Dirty tricks


Skills, Feats, Equipment & Spells


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Hello everyone I have questions concerning the new skill systems. So I have a player who likes to think outside of the box and stumped me a few times as a GM because of of how the new skills work. I know I have the final say on skills working or not but I want your opinion.
So the first action was "cutting the belt". This would be cutting the belt with a scabbard attached so that your weapon drops to the ground. The player was grabbed so she wanted to cause a distraction for the enemy.
The next action was as equally as unorthodox. She wanted to pull down pants as a "dirty trick" so she again wanted to cause a distraction enough to get away after being knocked prone.
Now for both actions I ruled that Thievery was the best skill to use and the opponent it was against their Reflex DC.

What do you guys think?


I would also rule thievery or attack with some circumstantial penalties for the initiator.

but having said that, i would be careful what you award for such cases.

I mean, normally you can't pull pants off a combatant. For several reasons, for starters, 100% everyone is wearing a tight belt (there's no elastic waistband or anything) so in general you would first have to unbuckle, then pull, and that's only if he's not wearing any sort of armor, even leather armor should extend below the waistline.

Then, you would basically need both hands open, make something like a grapple check to actually grab him by the pants, and then pull them down. in short, too much hassle for too little gain (gain would probably be something like hampered 5 until the target spends 1 action to pull them back up)

Similary, if you manage to reach with your dagger the belt of an opponent with such deadly precision that you can cut it, then why not stab him in the gut and deal damage as well? I mean, At that point, "attacking the belt" is almost an attack.

Keep in mind that CRB atm is missing the actual rules of "attacking an attended/equipped" object. But at some point we would get those rules for sure (sunder basically).

Lastly, belts and scabbards are 2 seperate things.

just cutting a belt wouldn't make the belt drop.

And cutting the scabbard, 99% of the people would automatically ignore it and continue fighting, i don't think that's even remotely distracting, i mean, in a lot of cases swordmen even discard their scabbards themselves for mobility. But that's my personal opinion.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Garion Beckett wrote:
Now for both actions I ruled that Thievery was the best skill to use and the opponent it was against their Reflex DC.

Sounds right. I'd make it Trained only. Would be nice if they incorporated this (and Steal) into Thievery as Combat Maneuvers.


shroudb wrote:

I would also rule thievery or attack with some circumstantial penalties for the initiator.

but having said that, i would be careful what you award for such cases.

I mean, normally you can't pull pants off a combatant. For several reasons, for starters, 100% everyone is wearing a tight belt (there's no elastic waistband or anything) so in general you would first have to unbuckle, then pull, and that's only if he's not wearing any sort of armor, even leather armor should extend below the waistline.

Then, you would basically need both hands open, make something like a grapple check to actually grab him by the pants, and then pull them down. in short, too much hassle for too little gain (gain would probably be something like hampered 5 until the target spends 1 action to pull them back up)

Similary, if you manage to reach with your dagger the belt of an opponent with such deadly precision that you can cut it, then why not stab him in the gut and deal damage as well? I mean, At that point, "attacking the belt" is almost an attack.

Keep in mind that CRB atm is missing the actual rules of "attacking an attended/equipped" object. But at some point we would get those rules for sure (sunder basically).

Lastly, belts and scabbards are 2 seperate things.

just cutting a belt wouldn't make the belt drop.

And cutting the scabbard, 99% of the people would automatically ignore it and continue fighting, i don't think that's even remotely distracting, i mean, in a lot of cases swordmen even discard their scabbards themselves for mobility. But that's my personal opinion.

Quite Hilarious fun times after the death of AOOs.


ChibiNyan wrote:
shroudb wrote:

I would also rule thievery or attack with some circumstantial penalties for the initiator.

but having said that, i would be careful what you award for such cases.

I mean, normally you can't pull pants off a combatant. For several reasons, for starters, 100% everyone is wearing a tight belt (there's no elastic waistband or anything) so in general you would first have to unbuckle, then pull, and that's only if he's not wearing any sort of armor, even leather armor should extend below the waistline.

Then, you would basically need both hands open, make something like a grapple check to actually grab him by the pants, and then pull them down. in short, too much hassle for too little gain (gain would probably be something like hampered 5 until the target spends 1 action to pull them back up)

Similary, if you manage to reach with your dagger the belt of an opponent with such deadly precision that you can cut it, then why not stab him in the gut and deal damage as well? I mean, At that point, "attacking the belt" is almost an attack.

Keep in mind that CRB atm is missing the actual rules of "attacking an attended/equipped" object. But at some point we would get those rules for sure (sunder basically).

Lastly, belts and scabbards are 2 seperate things.

just cutting a belt wouldn't make the belt drop.

And cutting the scabbard, 99% of the people would automatically ignore it and continue fighting, i don't think that's even remotely distracting, i mean, in a lot of cases swordmen even discard their scabbards themselves for mobility. But that's my personal opinion.

Quite Hilarious fun times after the death of AOOs.

AOO???


In this context, I assume "AOO" stands for "Attack of Opportunity." In the first edition of Pathfinder, the player's attacks would have qualified as Sunder or Dirty Trick combat maneuvers, which give the opponent a free attack against the user unless she has feats that say otherwise.


I rather miss dirty tricks. Had one player that would commonly used to pocket sand to blind enemies and wads of fishing line to entangle. Now he has to play Warframe to blind enemies with pocket sand.

Community / Forums / Archive / Pathfinder / Playtests & Prerelease Discussions / Pathfinder Playtest / Player Rules / Skills, Feats, Equipment & Spells / Dirty tricks All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.
Recent threads in Skills, Feats, Equipment & Spells