Suli's Elemental Assault (Su) and natural attacks


Rules Questions


Elemental Assault (Su) Once per day as a swift action, a suli can shroud her arms in acid, cold, electricity, or fire. This lasts for one round per level, and can be dismissed as a free action. Unarmed strikes with her arms or hands (or attacks with weapons held in those hands) deal +1d6 points of damage of the appropriate energy type.

I was wondering could a Suli PC use this with arm claw natural attacks. I know unarmed strikes do not count as natural attacks and vice versa. I know it says it works with held weapons in hand, would claws be counted as held weapons.


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Pathfinder Card Game, Companion Subscriber

Claws are definitely not considered held weapons, but a GM should definitely allow this. Most rules and buffs for PCs aren't written with natural weapons in mind, but things that affect your unarmed strikes should affect natural weapons using the same limbs unless there's a very good reason they shouldn't (such as trying to apply a bonus from your brass knuckles to your claw attacks - you're not hitting with the brass knuckles! But if your entire arm is on fire, that includes your claw, ergo your claw should do fire damage just like your fist, or elbow, or shoulder...).

I swear I saw something in a rulebook somewhere that said something similar, but I can't recall where yet, so for now I can only give you opinion. If I find it, I'll update with rule support.


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I found this faq about a Magus's Spell Combat(Ex) Ability.

Spell Combat(Ex)

At 1st level, a magus learns to cast spells and wield his weapons at the same time. This functions much like two-weapon fighting, but the off-hand weapon is a spell that is being cast. To use this ability, the magus must have one hand free (even if the spell being cast does not have somatic components), while wielding a light or one-handed melee weapon in the other hand. As a full-round action, he can make all of his attacks with his melee weapon at a –2 penalty and can also cast any spell from the magus spell list with a casting time of 1 standard action (any attack roll made as part of this spell also takes this penalty). If he casts this spell defensively, he can decide to take an additional penalty on his attack rolls, up to his Intelligence bonus, and add the same amount as a circumstance bonus on his concentration check. If the check fails, the spell is wasted, but the attacks still take the penalty. A magus can choose to cast the spell first or make the weapon attacks first, but if he has more than one attack, he cannot cast the spell between weapon attacks.

Faq:

Magus: When using spell combat, can the weapon in my other hand be an unarmed strike or a natural weapon?

Yes, so long as the weapon is a light or one-handed melee weapon and is associated with that hand. For example, unarmed strikes, claws, and slams are light melee weapons associated with a hand, and therefore are valid for use with spell combat. A tail slap is not associated with a hand, and therefore is not valid for use with spell combat.

I think a ruling like this justifies that the suli's elemental assault can be used with claw attacks associated with the hand.

Shadow Lodge

Claws are on your hands, so Elemental Assault works.


As far as I can tell, natural attacks work in place of weapons where appropriate, even if it's a bit odd with the language. If I recall right, Lead Blades is supposed to work with natural attacks, even though technically it says "All melee weapons you are carrying". The part of the text that says "those arms" also supports it.


as per weapon finesse feat, natural weapons are considered light weapons,so unless it's specifically mentioned manufactured weapons anything that talk about weapon work with them. (not going into bab attacks which specifically call them out)
the suli just need them to be natural weapons on his arms (claws work, as opposed to ,say bite, which is with a mouth)

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