Howdy
I occasionally use Pathfinder Society scenarios to mine some encounters for my homebrew campaign. I found an interesting one where the PC's are challenged by a band of Orcs for a "test of strength" with the Orcs' champion.
However, there is no mention anywhere in the scenario what this test of strength should actually be. Is this just regular one-on-one combat? The scenario stipulates that "if the PC's win, do so and so, but if the Orcs win, do so and so". If it's a regular combat, then if the Orcs win, it means they could potentially kill the PC. It doesn't make sense. This is an encounter that opens the scenario and should be a kind of skirmish, not a battle to the death.
Do you have an experience with similar situations in your games? How should this be carried out? Should I just have them duke it out with their fists for non-lethal damage? Should I let them lift heavy boulders above their heads and have them roll a strength check? The first option is more suspenseful because it's evolving, but the second option is a classic "test of strength".
What do you think?
Sometimes I really wish these scenarios would be written more clearly... but hey, it's a time saver.
Test of strength usually involves strength checks. That is to say, d20 plus strength mod only. Maybe do several different trials, such as lifting boulders, throwing stones, rolling log rounds, arm wrestling, long jump, rope climb, trail race, etc.... Maybe best of 5 wins the trial. Have the orcs steal their stuff if they only win 1, let them go on their way with some grudging respect if they win 2 and give them gifts if they win 3 to show much respect. Maybe kill one or two of the PC's if they don't win any events.
Thanks.
However, It's not really that type of encounter. The PC's are just accosted somewhere in the wilderness by a band of Orcs and are denied passage until this "test of strength" is carried out...
The Orc champion is fully statted and armed to the teeth. But the description of the encounter is puzzling. If anyone wants to look it up, it's taken from the Pathfinder scenario 4-25 The Secrets Stones Keep. Here's a quote: "Should the PCs balk at paying the orcs or otherwise refuse, Magra proposes a test of strength—a single combat between the PCs’ champion and the Broken Spine Clan’s champion."
How do you guys feel about turning this into a wrestling match or boxing match with non-lethal damage? Can it work? There are weapons that deal non-lethal damage, but we are talking just straight-up punching here. Is it simply d20 + strength modifier against touch AC and then for damage... I dunno, 1d6 or 1d8 with the strength bonus?
The main drawback is that it might take a while, a long while, until someone reaches 0. Both PC and NPC have about 100 hit points...
Lynos wrote: Thanks.
However, It's not really that type of encounter. The PC's are just accosted somewhere in the wilderness by a band of Orcs and are denied passage until this "test of strength" is carried out...
The Orc champion is fully statted and armed to the teeth. But the description of the encounter is puzzling. If anyone wants to look it up, it's taken from the Pathfinder scenario 4-25 The Secrets Stones Keep. Here's a quote: "Should the PCs balk at paying the orcs or otherwise refuse, Magra proposes a test of strength—a single combat between the PCs’ champion and the Broken Spine Clan’s champion."
How do you guys feel about turning this into a wrestling match or boxing match with non-lethal damage? Can it work? There are weapons that deal non-lethal damage, but we are talking just straight-up punching here. Is it simply d20 + strength modifier against touch AC and then for damage... I dunno, 1d6 or 1d8 with the strength bonus?
The main drawback is that it might take a while, a long while, until someone reaches 0. Both PC and NPC have about 100 hit points...
A boxing and/or wrestling match seems very reasonable. Unarmed Strike is a weapon described in the Equipment section of the Core Rulebook and the websites.
You might not limit it to wrestling or punching: the fighters might Bull Rush or Trip each other. Are Dirty Tricks allowed? Does the Orc in question have a Bite Attack? Does he use it? If the party Monk steps up and starts off inflicting nonlethal damage, but then his Orcish opponent starts Biting, does that give him permission to do lethal damage? If the Orc doesn't also have Improved Unarmed Strike, and the Monk starts racking up attacks of opportunity, do the orcs then think it's fair to Bite? All up to you.
Most cultures like this have very specific rules about this kind of thing. The orcs may or may not communicate these rules. The players may or may not already know. They should make Knowledge checks to already know, Diplomacy checks to get the rules explained to them, and Sense Motive Checks to read whether the Orc intends to cheat and whether the other orcs are okay with this. For that matter, what constitutes a good outcome? If the PC wins fair-and-square, does that mean the orcs will respect them or resent them? If the PC loses, will the party fail in the encounter? Or will the orcs like it best if the player gives the orc a really good fight, but then still loses? resulting in the orcs all drinking in celebration of their champion and the good fight the PC game him? Again, all up to you.
Maybe you can be creative about the match: maybe the combatants are balanced on a narrow bridge over a pit of mud or something.
Lynos wrote: Magra proposes a test of strength—a single combat between the PCs’ champion and the Broken Spine Clan’s champion." The 'test of strength' is just flavor. What it means is the next clause, 'a single combat between ...'
Basically, it is a one on one fight, with normal combat rules, to see who is 'stronger.'
Obviously you are free to modify it however you like, but the module is expecting a regular fight.
Yes, it's flavor, and it's referred to elsewhere in the scenario as "test of force", but it just sounded weird to me when they wrote "if the Orc wins" because it seems to take a very frivolous approach to the possibility that a PC might die in what is an almost random encounter, so I thought I might be missing something.
I guess I can put my own spin on it and decide that once one of the fighters reach a certain number of hit points the battle is over and the winner is declared, thus avoiding the possibility of a PC getting killed over this, since Barbarian does lots of damage in one strike.
And I think I will also allow and perhaps encourage maneuvers such as bull rush and trip to make it feel "dirty". I can certainly make use of it from the Orc's side of things.
Thanks.
Well, it says the test of strength only happens when the PCs refuse to pay.
Just make the scenario that if the PC is obviously losing, the NPC inflicts non-lethal damage (making the PC unlikely to die). When the PC goes unconscious have the Orc champion say the price has gone up and demand even more money/items than before and threaten that if the PCs don't pay they will kill the PC champion.
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