount of resources you would need to take advantage of the extra +1 AC far out way the benefits. Just consider the extra DEX a buffer in case for some reason the paladin loses DEX. There are lots of ways for a character to lose DEX so having a buffer is not a bad thing. Since your paladin already has the feat dodge when he loses DEX his AC drops by 2 not just one. As JiaYOu points out becoming large has a lot of benefits and the extra DEX does lessen a lot of the negative aspects of increasing your size.
kevin_video |
I know it sounds like you're down on Enlarge Person, but it's only a -1 to AC for the paladin. Potions of enlarge person would give the paladin reach and a larger damage dice which in my opinion absolutely makes up for simply -1 to AC. Wasn't what you were asking directly but it's something to consider.
If he wears the belt it’d be -1 only because he wouldn’t gain the Dex benefit. Otherwise he’d be -2. It’s up to him if he wants to do that, but so far we’re in a position where he’d never go big because of the lack of space.
Dragonborn3 |
Slim Jim |
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Well...that's awful, and lack of arcane casting will suck worse down the road. (The pally himself could pick up Dangerously Curious.)Slim Jim wrote:Just start casting Enlarge Person on the paladin.No one in the party is capable of that.
Also, that lowers the armor class, defeating the purpose he’s going for.
If he has more dexterity than his armor can accommodate, then he'd lose only the size penalty, or -1 total. In compensation, he threatens four times the real-estate.
kevin_video |
Well...that's awful, and lack of arcane casting will suck worse down the road. (The pally himself could pick up Dangerously Curious.)
Oh no, we have arcane casting. We just can't enlarge. We have limited arcane. And the paladin didn't want to waste skill points. He's got a very specific tank build in mind for skill points.
kevin_video |
Enlarge Person potions are 50gp a pop, and it's already been established that he has dexterity to spare. Get big, grab a polearm, and enjoy 20' reach.
Enlarge + Combat Reflexes = crate engine + nitrous.
Once we get access to something like that, we can consider that. Right now we're in a hamlet.
But we're good for builds and damage. Don't need tips on that. Only looking for AC boosts and raising Dex minimums on armor. Don't need advice on anything else. More so considering where our characters are and will be for quite a while before we can leave town. And enlarge person is the opposite of what he wants to do. Apologies, but further talk regarding power builds and increasing damage, and ignoring what is being asked for as per the title, will fall on deaf ears.
Gilfalas |
Even without being able to take advantage of the extra dex on AC the belt will still give him a boost to his reflex saves and Initiative at least.
At third level I can assume your paladin is only in +1 plate so he may want to just save his gold and buy some Mithril plate in the future. Once he gets it he can use his full dex bonus (I assume) and enchanting that will be a goal afterwards. At your level your not going to have the gold to buy the things that will allow his armor to take advantage of the extra dex anyways.
The only way I am aware of raising the max dex on armor is the aforementioned armor enchantment, making that plate out of mithril or taking enough levels of fighter to get armor training.
Since your third level and in a hamlet then the first two options are not going to happen and since you said he wants to play paladin then the third is not going to happen either.
The +1 plate and belt alone has your paladin rocking ~7th level wealth by level. I think your good for a while.
doomman47 |
At the moment you can do nothing, you may be able to pull something off later on when you are higher level and not out in the middle of nowhere but based on your current location and capabilities they will not be able to get that extra boost to ac via dex and they will just have to live with that for now.
Doing what is asked will require a lot of recourses and high level magic your party just doesn't have access to at the moment however if he is looking to be a party tank and draw aggro from enemies boosting damage will actually accomplish that better.
Enemies tend to ignore combatants that don't do any dmg, it wouldn't matter if he had 400 ac enemies would just ignore him if his damage is only like 1d8+2 and ever one else is doing 4 times more or higher than that.
Trust me if he only goes for ac boost he will be disappointed later on I made that mistake one and I won't be doing it again.
kevin_video |
He’s sword and board. Right now anyone that attacks the party, but ignores him, has -2 to attack and 10% spell failure, or flies into a rage and must attack him, due to Antagonize. At 4th he’s considering a level of cavalier. Other than that he’s decent for damage. He’s looking at making the shield bashing and with the high Dex go Two-Weapon.
kevin_video |
He can tank by taking away Attacks of Oppurtunity if he takes Cry Challenge.
Ooh. Will forward that.