Strongest Gestalt Character


Advice


What's your best/favorite Gestalt builds? All 3rd party content welcome.

Sovereign Court

Human
8/14/12/14/10/18

Traits: Reactionary, Maestro of the Society

Master Summoner/Bard

Feats & Things
1) Master Performer, Human B: Improved Initiative
2) Summoner B: Augment Summoning, Versatile Performance: Oratory
3) Superior Summoning
4) ASI: +1 CHA
5) Versatile Summon Monster (Aerial, Aquatic)
6) Expanded Versatility: Use Magic Device
7) Evolved Summon Monster
8) ASI: +1 CHA
9) Grand Master Performer

Summon multiple leopards/lions/tigers/dire lions/dire tigers (depending on level) as a standard action, sing your song to give them huge bonuses (getting to +7 to hit and damage with the right gear, as a move action).

Lots of spell slots (with the ability to summon even more spells).

Lots of skill ranks with fantastic social skills and knowledge.

Build eidolon as pocket rogue, give it super high Disable Device, Survival, etc.


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Aren't there a couple dozen of these threads already? What do you want that you can't find with a quick search?


Crossblooded Accursed Orc Bloodline Mutation Sorcerer + Cyclopean Seer Oracle are by far the strongest gestalt, though not necessarily the best or the most fun.

Sanctified Slayer Ravener Hunter Inquisitor + Ranger covers pretty much all your bases, has numerous offensive buffs, as well as access to Stalwart + Improved Evasion.

If third party stuff is allowed, I've recently fallen in love with a Host of Heroes Aegis + a Living Legend Soulknife. Both of these Medium-esque Occult archetypes give the classes tremendous amounts of versatility, and thematically the classes fit very well together.

I've also played a Spheres of Power Mageknight mixed with a Kirthfinder Rogue that was quite the force to be reckoned with. Spheres in general really gives you access to almost anything you could want, while Kirthfinder provides a lot of power. The upgraded Kirthfinder skills also helped a bunch.


avr wrote:
Aren't there a couple dozen of these threads already? What do you want that you can't find with a quick search?

Most of these threads don't allow for all 3rd party material. I want to see people's 3rd party builds.


Magus/Stalker. Magus is built around wanting to crit spells and the Stalker is built around crit finishing.

You can pick up maneuvers to help you out when spells can't or just grab boosts to increase your damage. If you go the Archer Magus route, Solar Wind offers a lot of boosts for damage. Sadly you don't get a good Reflex Save, only 3/4ths BAB, and d8 Hit Die.

Aegis/Soulknife. Good all saves, full BAB, 4 + Int skills. The metaforge doesn't do the two classes justice.

Shifter (Spheres of Power) + Striker. The Shifter gets a Path of War archetype that completely destroys its usefulness as a shifter, but it begs for Spheres of Might more than anything else.

Grand Lodge

I still say one of the most broken gestalt builds is still just a straight up Druid/Cleric.

2 tier 1 full caster classes with some of the most powerful spells in the game, full powered shape shifting, insane levels of healing, all while 100% sharing stat dependency between the 2 classes.

Sovereign Court

Slyme wrote:

I still say one of the most broken gestalt builds is still just a straight up Druid/Cleric.

2 tier 1 full caster classes with some of the most powerful spells in the game, full powered shape shifting, insane levels of healing, all while 100% sharing stat dependency between the 2 classes.

Powerful gestalt builds are all about action economy. It doesn't matter how many spell slots you have if all you're doing is still just one spell per round.

Druid is great, but adding in Cleric doesn't really give you a lot. It's not making you as good as two characters. One exception being if you go Evangelist cleric, for the bard song. Then you're both giving yourself something to do with your move action and buffing your pet.

Also, much as I love Druid, you'd likely be better off playing Razmiran Priest Sorcerer with Sylvan bloodline. More spell slots, broader spell access, and a companion that is easy to raise over level thanks to items that boost bloodline effective levels.


For mundane melee, I have been having fun with this combination:
Viking Fighter/Wild Stalker Ranger.
It has Fighter bonus feats AND Ranger combat style feats, Ranger skills, oh and Barbarian rage/rage powers. Strongest? Probably not, but fun, though.

As for strongest, I don't know, but here are some powerful combinations:

Kensai Magus/Sylvian Stalker Slayer.
Strong assassin build.

Monk of the Four Winds & Sensei Monk/Evangelist Cleric.
Strong party buffer build.

Siegebreaker Fighter/Living Avalanche Brawler.
Strong bowling ball build.

Zen Archer Monk/ Inquisitor.
Strong archer build.

Investigator/Slayer.
Strong Rogue build.

Warpriest/ Brawler.
Strong Fighter build.


For the eviluz, Antipaladin/Synthesis Summoner.


Ok. I'm putting this together, slowly, using memory and my phone, so I may be missing something.

This is for an upcoming gestalt 8, mythic 4 game.

Dwarf (male)

Witch (white haired witch/ mirror witch) - fighter (weapon master) 8
Champion 4

1 Power Attack
1 Cleave
2 Weapon Focus (beard)
3 Goblin Cleaver
4 Weapon Specialization (beard)
5 Great Cleave
6 Cut from the Air
7 Orc Hewer
8 Combat Reflexes

Sudden Attack
T1 Meat Shield
T2 Uncanny Grappler
T3 Master Grappler
T4 Maneuver Master

T1 Mythic Paragon
T3 Combat Reflexes

Assuming I made no mistakes, that's:
Cleave all targets medium or smaller within 15' with beard, each hit grabs and throw/)lcrush/swing, one constrict per round

Deflect projectiles with successful aoo (no limit) with beard

Stares at his mirror in the morning to study his spells

I have absolutely no idea if this is viable but it sounds fun :-D


In general the best gestalt is always
full caster 20//Something that gets extra actions you can use for casting

Nothing that gives extra actions usable for casting stands out to me immediately though.


3rd party stuff. A steelfist commando warlord (Dreamscarred Press' Path of War) can provide boosts, BAB and punchingness for a spellcaster who likes touch spells, like an eldritch scrapper sorcerer (probably a debuff-centered bloodline like wildblooded: void-touched), or a wilder (Dreamscarred Press' Psionics).

TL;DR - steelfist commando warlord // wilder (pain surge or raging surge)

Of course ranged damage or effects just makes life easier. You can attack creatures that can't attack you back, you usually make a full attack if you're using weapons. Touch attacks are the most reliable; many things have disturbingly high saves relative to your save DC at low or mid-levels. An armiger (Spheres of Might) makes a surprisingly good TWF gunslinger and an eldritch archer magus adds buffs or spells tacked on to the bullets, without slowing your rate of fire.

TL;DR - armiger // eldritch archer magus

But battlefield control is the ultimate power. An incanter (Spheres of Power) with master of mysteries can do some passive counterspelling, and sphere specialization (divination) duplicates the best wizard school. Various spheres can do battlefield control, e.g. war (requires cooperative allies), nature or time. Those leave them short of feats and squishy. A psychic warrior (Dreamscarred Press' Psionics) fixes both, even if the bonus feats won't be used for SoP magic they can free up the general feats to be exclusively dedicated to that. Also don't underestimate using hustle power to make powers a move action while using spheres with your standard action so as not to burn up power points with both actions.

TL;DR - incanter (master of mysteries & sphere spec: divination replacing bonus feats) // psychic warrior


I have recently become obsessed with Spheres of Might. I spend a great deal of my time as a melee oriented character, so anything that buffed that up was always appealing. My most recent experiment with this was a Coiled Blade Fighter//Conscript.

Coiled blade is an Archetype for fighter that trades out fairly little and gives you 20 sphere talents over 20 levels. Combine that with the 30(+) you can get from Conscript, and it makes for an impressive machine. Several of the spheres grant you "ranks" in a given skill equal to your HD, which really helps with the low skill ranks. Very versatile and utilitarian.


The main problem with double spheres of might is eventually you just run into too many options and don't need anymore talents. Magical talents can at least be spent on Summons. I feel like the Runeslinger/Conscript would be better if you want to go full martial.

That being said, I feel like a buffer/support class, most likely bard, with the Incanter just spamming out summons and the bard talents focusing on buffs/healing would be crazy.


Strongest Gestalt Character? Ok, sure.

For race lets take Trox so we can get +8 to strength. 2 of that are from size which becomes important later.

We're making a Getalt character here, using 3rd party stuff. Lets just assume we can have perfect stats because why not? 18 str base, +6 for race +2 for size (large). We can frenzy to get +2 (racial) strength for 1 min once a day.

Ragechemist 18/Dragon Disciple 4/Sorcerer 17 (Cross blooded Draconic/Orc)Barbarian 1.

Ragechemist takes Grand Mutagen as a discovery for an Alchemical +10 strength.

Dragon Disciple 4 provides 4 strength advancement.

Orc Bloodline provides inherent +6 strength bonus at 17th. Also a +6 size bonus usable for 17 min a day that conflicts with the racial size bonus of +2.

Casting Giant Form 2 will get a +8 size bonus to strength anyways.

A Belt of some kind will get a +6 enhancement bonus to Strength.

Wishes provide an inherent bonus which won't stack with the Orc Bloodline power.

Rage will provide a +4 moral bonus for 2 rounds.

Level advancement will pump our starting 24 strength (18+6 for race w/o size bonus) +5 (20 levels of advancement) to 29.

So strength is 29 + 4 (dragon disciple advancement) + 6 (inherent bonus) + 6 (enhancement bonus) + 8 (size bonus- giant form 2) + 10 (Alchemical Bonus) + 4 (moral bonus - rage) + 2 (racial bonus -frenzy) = 69 strength.

If anyone can think of another strength bonus, 2 levels can be shaven off of the ragechemist without sacrificing any strength.

Special mention: 20th Cleric with Strength Domain would have a special ability that lets them add their level strength for level minutes per day...but only for strength checks and skills. You can't call that real strength!!!


SorrySleeping wrote:

The main problem with double spheres of might is eventually you just run into too many options and don't need anymore talents. Magical talents can at least be spent on Summons. I feel like the Runeslinger/Conscript would be better if you want to go full martial.

That being said, I feel like a buffer/support class, most likely bard, with the Incanter just spamming out summons and the bard talents focusing on buffs/healing would be crazy.

I get that. I tend to shy away from summons because of how much they can slow things down. I'm also not fond of reminding one of the other players at my table that they are a thing, because he loves playing them in the style of Diablo 2 Necromancer and having as many as possible. Really causes a traffic jam when his turn alone would take 30 minutes. Plus I do crazy Prince of Persia stuff with my characters, so having the extra to dump into the Athletics Sphere works for me lol


Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Based on the following principles:
1) Spells are stronger than just about any other option; at least one "half" should be a 9/9 caster
2) If both "halves" are casters, they should use the same casting stat
3) "Free" (i.e., class features rather than WBL) magic items are also good
4) Full BAB (or equivalent) makes the character well-rounded; they don't need to "waste" spell slots on minor encounters/opponents

Arcanist (blade adept)//occultist (Trappings of the Warrior panoply) for melee-focus; Arcane Armor Training at 3rd, retrain for Quicken Spell at 10th-11th level

Elf oracle (ancient lorekeeper*, Wood mystery**)//summoner*** for archery-focus; add Nature Soul/Animal Ally/Boon Companion for a second "pet" (this is an option open to any character)

If you want "strongest" with the highest Str:

Bloodrager 5/dragon disciple 4/bloodrager +11//alchemist**** with Skill Focus (Knowledge (Planes))/Eldritch Heritage (Abyssal)/Improved Eldritch Heritage (Strength of the Abyss); Str boosts from rage (morale, up to +6 with Greater Bloodrage) and mutagen (alchemical, up to +8 with True Mutagen), +4 Str from dragon disciple, and +6 total inherent from Strength of the Abyss, on top of normal advancement and a magic belt (enhancement)*****

*- to pick up gravity bow, true strike, etc.
**- for the Wood Bond revelation; combined with the elf alternate favored class bonus, the character has just about the same attack bonus as a full BAB character with bows (and other weapons made primarily of wood), even before divine favor/divine power
***- biped eidolon proficient with a bow for more archery
****- probably beastmorph and vivisectionist archetypes (they stack); extra abilities with mutagen and +10d6 Sneak Attack
*****- using Meirril's numbers: 29 + 4 (dragon disciple) + 6 (enhancement) + 6 (inherent) + 8 (alchemical) + 6 (morale) + 2 (racial) + 8 (size) = 69


Dragonchess Player wrote:

If you want "strongest" with the highest Str:

Bloodrager 5/dragon disciple 4/bloodrager +11//alchemist**** with Skill Focus (Knowledge (Planes))/Eldritch Heritage (Abyssal)/Improved Eldritch Heritage (Strength of the Abyss); Str boosts from rage (morale, up to +6 with Greater Bloodrage) and mutagen (alchemical, up to +8 with True Mutagen), +4 Str from dragon disciple, and +6 total inherent from Strength of the Abyss, on top of normal advancement and a magic belt (enhancement)*****

*- to pick up gravity bow, true strike, etc.
**- for the Wood Bond revelation; combined with the elf alternate favored class bonus, the character has just about the same attack bonus as a full BAB character with bows (and other weapons made primarily of wood), even before divine favor/divine power
***- biped eidolon proficient with a bow for more archery
****- probably beastmorph and vivisectionist archetypes (they stack); extra abilities with mutagen and +10d6 Sneak Attack
*****- using Meirril's numbers: 29 + 4 (dragon disciple) + 6 (enhancement) + 6 (inherent) + 8 (alchemical) + 6 (morale) + 2 (racial) + 8 (size) = 69

I'm confused. How does Bloodrager work? Can a Bloodrager choose powers from the Sorcerer version of their bloodline? A 16 Bloodrager should have Abyssal Bloodrage which gives +8 str moral bonus from raging. It doesn't have Strength from the Abyss which is from the Sorcer version of the same blood line as far as I can tell. Unless there is a way to do that?

Not that the Bloodrager/Alchemist couldn't use 5 wishes to get a +5 inherent bonus to strength. Overall it picks up 1 strength over the sorcerer. But it also loses 2 strength from not being able to cast Giant Strength 2. Alchemist can cast Giant Stregth 1 (+6 size bonus). I haven't looked into every polymorph spell the alchemist (or sorcerer) could cast so there might be better forms for strength. I used giant because it retains all of your normal abilities and it was better than the Orc bloodlines ability to get +6 size bonus.

Also DragonChess opted to not make his build a Ragechemist which would give his mutagen +2 strength. I opted not to go for True Mutagen because its biggest boost is the same +8 that Grand Mutagen gives. I will say that the downside from Ragechemist is huge but this is just for 'strongest', not for best at fighting.

So my final estimation is that DragonChess Player's build is a 68 strength. Am I wrong? (+2 moral bonus, -1 inherent, -2 size from my build)


Meirill wrote:
Can a Bloodrager choose powers from the Sorcerer version of their bloodline? A 16 Bloodrager should have Abyssal Bloodrage which gives +8 str moral bonus from raging. It doesn't have Strength from the Abyss which is from the Sorcer version of the same blood line as far as I can tell. Unless there is a way to do that?

He's taking Draconic Bloodline through Bloodrager to qualify for Dragon Disciple. Then he gets the Abyssal Bloodline power through the Eldritch Heritage feats. Looks legit to me.


* Extre mood swings would add +1(+2 if drunk) to all morale bonuses.
* Courageous weapon adds up to +2 to morale bonuses.
* Fascinated by the mundane adds another +1.
* Amplified rage, gives an extra +4 if an ally (say a familiar who can rage). is adjacent.
* Blood vengeance helps to maintain the bonus at +2 if the ally dies.

* Raging Vitality makes them the characters with most Con at ~80 Con when drunk and a raging ally is adjacent.

Redistributed Might, Makes them the 'fastest' (dextruous?) characters at ~78 Dex when drunk and an ally is adjacent.

You guys just need away to remove age penalties (or aging period).

* P.S. You can get an extra +6(+4) if you can manage to get Nocticula's Profane Ascension. And, +6 sacred bonus to all stats, if you steal the weapons of the herald of freedom and liberty (no idea of actual name). For a grand total of ~90 (88) Str/Dex and ~90 (92) Con.


Courageous weapons' enhancement to morale bonuses only applies to saves against fear.

Also what is the "Enhanced Morale" requirement for Redistributed Might? I can't seem to find it.


I think it was scrapped from the source. Also I was using the old version of courageous which didn't specify.


Well, just going off of how much damage my current character can dish out, a Hunter/Unchained Rogue gestalt can be a real melee powerhouse. Especially once the AoO chain reaction starts.

I actually did a build for that and it got mentioned in a gestalt guide.


Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
juantamad wrote:
Meirill wrote:
Can a Bloodrager choose powers from the Sorcerer version of their bloodline? A 16 Bloodrager should have Abyssal Bloodrage which gives +8 str moral bonus from raging. It doesn't have Strength from the Abyss which is from the Sorcer version of the same blood line as far as I can tell. Unless there is a way to do that?
He's taking Draconic Bloodline through Bloodrager to qualify for Dragon Disciple. Then he gets the Abyssal Bloodline power through the Eldritch Heritage feats. Looks legit to me.

Right. Bloodrager class details. Bloodrager bloodlines aren't exactly the same as sorcerer bloodlines, even though they have the same names. There is a FAQ about the dragon disciple working with the bloodrager Draconic bloodline, as well as sorcerer, however. Eldritch Heritage, Improved Eldritch Heritage, and Greater Eldritch Heritage feats allow characters to gain a limited selection of bloodline powers from a sorcerer bloodline; with the restriction that the character cannot select a bloodline with the feats that they already have.

The total Str is the same as Meirill's, but (with 16 bloodrager levels) more rounds per day. Plus, bloodrager is full BAB, so my version is +19 BAB at 20th level vs. +14 or +15 BAB for Meirill's version.

Also, I'll take a beastmorph vivisectionist for the beast shape abilities* added to the mutagen and sneak attack progression over an extra +2 Str (even before considering the penalties) from ragechemist and bombs. Just get a flanking partner before learning greater invisibility as a 4th-level extract.

*- senses like darkvision, movement modes like flight, special attacks like pounce, etc.


Instead of strongest, how about the weakest? (Created for a 9th level, 3rd tier mythic game)

Halfling monk (martial artist)//magus (hexcrafter)

Feats:
1 Iron Will
1 Dodge
2 Combat Reflexes
3 Bolster Jinx
5 Malicious Eye
5 Hex Strike (Evil Eye)
6 Gorgon's Fist
7 Sluggish Jinx
9 Great Fortitude

Cackle, Misfortune, and Evil Eye
Mythic Hexes and Titans Bane

Cast Reduce Person (if the target is medium)

Move: move to opponent's square
Free: mp for standard
Standard (from amazing init): Misfortune
Standard: cast Bestow Curse
Free: stunning fist (sickened)
Free: punch
Swift: hex strike (evil eye)

Target must roll 2 saves (4 if mythic)

If the save for Misfortune fails, all subsequent saves require two rolls to succeed.
If the other saves fail, that's:
-3 fort & will, -1 ref, att, & init (jinx)
-4 fort, will, and ref (evil eye)
-4 penalty on attack rolls, saves, ability checks, and skill checks (bestow curse)
–2 penalty on all attack rolls, weapon damage rolls, saving throws, skill checks, and ability checks (sickened)

-13 fort & will, -11 ref, -7 att & init, -6 ability & skill checks, and -2 weapon damage

Damage is like 1d4 or 1d6, but...

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