Kabriri: ton of special summons, not a lot of plot relevance...

Pathfinder First Edition General Discussion

Kabriri has 12 special monsters his worshippers can summon and while most of them are advanced/fiendish/giant variants of themselves, that’s still a lot more versatility in summoning than any other divinity in the game. For perspective, Lamashtu, a full god and Kabriri’s superior, gets only 6 special summons. Anyone else think there’s something wrong with that?

Actually no. The assistant has to be more versatile, the boss has the assistant.

Daw wrote:
Actually no. The assistant has to be more versatile, the boss has the assistant.

In terms of Kabriri’s and Lamashtu’s relationship with each other, that’d make sense. But what I meant was how come a demigod can manage to give out 12 summons while Lamashtu can give out only 6? In that respect, their cultists would be the assistants, but one would be more versatile than the other.

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Lamashtu has 5 domains and 7 subdomains compared to Kabriri's 4 domains and 4 subdomains. Kabriri is also worshipped primarily by ghouls while Lamashtu has worshippers across many monstrous and humanoid species.

While Kabriri may offer a broader array of special summons, the actual power and versatility of him and his worshippers compared to Lamashtu and her worshippers isn't even close. A cult of Lamashtu worshippers who went to war with a cult of Kabriri worshippers for some reason are going to have a broader array of spells, domain powers, racial abilities, and more potent favored weapons. Literally the only thing Kabriri's ghouls would have going for them is a few unique summons.

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And some potent boons, I should think. Being able to entomb foes and raise them as powerful ghouls or draw on the accumulated lore of all those who have ever died (though available only to the highest of priests) is nothing to scoff at. ^_^

My Demon Lord Can Beat Up Your Demon Lord.

My Demon Lord can order your Demon Lord around. I rather doubt you are so special to Kabriri to cause it to go up against the boss.

Lamashtu isn’t the “boss” of demon lords in general.

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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

Makes perfect sense to me.

From a mechanical point of view, making Gods different from one another is something of a challenge. In order to have a unique niche, developers have to start adding more esoteric abilities.

Also, I think the idea that deities 'give out' different spells because they have greater power is somewhat of a simplification. We know that Clerics can, like other casters, engage in spell research and in theory generate new and different spells, even though these spells come from their deity. Therefore the availability of spells is more symbiotic, rather than just a one way street.

It seems likely to me Lamashtu worshipers in generally would be pretty content with the regular summon monster list. They like monsters, the list has monsters, all good. Kabriri worshipers though like to play with dead things, they don't want the regular monsters, they want brain eating undead and lots of them, so over time they have developed variations that get them what they want.

It is because Kabriri worship is more focused that the list is more varied, not because Kabriri is more powerful.

Lamashtu isn't Kabriri's 'boss'. She's the first demon to ascend to Godhood and the most powerful being in the Abyss, but she isn't the ruler of that plane or in charge of all other demons. Demons are Chaotic Evil. Unification and central government is not their thing. Demons wanting to earn her favor are likely to do as she says, but that's all the control she has outside her own realm of Kurnugia. And there are Demon Lords who oppose her, such as Nocticula. Kabriri, to the best of my knowledge, has not had his relationship with Lamashtu discussed in any cannon material. Although we can speculate that his obsession with undeath and cannibalism would clash with Lamashtu's goals of fecundity and twisted growth. So I doubt the two are close allies.

As to the question at hand, Kabriri is a specialist. Good at what he does, but focused on that to the point of exclusion. He chose to give his followers lots of summons, and not much else. Lamashtu is a generalist, proficient in many areas just as a True God should be, and decided to give her worshipers many potential gifts, summons being just a few among many.

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