Sneak Magic Missile


Rules Questions


I have a player who really wants to play an Arcane Trickster*
Before I'm going to say anything at all about that, need to know: can you sneak attack with Magic Missiles? I can't find anywhere where it says that you have to make an attack rool to get sneak attack.

Also, am I blind, or can Arcane Tricksters make sneak attacks against multiple opponents, assuming they can achieve surprise or otherwise deny their targets Dex-to-AC?

Or should I expect 5 Sneak Attacks (against different targets), unerringly hotting, by CL9?

* Undoubtedly inspired by a character from a recent, reasonably popular, video game.


The wording of the sneak attack ability assumes that a weapon is used. While Ray spells (which require attack rolls to hit) are counted as weapons, Magic Missile is not a ray spell and therefore does not trigger a Sneak Attack.


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Sneak attack requires an attack. Magic missiles dont attack they just hit.


The Arcane Trickster capstone does allow magic missile to sneak attack once as it just says, "you add sneak atk to a damaging spell."

Grand Lodge

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Two different questions in this thread.

I'm linking the FAQ, and I've quoted the relevant sections below.
https://paizo.com/paizo/faq/v5748nruor1fm#v5748eaic9qqm

Spells generally only deal sneak attack damage if they require an attack roll (even a touch attack), and that damage is only applied to a single target of the spell.

The capstone ability of the arcane trickster allows sneak attack to be applied to any damage dealing spell. That damage only applies once per spell. Multiple target spells (like magic missle), only get one missle boosted to one flat-footed opponent. Area effect spells get the whole area increased (for those who are flat-footed)

So no, you won't be seeing extra sneak attack to all 5 targets with magic missle, only one and only after level 10 arcane trickster. Otherwise you need to you a ray attack for sneak attack, and it still only deals sneak attack damage to one flat-footed target.

First quote from FAQ:

Sneak Attack: Can I add sneak attack damage to simultaneous attacks from a spell?

No. For example, scorching ray fires simultaneous rays at one or more targets, and the extra damage is only added once to one ray, chosen by the caster when the spell is cast.
Spell-based attacks which are not simultaneous, such as multiple attacks per round by a 8th-level druid using flame blade, may apply sneak attack damage to each attack so long as each attack qualifies for sneak attack (the target is denied its Dex bonus or the caster is flanking the target).

Second Quote from FAQ:
How does the Surprise Spells class feature of the Arcane Trickster prestige class (Core Rulebook, page 378) work with spells like magic missile and fireball?

The Surprise Spells class feature allows the Arcane Trickster to add his sneak attack dice to spells that deal damage that target flat-footed foes. This damage is only applied once per spell. In the case of fireball this means it affects all targets in the area, with each getting a save to halve the damage (including the sneak attack damage). In the case of magic missile, the extra damage is only added once to one missile, chosen by the caster when the spell is cast.


Thank you for clearing that up for me! :)


LadyGrayRose wrote:
The wording of the sneak attack ability assumes that a weapon is used. While Ray spells (which require attack rolls to hit) are counted as weapons, Magic Missile is not a ray spell and therefore does not trigger a Sneak Attack.

But where does it actually say that sneak attacks require an attack roll, other than implicitly from the Surprise Spells text?


RoseCrown wrote:
LadyGrayRose wrote:
The wording of the sneak attack ability assumes that a weapon is used. While Ray spells (which require attack rolls to hit) are counted as weapons, Magic Missile is not a ray spell and therefore does not trigger a Sneak Attack.
But where does it actually say that sneak attacks require an attack roll, other than implicitly from the Surprise Spells text?

It comes from 3.0 D&D which pathfinder is based on. Outside of the FAQ listed above I'm not sure if it's clearly specified in pathfinder or not.

There is this thread though which talks about it and provides refrences to where it comes from in 3.0.

Grand Lodge

RoseCrown wrote:
LadyGrayRose wrote:
The wording of the sneak attack ability assumes that a weapon is used. While Ray spells (which require attack rolls to hit) are counted as weapons, Magic Missile is not a ray spell and therefore does not trigger a Sneak Attack.
But where does it actually say that sneak attacks require an attack roll, other than implicitly from the Surprise Spells text?

In sneak attack it states:

The rogues attack deals extra damage...

Spells are not considered an attack. The exception is if they require an attack roll, such as rays, they are then treated as attacks, allowing critical hits, sneak attack, etc.

Note that you must also be within 30' to apply sneak attack damage to ranged attacks.


Quote:
Note that you must also be within 30' to apply sneak attack damage to ranged attacks.

Normally, you need to be 30' at least 2 ways to increase that range. 1 of which is an item. (Just saying it for ref).

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