Goblins.... +2 Dex... +2.... Cha?!


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TL:DR - I don't believe Goblins should have +2 Dex, +2 Cha, -2 Wis, +2 Free; I believe that Goblins should have +2 Dex, +2 Con, -2 Wis, +2 Free. It makes more sense with their biography and common background.

Okay... So hear me out about this: Generation 1 Goblins were all +4 Dex with -2 Cha and -2 Wis. While I understand that these bonuses and penalties needed to be changed for balance, I don't believe they should be completely neglected either. Because of this, I don't believe Charisma should be one of the Goblin's mandatory +2 Stats. Not only that, but there are several things in the Pathfinder 2e Playtest Book which would point to Charisma not being a manditory key stat for the Goblins.

You are welcome to disagree with me, but please allow me to present my arguments based on the information described in their racial biography. I am going to take a few moments to break down what they say a Goblin is and should be, and why Charisma just doesn't make sense.

Pathfinder 2e Playtest PDF wrote:
Charisma: This score measures your character’s strength of personality, personal magnetism, and ability to influence the thoughts and moods of others. Charisma is an important statistic for bards and sorcerers, and it grants benefits to clerics and paladins. Charisma also determines your character’s Resonance Points (see page 376).

This is the in-game description of Charisma for Pathfinder 2e. Its safe to say that, when comparing this to the Goblin's biography description, it doesn't make sense why a Goblin would naturally gain +2 Charisma. Key word "Naturally". I don't believe that Charisma should be a Goblin's penalty, but I do believe that it should not be a secondary bonus for them. My arguments are presented below.

Pathfinder 2e Playtest PDF wrote:
Even those goblins who break from their destructive past often subtly perpetuate some of the qualities that have been tied to the creatures for millennia.

^THIS^ is one of they key reasons I believe Goblins should not gain Charisma as a secondary stat. Unfortunately, Goblins have a stigma to them which dilute their ability integrate with others. I'm not saying that they completely lack this ability, but I don't believe they'll be able to influence people with their "Good Looks" like a Halfling might be able to. I guess their repolsive background might count as "influencing the thoughts and moods of others", but in a very negative way.

Pathfinder 2e Playtest PDF wrote:
Goblins tend to flock to strong leaders, fiercely protecting those companions who have protected them from physical harm or offered a sympathetic ear when they learn of the goblins’ woes.

Another reason I believe Goblins shouldn't have naturally high Charisma is because of the quote above. Charisma is a stat that should measures a character’s strength of personality. Flocking to strong leaders and protecting companions who gave them a shoulder to cry on does not market me to believe they have a strong personality. Loyal? - Maybe yes, Charismatic? - Not really. This may be interpenetrated through other means, and its quiet possibly for a Goblin to take charge and take the "Strong Leader" roll for other Goblins, but this seems more like an odd case than the rule.

Pathfinder 2e Playtest PDF wrote:
Some goblins remain deeply fascinated with fire, or fearlessly devour a meal that might turn others’ stomachs. Others are endless tinkerers and view their companions’ trash simply as components of gadgets yet to be made.

"But what other stats can we give these... things?" I hear you asking. Well, if not Charisma, I believe Constitution should be their secondary +2 Stat. Because of their nasty habit of getting burned or scarfing down rotten food, I believe that this would make much more sense than Charisma. (Tell me how Charismatic it is to have your pet eat the rotten food in your garbage).

Pathfinder 2e Playtest PDF wrote:
Occasionally, fellow adventurers find these proclivities unsettling or odd, but more often than not, goblins’ friends consider these qualities endearing.

Some people find these things unsettling or odd? That doesn't sound like a magnetic personality to me. If they would have high Charisma, it would more likely read "While some might find these proclivities unsettling or odd, people eventually grow warm to the goblins and consider these qualities endearing". I also believe this is the one sentence that describes how people like them - but I also believe it feels like it was thrown out there without any context to support it.

Pathfinder 2e Playtest PDF wrote:
Though goblins’ culture has splintered radically, their reputation across the Inner Sea region has changed little. As such, goblins who travel to larger cities are frequently subjected to derision, and as a result many goblins work twice as hard at proving their worth.

Another "trouble fitting into locations" issue that most high Charisma races shouldn't have trouble with. I don't believe being well known for being a menace should warrant +2 Charisma, and hatred is normally a negative Charisma stat.

Pathfinder 2e Playtest PDF wrote:
Those who befriend a goblin quickly learn that while a goblin’s friendship might include all manners of pranks, such fun comes from a place of true acceptance—something that a goblin does not give freely.

Hm... Hard to be friends with? But once they become your friends, they do so wholeheartedly? Doesn't that sound like another race with negative Charisma bonuses? (cough)Dwarf(cough). I'm not saying that Goblins should have a negative Charisma, that's better explained below:

Pathfinder 2e Playtest PDF wrote:
Goblins reach adolescence by the age of 3 and adulthood 4 or 5 years later. In theory, goblins could live 50 years or more, but without anyone to protect them from each other or themselves, few live past 20 years of age.

What is the key thing that is getting these Goblins killed? Surviving! What is survival key to? Wisdom! THIS is why I believe Wisdom makes a better dump than Charisma in terms of Character stats. I still don't believe Charisma should be a secondary buff, but I do believe that Wisdom makes a far better penalty stat than Charisma for this quote alone.

Pathfinder 2e Playtest PDF wrote:
Goblins typically stand about 3 feet tall, with skin colors that range from green to gray to blue. Goblin adventurers typically worship Cayden Cailean.

No idea why I posted this here, maybe because I already quoted everything else in the Goblins Biography, so I didn't want to leave anything out...

Pathfinder 2e Playtest PDF wrote:
As scrappy survivors, goblins are often rogues who dart about the shadows, though their natural charismatic nature also draws them to the pursuit of magical classes such as sorcerer.

Really, the only other thing in this book that says Goblins are... "naturally charismatic", which will come out of left field completely without context if you bothered to read their racial description. I understand the character concept of "Goblin Sorcerer with FIYA!!!!!!", but that is what the floating +2 Racial Score is for. You can EASILY get +18 Charisma, as long as you don't suffer a Charisma Penalty to your face - another reason that I don't want to penalize Goblins for Charisma is because of the Fire Sorcerers everyone wants to play *including me*.

====================================================================

Other quotes that support my +Constitution argument:

Pathfinder 2e Playtest PDF wrote:
Racial Feat: City Scavenger You know that the greatest treasures often look like refuse, and you scoff at those who throw away perfectly good scraps.
Pathfinder 2e Playtest PDF wrote:
Racial Feat: Eat Anything You are comfortable subsisting on food that most folks would consider spoiled. You gain a +2 circumstance bonus to saving throws against toxins and against gaining the sick condition, but only if it resulted from something you ate. You can eat and drink things when you have the sick condition.
Pathfinder 2e Playtest PDF wrote:
Racial Feat: Flame Heart As a result of either a childhood accident with flames or an ongoing fascination with fire, your skin has thickened, protecting you against burning

====================================================================

Well, I hope that this was an interesting read everyone. This was just my 2 cents (as someone who enjoyed Theory crafting Goblins from Pathfinder 1 - because of how rare Goblin Boons are... Seriously Paizo, you should think about making Goblins a boonless Race in 1E PFS when 2E is release.).

Anyway, what are your thoughts on the idea? Do you think +2 Con makes more sense than +2 Cha? Do you think it would be overpowered to have +2 Dex AND +2 Con on the same race? Or do you prefer Goblins being that awkwardly likable migit pet that - no one knows why - but for some odd reason people enjoy watching him eat rotten cheese filled with maggots? Post your thoughts on this, I want to hear your ideas.


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i for one want to see basic orc added as a core race, likewise with a cha bonus (since we're missing a medium race with one).

why are all the green people so handsome!


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No ancestry should have bonuses to two physical or two mental attributes and a free attribute bonus, since that opens the way to getting +2 to all mental or all physical attributes.

Plus, Golarion's goblins are funny- they love to sing and tell jokes, why shouldn't they have a Cha bonus? A penalty to Cha in PF1 never made sense to me.


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PossibleCabbage wrote:

No ancestry should have bonuses to two physical or two mental attributes and a free attribute bonus, since that opens the way to getting +2 to all mental or all physical attributes.

Plus, Golarion's goblins are funny- they love to sing and tell jokes, why shouldn't they have a Cha bonus? A penalty to Cha in PF1 never made sense to me.

i get that they have a certain force of personality (which would likely be the reasoning for theoretical Charisma Orcs), but they are also butt ugly. my first instinct on seeing those little green footballheaded lipless gremlns would be to punt them back over whatever fence they snuck past (and then go and patch said fence).

it does however amuse me greatly to see the goblin character art with "Sex Machine" in giant letters across it.

edit: now you can see it too, because I just went and did it!


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Going to throw in that I think goblins should keep the charisma bonus. Fits my headcannon better that they have natural affinity for things like frightening people, impersonating others (2 goblins, 1 trenchcoat), telling stories and lying, creating original songs, etc. These all feel fairly fitting for goblin stories I want to tell and listen too. Doesn't have to be about being physically attractive (a matter that is incredibly subjective and culturally driven). And yes, it is a bit selfish to want the official canon story to match my headcannon, but at the same time I doubt I'm the only one who feels this way (even if it is for different reasons). Change the description of the race before you change the ability distribution.


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PossibleCabbage wrote:
Plus, Golarion's goblins are funny

Not to me. At all. I don't find that creature that joke while setting my dog on fire funny. :P

The part of the goblin section that stands out to me is "their reputation across the Inner Sea region has changed little." As such, everyone still sees them as those -2cha bastards they always have been.


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AndIMustMask wrote:

i for one want to see basic orc added as a core race, likewise with a cha bonus (since we're missing a medium race with one).

why are all the green people so handsome!

As much as I agree orcs are sexy, I think +wis/-int is probably the most appropriate distribution for them. Orcs should be good clerics and bad wizards (similarly, I'm fine with the goblin charisma bonus because of all the caster classes the one they should be good at is Bard).


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graystone wrote:
PossibleCabbage wrote:
Plus, Golarion's goblins are funny

Not to me. At all. I don't find that creature that joke while setting my dog on fire funny. :P

The part of the goblin section that stands out to me is "their reputation across the Inner Sea region has changed little." As such, everyone still sees them as those -2cha bastards they always have been.

They need to face it. It should of been us kobolds.


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Definitely NOT a certain Kobold wrote:
graystone wrote:
PossibleCabbage wrote:
Plus, Golarion's goblins are funny

Not to me. At all. I don't find that creature that joke while setting my dog on fire funny. :P

The part of the goblin section that stands out to me is "their reputation across the Inner Sea region has changed little." As such, everyone still sees them as those -2cha bastards they always have been.

They need to face it. It should of been us kobolds.

wasted opportunity. people love kobolds.


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I understand that Goblins kinda have been the unoffical "mascot" of Paizo, but I would also like to voice that Orc should be a race that is core as well if they continue to push away the half races.


@ PossibleCabbage: Hm... Thank you for pointing that out, I hadn't thought of that. Unfortunately, none of the mental stats seem to make any sense for the Goblins... I still think it should have been something else, just my two cents anyway.

@ AndIMustMask & Arachnofiend: Actually, considering that Half-Elves and Half-Orcs are a heredity trait instead of an actual race, I was thinking that having an Orc Race would be something cool too. Maybe +2 Str +2 Wis, -2 Int like you suggested. Brute and boorish, but keen instincts with survival.

@ AndIMustMask: Love the picture btw, LMAO.

@ Paradozen & graystone: Going to have to side with graystone on this one.

@ Definitely NOT a certain Kobold: I would love to see a Kobalt with +2 Dex, +2 Wis, -2 Int skittering around everywhere.

(Edit)
@ DanceYrself: I agree with this statement.


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TheMonkeyFish wrote:

@ PossibleCabbage: Hm... Thank you for pointing that out, I hadn't thought of that. Unfortunately, none of the mental stats seem to make any sense for the Goblins... I still think it should have been something else, just my two cents anyway.

@ AndIMustMask & Arachnofiend: Actually, considering that Half-Elves and Half-Orcs are a heredity trait instead of an actual race, I was thinking that having an Orc Race would be something cool too. Maybe +2 Str +2 Wis, -2 Int like you suggested. Brute and boorish, but keen instincts with survival.

@ AndIMustMask: Love the picture btw, LMAO.

@ Paradozen & graystone: Going to have to side with graystone on this one.

@ Definitely NOT a certain Kobold: I would love to see a Kobalt with +2 Dex, +2 Wis, -2 Int skittering around everywhere.

(Edit)
@ DanceYrself: I agree with this statement.

No no we kobold definitely need +4 all attributes.

RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 16

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Really, most of the ability scores in the playtest make no sense.

Golarion dwarves are supposed to be highly personable craftsman. They have a penalty to Charisma and no bonus to Intelligence.

Elves are supposed to be wise mystics that commune with nature while having bodies capable of adapting to almost any environment. Their culture is highly xenophobic. Yet, they have a penalty to Constitution and a bonus to Intelligence.


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Cyrad wrote:

Really, most of the ability scores in the playtest make no sense.

Golarion dwarves are supposed to be highly personable craftsman. They have a penalty to Charisma and no bonus to Intelligence.

Elves are supposed to be wise mystics that commune with nature while having bodies capable of adapting to almost any environment. Their culture is highly xenophobic. Yet, they have a penalty to Constitution and a bonus to Intelligence.

AND Kobold are much stronger faster tougher smarter wiser and better looking then all the other races so we deserve many many attributes.


Well, I'd like to point out that they all have been kept from the 1st edition core races, and none of them have been altered. That being said, Dwarves seem much more like a Wisdom based race (Experience "learning" > Studied craft). Additionally, Constitution is your health and vitality, not necessarily your adaptation. While you can evolve to better suit your environment, it makes you no less built like a twig that can be snapped by the gentlest of winds. Of the races, the only playtest attributes I don't like are Goblins (as stated above) and Halflings (they only changed them because they don't want two core races with the same exact racial attributes).


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For a group of misfits who finally grouped up to understand they need a society to further their race... its weird Goblins get the +2 Cha


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Basically, you have to ask yourself "if goblins MUST have a mental ability bonus, where should it be?". It's definitely not wisdom, I think we can all agree that should be their weakest stat; it isn't intelligence either, Golarion goblins aren't known for their intellect in the same way that Azeroth goblins are. That leaves charisma, which while still fairly ill-fitting does mean that goblins make for pretty good bards, which should be their best caster class imo.

I do agree with the OP that Dex/Con is the most fitting distribution for goblins but Paizo seems to be under the impression that would be OP so it isn't an option.


So....the PF2 goblins are now the PF1 halflings, the PF2 halflings get to, uh, play clerics now I guess, and the gnome bards get upstaged by the goblins?


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@Arachanofiend I see your point, but I would like to counter it. We have seen that Goblins can scout, form war parties, and even gain alchemical knowledge to throw at PCs. Their inability to use social intelligence to form a real clan that gives other races the ability to give them a second chance is what hurts them the most. They are able to use creativity to craft traps and jerry rig contraptions that cause a headache to PF1 PCs


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@DanceYrself: I'm going to have to agree with you on this one. Goblins were a HUGE thorn in the side dealing with, and it was mainly just because of their traps. Actually... I think the only reason they have problem staying alive might not be wisdom, but because they are just easy pickings.

Personally, I believe that Halflings should have been +Dex, +Cha, -Con. If they HAVE to have a Physical/Mental split, I think Intelligence makes more sense than Charisma. Also, Goblin Alchemist > Goblin Bard. And Halfling Bard > Halfling Cleric.

@Slim Jim: Yep, basically.


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@TheMonkeyFish, I also have to agree with you.

IF anyone should be predisposition to be good at Alchemy, should be the ingenious Goblins.

IF anyone should be good at cheering on their allies and talking to people, should be Halflings and Gnomes.


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Y'know it's not the +Cha thing that bothers me so much as the fact that up till now every small race got -Str.

Goblins are the first to not.

Whenever someone would make a halfling barbarian or gnome monk and asked what the -Str was, I would always remark that it's to reflect that small races are comparitively weaker than larger races. Right? This seems to fly in the face of that.

I'd argue they should be: -Str, +Dex, +Cha.


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@DanceYrself - Ya know, I'm going to put myself out on a limb here for saying this, but I'm like 90% sure the only reason they added Alchemist was because of the Goblin Bombarder everyone wants to play. Considering their alchemist skills and trap making, and the fact that they are SMART enough to learn they need to ask for help to survive, Intelligence makes much more sense than Charisma. Something like:

"Naturally curious by nature, Goblins are quick to learn - especially when it comes to making things blow up."

@ Paizo - If you are listening, what do you think of the whole idea of Goblins being +Dex/+Int and switching back Halflings to +Dex/+Cha like the old ones we used to know and love?

@ Grimcleaver - Waylangs and Vine Leshy would like to have a word with you.


@Grimcleaver I was thinking the same, then I thought of the physiology of the goblins... if you scaled them up to medium size, with their tenacity and wild ferocity, it would rival orcs imo.


TheMonkeyFish wrote:
@ Grimcleaver - Waylangs and Vine Leshy would like to have a word with you.

Um...wat? Wow I must be really out of the loop on my Pathfinder lore. Are those things? *mad internet research*

Caveat: I sorta' washed out of the original Pathfinder playtest back in the day for being too much into theater of the mind, character and story focused roleplay. I've been hiding out in the 4e/5e verse for just under a decade. There's a lot of stuff I'm still getting up to speed on.

--okay I'm back. Vine Leshys are adorable.


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DanceYrself wrote:
@Grimcleaver I was thinking the same, then I thought of the physiology of the goblins... if you scaled them up to medium size, with their tenacity and wild ferocity, it would rival orcs imo.

Or their enormous pumpkin heads and skeletal bodies would crush them to death. That's what my betting money's on.


@Grimcleaver OR... Their skeletal structure and muscles were evolved to compensate for such a happy grin to give their enemies ;)


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TheMonkeyFish wrote:
@ Grimcleaver - Waylangs and Vine Leshy would like to have a word with you.

Not to mention small-sized Angelkin Aasimar; Slag May and Waker May Changelings; and Pitborn, Hungerseed, and Motherless Tieflings; all of whom get +2 strength, despite being potentially gnome sized.


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Orang Pendak also got a strength bonus.


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Yeah. Okay. So apparently there's a lot of stuff in Pathfinder I had no idea existed. Or were words.


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Int is the main ability of Alchemist, and goblins like to be alchemist. +2 Int -2 Wis is the profile of a mad scientist, one of the goblin's archetype. And +2 Int -2 Wis correspond to an inventive little pest who like traps and ambush tactics.

Hence Goblins have +2 Cha, as any natural leader. Whatever. Nothing in this game makes any sense, so who cares ?


Yeah I think Int is the way to go too.


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I feel like +Cha and -Wis does get across how Goblins can often easily convince other goblins to go along with whatever bad ideas the first goblin might come up with.

Like no people on Golarion are as susceptible to this phenomenon.


PossibleCabbage wrote:

I feel like +Cha and -Wis does get across how Goblins can often easily convince other goblins to go along with whatever bad ideas the first goblin might come up with.

Like no people on Golarion are as susceptible to this phenomenon.

Easily swayed by peer pressure. well you got me sold on the wisdom penalty anyways.


I would be okay if Goblins received a +2 bonus to Intelligence instead of Charisma, but I will not be upset if it is Charisma.


OP, I agree with your case against Charisma, although I could live with it.
Since we accept they need a mental stat boost, I would also vote for Int. I see it as a combination of 'low cunning', 'mechanical ingenuity' & 'diabolical imagination', rather than academic intelligence.


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Aldarc wrote:
I would be okay if Goblins received a +2 bonus to Intelligence instead of Charisma, but I will not be upset if it is Charisma.

Same for me. I see goblins more as cunning (even though crazy) as charismatic. My suspicion is, that they feared this would favor the goblin-alchemist too much, with Dex and Int being alchemists primary stats.

Also, I think it will never be Dex and Con because of gameplay/balance reasons (as PossibleCabbage mentioned earlier).


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Frankly, I think even having Goblins as a base race is idiotic. I get that the goblin is Paizo's mascot, but a waste of paper/space.

Dark Archive

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I agree on the +2 Int instead of Charisma.
+2 Dex make sense, ok, sneaky, small, ok no questions asked.
+2 Con I would doubt it a little as I would see it as really also physical robustness in which I can't see a goblin tough as a dwarf (C'mon). I would give instead even -2 Con BUT they have this hard stomach so it balances out.. I guess? Flat Con would make sense here IMO.
Goblins fit better the Scrapper/mechanic/alchemist concept and all of these are Int dependant.

Take the perspective of the same race on a different domain: Starfinder.
Would you see better a Goblin Mechanic or a shiny Goblin Solarian (or better a Goblin Envoy)?

I think that with the current stat bonuses if you really want to have a Goblin Sorcerer you can do it anyway without the starting +2 bonus.
IMO the Stat distribution for Goblins should be

Bonus: Dexterity, Intelligence, Optional
Malus: Strength


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RunnerAndJumper wrote:
Aldarc wrote:
I would be okay if Goblins received a +2 bonus to Intelligence instead of Charisma, but I will not be upset if it is Charisma.

Same for me. I see goblins more as cunning (even though crazy) as charismatic. My suspicion is, that they feared this would favor the goblin-alchemist too much, with Dex and Int being alchemists primary stats.

Also, I think it will never be Dex and Con because of gameplay/balance reasons (as PossibleCabbage mentioned earlier).

don't (in golarion) they straight up fly into a rage whenever written works are around? they are militantly ignorant.

though im sure their recent tragedies and refugee status has brought out more than a few oddballs (even among goblins) who might take interest in such previously reviled fields.


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@ AndIMustMask: Goblins are superstitious and believe that Words are your soul, and that Books and written paper (because they are filled with words) are soul-suckers that will steal your soul. Same as cultures that believe a Camera will still your soul, despite evidence for the contrary.

That being said, I believe a +2 Intelligence boost wouldn't reflect their book smarts. Instead, it would reflect their ingenuity and ability to learn quickly. It would make more sense than their master of seduction +2 Charisma.


AndIMustMask wrote:

don't (in golarion) they straight up fly into a rage whenever written works are around? they are militantly ignorant.

though im sure their recent tragedies and refugee status has brought out more than a few oddballs (even among goblins) who might take interest in such previously reviled fields.

There are people who are smart and ignorant, as well as smart and superstitious. Both can be a somewhat dangerous (or at least VERY annoying) combination. I agree, that +2 Int is not perfect for goblins, but I believe it fits better than Cha.

Another solution could be to give them two free boosts, making them the small humans of the monster world *shrug*
In the end, because of the free boost that every race gets (plus background, plus free boosts, plus class), it does not make a huge difference in gameplay and is mostly flavor.


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Starfinder Superscriber

This is actually very simple.

With the 18 cap on stats at level one, it is simple. +4 Dex, - 2 Wisdom. Boom. Done.

In reality, because of the nature of the cap, the most important of the modifiers believe it or not tends to be the penalty. This is true in Starfinder even more so. If you select a race with a penalty to your dumpiest of dumb stats, that's the "best" stat selection. Everything else washes out.


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I think all small races should have a penalty to strength since they have taken away the small size penalty for weapon damage. I would be okay with no strength penalty if they used weapon size or went the 5th edition route.

I can't see Frodo wielding a two handed sword and doing the same damage as Boromir or Aragorn.


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Kerobelis wrote:

I think all small races should have a penalty to strength since they have taken away the small size penalty for weapon damage. I would be okay with no strength penalty if they used weapon size or went the 5th edition route.

I can't see Frodo wielding a two handed sword and doing the same damage as Boromir or Aragorn.

I can! And it's glorious.

Liberty's Edge

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Meh, I like it the way it is currently in the playtest.


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Definitely NOT a certain Kobold wrote:
They need to face it. It should of been us kobolds.

I'd have taken a pet rock race before goblin. ;)

As to stats, I don't think they should get ANY mental stat boost. Give them +2 dex and +2 other and leave it at that if we have to keep that kind of balance.

IMO, they should have a -2 to ALL mental stats but the game doesn't support that. ;)


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TheMonkeyFish wrote:

@DanceYrself - Ya know, I'm going to put myself out on a limb here for saying this, but I'm like 90% sure the only reason they added Alchemist was because of the Goblin Bombarder everyone wants to play. Considering their alchemist skills and trap making, and the fact that they are SMART enough to learn they need to ask for help to survive, Intelligence makes much more sense than Charisma. Something like:

"Naturally curious by nature, Goblins are quick to learn - especially when it comes to making things blow up."

@ Paizo - If you are listening, what do you think of the whole idea of Goblins being +Dex/+Int and switching back Halflings to +Dex/+Cha like the old ones we used to know and love?

@ Grimcleaver - Waylangs and Vine Leshy would like to have a word with you.

Ask for what you want for goblins, but some of us have argued very passionately, and I think, rather well, for halflings to get the wisdom bonus instead of the Charisma bonus. So leave that one alone, please and thank you.


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I always figured that the Dex/Cha for halflings was more of a legacy artifact from 3.5, as Golarion's halflings were generally portrayed as more grim and sensible and clear-eyed.

I am glad to see it the way it is. Sooner or later we should get a +Int small ancestry though (Ratfolk?)


PossibleCabbage wrote:

I always figured that the Dex/Cha for halflings was more of a legacy artifact from 3.5, as Golarion's halflings were generally portrayed as more grim and sensible and clear-eyed.

I am glad to see it the way it is. Sooner or later we should get a +Int small ancestry though (Ratfolk?)

I like halflings getting charisma (admittedly for build reasons), but I think wis probably fits better with Golarion.

For goblins I will be fine with +cha or +int, but that's because I like them for absolutely no reason in the former case, and possibly because starfinder goblins with their dinky helmets are adorable for the latter.

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