The cleric has one huge advantage over the witch. As a prepared divine spell caster you have access to your entire spell list. This means you can memorize any spell you need. Many of the cleric’s spells are very situational, but incredibly useful in those situations.
The witch on the other hand is limited by the spells his familiar knows. In theory the witch can learn any and all spells on their list, but usually knows significantly less. Depending on the nature of the campaign this may or may not be a big deal. In a campaign with access to learning spells the witch will have access to a decent number of spells. In more restricted campaign that may not be the case. Also if a witches familiar dies the new familiar only knows 2 spells per level of the witch.
The last thing to consider is while a witch can do fairly well as a healer it does mean you will need to acquire access to the appropriate healing spells. If you choose those as spells gained by leveling up that means you have that many less offensive spells.
Three characters on the front line can occasionally be a problem in cramped dungeons. I suspect there aren't a lot of those in a pirate campaign, but the possibility exists. On the other hand outside hexes your witch would be doing likely the same job as the arcanist. You can get some useful synergies with two battlefield control spellcasters but it takes a bit of thought on how to cooperate effectively.
Also note you've equipped the cleric with rather more gear than you'll get at first level, breastplates are expensive.
I don't think I said a cleric would be better, necessarily. It is simpler to make work. I did understand that a bad touch cleric will be on the front lines, and that using a spell most rounds on attacks leaves less for healing.
If you were a follower of Irori or some other deity with unarmed strike as their favored weapon you'd be fine to get Wis to attack with touch spells. Besmara though only has guided hand work with a rapier. You need to switch deities or totally redo your stats and feats. Also I'd have taken Wis 18/Con 14 to make earlier levels easier but YMMV.
BTW you start with an average of 140, max 240 gp. Even chain mail is 150 gp in PF.
Healing spells are something that you often don’t plan on using but end up needing anyways. Also keep in mind that healing HP is actually best done with items instead of spells. Wands of cure light wounds are one of the most efficient ways to heal HP damage. More important is condition removal, especially permanent conditions. Spells like blindness or bestow curse are fairly low level but have a duration of permanent. Without a way to deal with these type of things the party is a severe disadvantage. You may not be able to remove the condition the same day, but being able to remove it the next day makes the condition a short term problem instead of on going crippling condition.
Your stats could use some adjustment. With a 10 STR encumbrance is going to be a problem. Just your armor and weapons are going to put you almost to a heavy load. Throw in almost any kind of equipment and you will be at a heavy load. Drop down the WIS to 16 before adjustment and put it into STR. That will also give you a slight boost to climb and swim, as well as giving you the ability to carry some equipment.
As far as feats you are spending two feats to get WIS to hit. As cleric you already have a medium BAB and that should be enough to hit touch AC with. Raising your STR will give you a +1 bonus to hit in melee. Your ranged attacks are already getting a bonus from DEX. Many of the best touch spells on the cleric spell list are from the school of necromancy. Spell focus necromancy would be a better use of the feat. And if you are going to be casting in combat then you probably want combat casting.
For your domains pick Oceans and Weather. Both give you some useful attacks. Oceans gives you breath water at 8th level which should be useful in a pirate campaign.
Going for a 17 starting WIS is pretty expensive. You are already at 14 DEX so the points you save from WIS will not be enough to increase your bonus. Dropping your WIS will give you 3 points to play with. You could increase your CON to 14, or any of the stats you have at 10 to a 13. The bonus to hit from STR will apply to your touch attacks.
Don’t forget that if you are in melee with someone casting a spell provokes an AoO, unless you cast defensively. To cast defensively you need to make a d20 + your cleric level roll vs a DC of 15+ double the level of the spell. That means that at 1st level you need to roll a 16 or better to cast a 1st level spell defensively. Provoking an AoO 75% of the time is not good odds. Combat casting reduced the chance of failure by 20%. Each time you gain a new spell level the chance to cast defensively is about the same as a 1st level cleric casting a 1st level spell. You may even want to take the trait focused mind to get an extra +2. If you take both combat casting and focused mind you get a +6 bonus to concentration which gives you a 55% starting chance to avoid provoking an AoO.
In many cases you can cast and then take a 5 foot step so that you don’t provoke an AoO. There are also a decent amount of ranged touch attacks you can use. But there will be times when you will need to cast while in melee. This is particularly true of a bad touch cleric.
So I hesitate to suggest this, because Shaman is the most difficult class in Pathfinder, but have you considered a deep shaman for Skull and Shackles? I figure an Undine Deep Shaman with Steam Caster can abuse the heck out of crashing waves, and a blue-ringed octopus with the pilferer archetype would be a delightfully sneaky familiar (plus, who doesn't want an amphibious octopus on a pirate ship?)
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I am running Skull & Shackles right now. Cleric is easily the best option for the party as a whole. You will DESPERATELY need the healing power of both channeling and spellcasting! My advice to you is to change the race to aasimar (or a undine and switch out the race abilities for fast healing, amphibious (water breathing), and Swim speed 30), your deity to Besmara (there's a magic item useful to the party later made a gift to said party). Also, do whatever you have to make sure the party all has class access to Swim and Climb, if they want to survive this first book! Tell your GM to private message me. There's an alteration that must be made if the party is to survive part 3. It's very minor, but very necessary. I can also send him/her a breakdown of what is needed in the party.
Having a high Wisdom, your Cleric will likely be assigned a position where you won't need Climb much. However, do everybody a solid and tell them to take ONE rank in profession sailor if it makes sense given backstory. They will be profoundly grateful.
The great thing about the cleric is that you are not tied to one combat strategy. By changing your spell selection you can almost completely change how the character functions in combat. If you memorize touch spells for the day you are now a bad touch cleric. The next day you memorize summoning spells and you are now a summoning cleric. You can also mix and match the strategies by memorizing a mix of spells.
The only real constraints on a how a cleric functions in combat are his stats and feats. For example a cleric with low physical stats is going to have a hard time becoming a battle cleric. Lack of certain feats or abilities will make it difficult to assume certain roles. But other than that most clerics can assume just about any role.
In your case a Herald Caller would work well. From what I can see Call Heralds does not replace Spontaneous Casting so you would be able to convert any spell into either a summon monster or an inflict wound spell. Since the archetype gives you the feats to boost your summons as you level up you don’t even need to worry about that. Take the archetype and build your character as a bad touch cleric. Don’t memorize any inflict or summon spells as you can convert any of your spells as needed. Memorize your debuff and utility spells. Now each spell slot can do one of 3 things. Even if the herald caller loses the ability to spontaneously cast inflict spells there is no reason he cannot memorize them.
You will be giving up one of your domains and medium armor and using shields. On the bright side you gain two extra skill points per level. The loss of medium armor is probably not all that important. Considering your character is a low STR character and in a pirate campaign that may actually be a good thing. Swimming is a STR based skill that is not a class skill for clerics, and it takes the ACP.
If you want skills put some points into INT. I would probably go STR 10, DEX 14, CON 13, INT 12, WIS 18(with +2) CHA 10. Take your favored class bonus as a skill instead of HP. This will give you 7 skill points per level.
For traits change reactionary to Touched by the Sea to get swim as a class skill. Piccolo is probably right about needing swim. This also reduces the penalty for attacking underwater. Campaign traits tend to be more powerful so take this over others that give swim as a class skill.
You are a casting focused cleric so for your first feat go with Combat Casting. Outside of spells your ability at combat is not that good. Not being able to cast spells due to AoO will shut you down hard. Not only that, but due to not being able to use heavy armor your AC is a little lower.
For your second feat I would go with spell focus necromancy or additional traits. If you go additional traits one of the extra traits should be focused mind to get an additional +2 to concentration. For the second extra trait Blood of Dragons will allow you to pick up low light vision. From the looks of it you will have the highest perception roll in the group. Being able to farther, and distinguish color in dim light is always useful.
You should choose ocean as your domain. At 8th level you gain the ability to breathe water. The cold resistance will probably be useful. Surge is something that will probably always be useful even at higher levels. It is not clear if this ability functions at range and if so what the range is. If it does function at range it is probably one of the best first level domain abilities around. Water could also work, but Icicle does not really scale up as you level up. For the first couple of levels it will actually be pretty good, after that it will rarely be useful.
Herald Caller does not have proficiency with shields so you are taking a -1 on all attacks and a lot of skills. You would be best not using it.
It's worth noting that Harald Caller can use channeling to heal his summoned creatures regardless of range. Personally, I would skip Combat Casting and stay out of combat. You will have plenty of pets to fight for you, but YMMV.
Sometimes it is not possible to stay out of combat. A Herald Caller has an easier time avoiding combat, but for a bad touch cleric that is a lot harder. The current build he is looking at does both.
One thing to keep in mind is that your tactics early on will be a lot different than once you get a few levels. Starting out most characters don’t have they type of equipment they will normally use. They are quite frail so need to play carefully for the first few levels. Once they get around 3rd level they have better equipment and HP so can start to change their tactics. At first level your best bet is to use Cause Fear and your Icicle domain power. Cause Fear gives the target the frightened condition and last for up to 4 rounds. Doom would also be a good first level spell. Both of these are necromancy spells so the DC of the save is going to be important.
Weapon finesse would be a good 3rd level feat. By then you have access to 2nd level spells and will have enough HP that a single lucky shot is probably not going to take you out. You summons now last 3 rounds instead of 1, and your damage from touch spells is now more significant. At 5th level this build really starts to shine. You now have access to things like bestow curse and blindness. Most of these spells allow a save as well as requiring you to touch the target. At this point weapon finesse is a lot more important, but you still also need to boost the DC of the save or it does not matter.
For this reason it is better to take spell focus at 1st level and delay weapon finesse. You will get more bang for the buck with Spell focus early on. Around 7th level you need to start worrying about spell resistance. At that point you may want to consider spell penetration.
When you get some cash and have your other important magic items invest in a belt of DEX. Fast learning is not worth burning a feat on. Don’t dump everything to get two really high stats it is not worth it. Stick with the 14 DEX and spread some of the points around in other things. Don’t make your character into a one trick pony. If your INT is at least 12 and you put your favored class bonus into skills you will have 7 points per level. This should be enough to get you a reasonable number of skills at decent level. Some skills may only need a single point to make useful. A single point into professional skill sailor and sense motive is going to give you a +8 bonus. As Khan pointed out Diplomacy would be a useful skill and it is one that clerics get as a class skill. Put a few points into it and sense motive and you are the parties face.
One thing you should also be doing is memorizing the Guidance as one of your 0 level spells. Not so much for combat but for skills. It can give you a +1 bonus to a single attack roll, save or skill. Out of combat this spell is great. Mutter a quick prayer before you attempt to do most things to get a +1 on your chance.
First off, a Cleric of Besmara can take Weapon Finesse with a rapier. Weapon Focus. And this enchantment eventually: http://www.aonprd.com/MagicWeaponsDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Agile
Second, it is a VERY bad idea to take a cleric with such a spectacularly low Charisma. Did you read the channeling rules? Did you know that your channel affects EVERYONE in a 30 foot radius, not just a single PC?
Third, if you are going to dump Charisma, then just take a Dwarf for your race.
Check with you GM about the age. Most GM’s I know do not allow a starting character to take age adjustments. I do not allow that in games I run.
I also would not worry about channeling energy on this character. Since you are going for a bad touch cleric that means you are channeling negative energy. To make channel energy work you are going to need selective channel or you will probably be hitting your own party. In that case you should also have a CHA of 16 to be able to exclude all 3 other party members from your channel. At that point you are kind of stretching yourself too thin.
While having lots of options in combat is good, keep in mind that you can only do one thing at a time. It is better to be able to do a couple of things really well than to do a lot of mediocre things. Use your channel energy for situations where you are surrounded and out of range of the party. With your build if you get overwhelmed it can be dangerous. Keeping channel energy as a last ditch defense when you are about to be captured is not a bad strategy.
So, my current group is on break with the Skull and shackles campaign, so if you do not take the profession sailor, i would like to recommend being a cook/chef instead.
Clerics do have some abilities to alter food, so to me this makes a good amount of sense.
Also, keep in mind that later on your ship may take damage. So, repairing the ship may be needed. Which means if you want your character to RP a different set of profession or crafts, then he could always pick something that is in relations to the boat. Like craft boats, craft sails, or craft carpentry...
I do remember seeing Magic Siege Weapon for cleric spells, so going with a profession of siege operator or something along those lines, would also be a good mix.
Now for something completely different...
Assuming you don't want a Holy Symbol with very minor uses, you could go with a Channel Foci. Per the book, Pathfinder Companion: Adventurer’s Armory, Channel Foci include a Holy Symbol, and can be used normally as one. However, if you expand Channel Energy into a Channel Foci, then they may bring you some bonuses.
A lot of this would be expensive for your meager amount of gold you start with, but if you spend 50gp on ether a "Iron eye," "Winged fetish," or "Just Scales," then you'll have a nice extra bonus to help you out.
I've been looking at Sanctified shield, which costs 100gp, so I don't need to put away my sword to "touch" my holy symbol as a Paladin.
actually, you have to have at least one rank in profession sailor, or you have to continually make checks against seasickness.
don't look at me, I don't know off the top of my head. I don't think you need more than a point in each profession skill, as I don't know if they come into play in the other books.
I'll go profession(cook) and put some points into profession(sailor). and for channel foci, i didnt understand how can i use that. for example when i buy "iron eye" and use channel energy, on next round will i get a sacred or profane bonus to my intimidate check on next round?
A piece of general advice:
Personally, I find that long feat chains tend to create glass cannons and one trick ponies. No versatility, and dies easily.
I think it makes far more sense to first create your character with the rest of the party in mind, like what they need to function. Then, in the low levels, think defensively when you level up and want to take a feat etc. Patch up your weak spots so your PC can survive long enough to be able to eye that feat chain you so want. Ultimately, the best philosophy when creating and leveling up a PC is to simply respond to the needs of the campaign. Take note of the things that seem to be needed, and fill those needs.
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A neutral cleric of a neutral god can take the Versatile Channel feat to channel both positive and negative. This would allow you to function as a bad-touch cleric while still being able to heal your entire party with that sweet, sweet positive channel energy. Your party will appreciate you. No Selective Channel required.
How would that help a touch based Cleric? Channeling is a radius effect centered on the caster. Did I miss something when I read the class rules years ago and used them all this time?
I think Magda's thinking of that channel smite feat required to get guided hand. It's obviously more useful with negative energy, and more useful still with both options.
Though some of the best options for a bad touch cleric require domains which aren't available to any neutral cleric who wants guided hand to work with unarmed strikes, and the OP stopped looking at guided hand some time ago.
Actually your deity cannot be good to take versatile channeler. Your deity has to be neutral, which his is. This would actually be a good feat for him to take. It would allow him to use channel positive energy out of combat to heal the party. Selective channel is not required because when it is used the combat is over and the enemies are gone our under control. Since you channel the opposite energy type at two levels lower it would be better to take this feat at higher level. Taking it at 1st level will be useless.
Guided hand is a wasted feat for this build and was discarded a while ago.
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Both Guided Hand and Channel Smite always struck me as totally wasted, silly feats. Glad to see they have been discarded.
Yes, I intended to suggest Versatile Channel as a way to be both a Bad Touch Cleric and a healing resource for your party. With a Neutral deity this is an excellent option. I play a neutral-aligned negative energy variant-channel cleric whose party has been very appreciative of Versatile Channel. It has already twice saved one [somewhat reckless] PC from death, and may also have saved the entire party from defeat. No Selective Channel required, even for in-combat use. Works best if you channel primarily Positive Energy, but either way can work.
Guided Hand is generally inferior to Basic Martial Competence, which also costs less. Basic Martial Competence just means 14 STR and using a simple longspear - no feat required. This is remarkably effective for the minimal cost, although less so in high level play. There's a reason most historical armies relied on peasant spearmen.
Channel Smite seems downright silly. It's a trap. Start with an AOE effect and reduce it to only affect one target, and only if you successfully hit that target. How can that ever be effective?
Channel Smite seems downright silly. It's a trap. Start with an AOE effect and reduce it to only affect one target, and only if you successfully hit that target. How can that ever be effective?
Doing the damage as a swift action instead of a standard action and hence getting a full rounds worth of weapon attacks as well as not hurting your allies. Seems pretty effective to me.
It isn't a route I generally choose to go, but I generally don't go for melee focused clerics since I think clerics have better things to do than pretend they are just a fighter.
I played the first few books of Skulls & Shackles, Druid's are very useful in that setting - ESPECIALLY in the first book, if you're just starting.
I played a lizardman dinosaur shaman and he was one of my favorite characters ever - mostly for RP reasons, but the druid class is very versatile.
I played the first few books of Skulls & Shackles, Druid's are very useful in that setting - ESPECIALLY in the first book, if you're just starting.
I played a lizardman dinosaur shaman and he was one of my favorite characters ever - mostly for RP reasons, but the druid class is very versatile.
I dunno. I've found that beginners usually find Druids difficult, because the spells tend to suck in comparison to Clerics, and they don't heal (remove conditions, not just hp) as well. Plus, you get horrible armor, and can't shapeshift for a while, gotta do a lot of leveling up. Most of what a Druid is depends on specific abilities you get at certain levels. It's the kinda class that takes awhile to get rolling, like Wizards.
And after running the first book myself, I can't really see how Druids would be better than any other class in it.
Both Druids and shaman can make great weathermasters which is strategically valuable for a shipboard game. If your table focuses on tactical combat over strategy it might be of less value. Might want to talk to the GM about his focus.
actually we havent started yet. and i start to feel not that much distant from druid or shaman. what would be best for a summoner/debuffer?
Honestly? If it were me, I'd just stick with a straight up Cleric. You want to debuff? Easy, check out Cleric spells, they are better than most in that area. You want to buff? Clerics do that too. You want to summon? Easy, Clerics have access to all Summon Monster spells. Plus, they can heal with either spell or channel, and remove conditions like death, poison, you name it. They even get access to decent hp and moderate armor straight out of the box. Thanks to their high Charisma, they make great face man/leader types, and they NEVER get mind controlled with their super high Will save.
The only thing I don't like about the class is that Clerics only get Intelligence + 2 to skills. I think that based on their origins and current roles in the game, they should get more.
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actually we havent started yet. and i start to feel not that much distant from druid or shaman. what would be best for a summoner/debuffer?
Hexes are great for debuffing and a great addition at the low levels with few spells slots. Wandering Spirit gives great flexibility.
Wildshape are great at scouting and melee combat, but not so much for debuffing and summon. Druid are generally a more slow starter.