Errata questions


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Isn't the errata document supposed to release today?


Paizo Superscriber; Pathfinder Companion, Pathfinder Accessories, Starfinder Accessories, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

In theory, yes. OTOH, the day's not over yet. :-)


Ed Reppert wrote:
Xenocrat wrote:
The Elemental Tempest wizard power needs to clarify that it doesn't work with cantrips, which are "spells" cast at your highest level, so they provide a really offensive boost if they work with this.

Powers don't have needs. :-)

An evocation spell (not a cantrip) cast at the caster's highest level would seem to suffer from the same "problem". Do you suggest that Elemental Tempest shouldn't work with those either?

Okay, cantrips are "unlimited use" in that they don't consume a spell slot. Is that the problem?

Yes. I imagine they designed this thinking your ability to store up the max level of damage was limited by your spell slots, but if cantrips work with it then that's not the case.

Scarab Sages

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Xenocrat wrote:
Ed Reppert wrote:
Xenocrat wrote:
The Elemental Tempest wizard power needs to clarify that it doesn't work with cantrips, which are "spells" cast at your highest level, so they provide a really offensive boost if they work with this.

Powers don't have needs. :-)

An evocation spell (not a cantrip) cast at the caster's highest level would seem to suffer from the same "problem". Do you suggest that Elemental Tempest shouldn't work with those either?

Okay, cantrips are "unlimited use" in that they don't consume a spell slot. Is that the problem?

Yes. I imagine they designed this thinking your ability to store up the max level of damage was limited by your spell slots, but if cantrips work with it then that's not the case.

You're still limited by your spell point pool, and elemental tempest burns 2 points per use.

Paizo Employee Designer

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Xenocrat wrote:
There’s a monk feat like this, too, reads awkwardly until you realize the missing word would have wrapped to another line.

Do you recall which monk feat it was? I'd like to take a look for potential rewording.


Paizo Superscriber; Pathfinder Companion, Pathfinder Accessories, Starfinder Accessories, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
Raisse wrote:
You're still limited by your spell point pool, and elemental tempest burns 2 points per use.

Good point.


Raisse wrote:
Xenocrat wrote:
Ed Reppert wrote:
Xenocrat wrote:
The Elemental Tempest wizard power needs to clarify that it doesn't work with cantrips, which are "spells" cast at your highest level, so they provide a really offensive boost if they work with this.

Powers don't have needs. :-)

An evocation spell (not a cantrip) cast at the caster's highest level would seem to suffer from the same "problem". Do you suggest that Elemental Tempest shouldn't work with those either?

Okay, cantrips are "unlimited use" in that they don't consume a spell slot. Is that the problem?

Yes. I imagine they designed this thinking your ability to store up the max level of damage was limited by your spell slots, but if cantrips work with it then that's not the case.
You're still limited by your spell point pool, and elemental tempest burns 2 points per use.

Yes, but it's the a big damage boost to Elemental Tempest if every single use of it is at your max spell level.


Logan Bonner wrote:
Xenocrat wrote:
There’s a monk feat like this, too, reads awkwardly until you realize the missing word would have wrapped to another line.
Do you recall which monk feat it was? I'd like to take a look for potential rewording.

I don't offhand, it was late at night a few nights ago. I might have been mistaken, but I'll check next time I look over the Monk.

Paizo Employee Designer

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shroudb wrote:
Fuzzy-Wuzzy wrote:
I thought "ask the player to roll" and "check is secret" were mutually exclusive.

You close your eyes and roll.

It's a system meant for the amusement of the rest of the table dying from laughter due to your crappy rolls. :D

I'm tempted to use this implementation at my table, to be honest. XD

Liberty's Edge

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Any word on the Bastard Sword being a Piercing only weapon? Amiri's pregen seems to listen it as Slashing versatile P


Arnim Thayer wrote:

Is it a mistake that Fighters gain Heavy Armor Expertise (increasing the proficiency to Expert) at 13th level, but have to wait until 17th level with Armor Mastery to gain the same level of Proficiency with Medium Armor?

That seems like a design flaw to me.

This takes into account the scaling of getting attributes at level 10 and level 15. Heavy Armor requires greater proficiency to meet the expected maximum AC values. Light Armor on high dex characters does not. Medium Armor sits a little lower that either extreme because it is accomplishable without over specializing in one or the other, and at levle 17 would become useless if it didn't get a proficiency boost when heavy armor gets its proficiency boost AND gets its major penalties removed. The design is intentional.


The newly posted version of Amiri shows that her Bastard Sword does Slashing Damage and has Two-Hand d12, but not Versatile P.
Edit: Nevermind, the 5th level version's Bastard Sword does have Versatile P...
The newly posted update doesn't include this as erratum, but it is safe to say it is intended to be so.

Silver Crusade

Is the hand crossbow supposed to be a simple weapon?


On page 255 the Shield Other text is misplaced on the page.

Please move the "Performance Example" text box from page 157 to 156. This would make it consistent with the Performance section. I almost missed it.

Sign Language vs. Read Lips: there is an inconsistency regarding the sign language ability in that if a character decides to know sign language instead of the spoken language they automatically get the Read lips feat. Yet, sign language and read lips are separate feats. Given that the two are distinct abilities I disagree with this assumption. Shouldn't they have the same weight?

Character back story example- Avriduu is a Crossbow Fighter Spy Rogue (1st ed.) who was raised in the streets of Sothis. To survive he worked for several merchants pick pocketing and spying on clients or opponents. Over time he developed the ability to read lips in common tongue and garnered a strong reputation amongst the merchant class.

In this simple example the character did not learn sign language per se, although he could have. Instead he acquired the read lips ability with a rank in linguistics. In PFS2 it would simply be a general feat slot in Read Lips. Again, my only concern is consistency.


Matt_Seibert wrote:

Here is my feedback, from my "first pass attempt" at creating the most basic of characters: a Human Fighter. It was also shared to the Facebook 2ED Feedback forum but I believe it should be cataloged here as well:

1) Page 12, there is a missing word in the last paragraph of the first column before the break. The sentence makes no sense without "the" or "your" before character.

2) I had to flip back and forth through the manual as far as page 291 so many times I lost count. For a section called "Character Creation" the information needed is in all the chapters that follow.
- Perhaps "Read Chapters 2 and 3" and then put "Character Creation" in after them?
- Maybe make one page in the manual with the Proficiency Modifiers Table, the Ability Scores and Modifiers Table, and other "small data" tables together for a "quick reference" page?

3) There is nowhere that I can find to record armor and shields on the character sheet inclusive of their traits. I can put the numbers into the AC/TAC but there isn't a breakout there for Shield and Armor; it's just "Item" (singular, not plural). I can put the name and bulk into equipment, but with only 8 lines a fighter with armor, shield, four melee weapons and two ranged weapons means there is nowhere to write "backpack" let alone catalog the necessary adventuring supplies.

4) As stated above, I've got four melee weapons. There are only three blanks for "Melee Strikes" and only two for "Ranged Strikes". I'd prefer the old style sheets with "Attacks" where you put in what you needed where you wanted it. Do I lead with a Bow and then switch to Longsword and Short sword upon closing range? Yes, so I'll put those two at the top and "other attacks" below them.

5) Ranged Thrown Weapons: Do you put your STR modifier into the "Other Damage" section? What if you have a "Disrupting Dagger"? How do you put the STR increased damage and the Disrupting features on the same line?

6) Where do you put skill points? I've got 4 to allocate, but the Skills section doesn't...

i for one would greatly love a small data/quick reference page in the character creation section.

in that same vein, i'd recommend a small table with all relevant page references in the individual class entries (for example wizard might have the pages for the spells, spell list, magical item crafting, and familiar listed in theirs, while the alchemist would have pointers t the alchemical item gear section and treasure section with the actual list, and so on) all collected in one place, rather than sprinkled through their fluff and mechanical text for their class abilities.

Silver Crusade

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Pathfinder Companion, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber
Fuzzy-Wuzzy wrote:
The Glossary entries for arcane/divine/occult/primal describe them in terms of the material, mental, vital, and spiritual essences, but those are not otherwise mentioned (much less defined) anywhere. Either expand on them or (my preference) take out the references entirely and leave the essences to another book.

Yeah those seem to be vaguely over defining the magic system without providing an actual benefit. If they want a spell on a certain list, just put it on the list. Don’t put it on a secret hidden list to justify putting it on the actual public list being used.


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the paladin mount-centric feats from righteous ally (steed) ability choice (loyal warhorse, imposing destrier, auspicious mount, and celestial mount) are currently completely incompatible with mounts gained from other sources, such as the cavalier dedication (and leaving a paladin/cavalier with two horses with entirely separate feat costs and scaling), as all steed ally feats specifically apply to "the mount you gained through the righteous ally class feature".

currently this means that if you choose to multiclass into cavalier and chose a steed ally for paladin, you end up with two separate horses, with individual scaling/feat costs. it's also worth pointing out that if steed ally is altered to apply to other gained mounts, it should include a clause letting them keep their advancement such as adult/nimble/etc if they already have it, as the current steed ally ability would overwrite them back to "young" otherwise

this seems like an oversight, especially since the sorcerer class is futureproofed for gaining multiple sources of channel energy (for example).


Matt_Seibert wrote:


6) Where do you put skill points? I've got 4 to allocate, but the Skills section doesn't seem to have anywhere to put a credit value. The "Prof" box is filled in from the TEML set of data... right?

ACROBATICS_____SIG__DEX__TEML__PROF__ITEM__ARMOR

______+10__________*____+4___**______+6_____+2_______-2

under the Skill's name, next to the D20 icon, you put your total skill modifier (bonuses-penalties)
under SIG, you put a check if the skill is a signature skill for your character
under TEML, you put a check/s, depending on your proficiency(Trained, Expert, Master, Legendary).
under PROF, you put your proficiency modifier(Proficiency + Level)

Matt_Seibert wrote:


7) If my "Background Feat" is a second level feat, do I still get that as a level 1 PC? Or do I need to wait until I'm level 2?

General Rule: You need to meet a given feat's level requirement in order to be able to choose it.

Specific Rule: Background 'X' says you have feat 'Y'. Not "you may choose", but "you have".

Specific Rule > General Rule


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The various bullheaded mutagens make you lose RP, but don't say what happens if you don't have that many (or any) left to lose---does it count as overspending?


Vahnyu wrote:

General Rule: You need to meet a given feat's level requirement in order to be able to choose it.

Specific Rule: Background 'X' says you have feat 'Y'. Not "you may choose", but "you have".

Specific Rule > General Rule

I suppose that answers my question regarding things like Monk's Abundant Step letting you "gain" (and presumably use) dimensional steps at level 6 despite the fact that it is a level 4 power and non-spellcasters are supposed to be limited to powers half their level (rounded up).

Saved me quite a bit of reference + editing to ask the question. Thank you. : )


Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber

Sorry if this is a stupid question, but I see everyone talking about the errata, however I cannot find a copy of it.

Is there somewhere I can download it?


It is available in the downloads section of the Playtest page (where you probably downloaded the rulebook from too).


Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber

Ok, I see it now. I dl’d the rulebook at the top of the page.

Thank you.

Sczarni RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16

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Minor quibble, but for some reason every time I see it, it really bugs me:

The Healing Hands cleric feat says, "Add a Verbal Casting action to the casting of the triggering spell..."

Either the feat should be called Healing Words, or it should be adding a Somatic Casting action.


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Druid's "Woodland Stride" is listed as level 1, but appears in the level 4 section.


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There needs to be some clarification on Splash damage. The wording is confusing and people are interpreting it in at least two different ways.

It needs to be clarified if the Primary Target takes the Splash damage only on a Failure, or if they also take it on a Success and a Critical Success like the other targets within 5 feet of them.


On page 385, the Choker of Elocution does not say how long the effect lasts. Should this even be activated?


This error was discovered by OdanBaere.

The spell Remove Paralysis is on the occult and primal spell lists, but not on the divine spell list.


On page 392, it is unclear how many items Gloves of Storing can have stored at once.


Paizo Superscriber; Pathfinder Companion, Pathfinder Accessories, Starfinder Accessories, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
Fuzzy-Wuzzy wrote:
On page 392, it is unclear how many items Gloves of Storing can have stored at once.

Only because you wish they could store more than one item. The real question is what happens when you try to store a second item in the gloves. Does the first one disappear into the void, or fall to the floor, or conk you in the head?

Put it another way: the description says "one thing". If it's not limited to just one, then by the description, you can store an infinite number of items there. I sincerely doubt that was intended.


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Ed Reppert wrote:
Fuzzy-Wuzzy wrote:
On page 392, it is unclear how many items Gloves of Storing can have stored at once.

Only because you wish they could store more than one item. The real question is what happens when you try to store a second item in the gloves. Does the first one disappear into the void, or fall to the floor, or conk you in the head?

Put it another way: the description says "one thing". If it's not limited to just one, then by the description, you can store an infinite number of items there. I sincerely doubt that was intended.

One, please don't impugn my motives. It's very rude and gives me the urge to ignore you completely.

Two, "one thing" is what you can store with a single activation. It doesn't say you can't activate it that way if it's got something already stored. It probably should, since that's how it worked in PF1.


Paizo Superscriber; Pathfinder Companion, Pathfinder Accessories, Starfinder Accessories, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

I guess you don't recognize kidding when you see it. :-(

Dark Archive

Summon nature's ally 2 summons a "constrictor snake", which I'm assuming is the "ball python" from page 107 of the Bestiary. I haven't looked in detail at all of the creatures that can be summoned, but it's possible some names were changed elsewhere as well.


playtest rulebook 397, Mail of Luck wrote:
This suit of +2 master splint mail has a large green gemstone inset in a prominent location. You can activate the armor once per day to force the attacker to reroll the attack roll and use the new result.This effect has the fortune trait.

I believe this should be the "misfortune" trait (so the attacker could use an actual fortune effect to cancel it out).


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

In the equipment section I could not find a write up for Cookware. It is also 2 bulk which seemed extraordinarily high. I wanted to read what made it 2 bulk but couldnt.

I should also add that characters wh don’t devote any boosts to Str likely cant carry it. So unless it’s a kitchen full of stuff, best to lower to 1 bulk or even L.


playtest rulebook page 402, Potion of Disguise wrote:
The potion maintains your own size, if possible, but can enlarge you up to one size or shrink you by any number of sizes. For example, if you are Medium and drink a potion of green dragon disguise, you’ll take on the appearance of a Medium green dragon. If you drink a potion of disguise that would enlarge you by more than one size category (from Medium to Huge, for example), the magic is negated and the potion is wasted.

Should this say a Large green dragon, as an example of allowed enlarging?


playtest rulebook page 403, Ring of Climbing wrote:
This ring grants you a climb Speed equal to half your land Speed. Penalties to your Speed (including those from your armor) apply to this climb Speed.

I read this to mean you get a climb Speed of (half your unimpeded land Speed) minus (penalties to your land Speed), but I'm sure some will argue the penalties are subtracted from your land Speed and the result halved, instead (effectively halving all penalties).

Similarly for the Ring of Swimming on page 404.


On page 398, the Messenger's Ring is listed as "shoes" and as light Bulk.


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playtest rulebook page 414 wrote:
Acid Effects with this trait deal acid damage. An item with Hardness 5 or lower takes 1 extra Dent from acid damage.

I couldn't find this anywhere in the rules besides the Traits appendix. That's bad. It should be under Item Damage or something.

Might want to mention what persistent acid damage does to such low-hardness items, too (i.e. eats them in a few rounds).


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Page 197's description of Light & Darkness led me to believe that lower-level light effects were merely suppressed ("fail to shine") in higher-level darkness. However,

playtest rulebook page 415 wrote:
Darkness (page 197) Darkness effects extinguish light in the area, including less powerful magical light. Darkness and light effects can negate one another.

It should be either suppression or extinguishing, and it should be the same in both places.


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Improved Dueling Riposte wrote:
At the start of each of your turns, you gain an additional reaction that you can use only with Dueling Riposte. If you are not benefiting from Dueling Parry, you can use your normal reaction in addition to this Dueling Riposte reaction.

The second part of the fighter's Improved Dueling Riposte feat doesn't realy make any sense as written.

Improved Twin Reposte has the same text.

It basically says I can use the extra action from the feat in addition to my normal action ONLY if I don't have Dueling Parry active. But since I can't even use Riposte without having Parry active, this feat does absolutely nothing by RAW.


AndIMustMask wrote:
Xenocrat wrote:
AndIMustMask wrote:

the sorcerer level 4 feat "Divine Evolution"'s effect reads:

"You can channel energy, per the cleric class feature, once per day. If you already have the channel energy class feature, you instead gain one additional use per day."
currently there is no means to get more than one source of channel energy on a character, as multiclassing doesn't work that way anymore, and the cleric multiclass doesn't grant the channel energy ability.

there is no sorcerer multiclass (at least yet) and I'm not entirely certain there would be enough space in the dedication feats list to give every bloodline-centric feat in such a case (there are generally 6 dedication feats, with the most being 8 feats for cleric and wizard), so even then they'll likely not get access to this feat, so I'm not entirely sure this line is needed even on a futureproofing perspective, as all the usual suspects are already here, and i dont recall any advanced, hybrid, or occult classes that got channel energy either.

There's no way the eventual Sorcerer multiclass archetype won't require a choice of spell list, and this feat (and all the dedications) simply goes off spell list as prerequisite, so it's a completely valid choice for the generic "pick a Sorcerer feat" advanced option.
fair enough i suppose. we'll ahve to see how the multiclass handles once the add-on is released later.

We know from Mark Seifer that we Paladin fans will like multiclassing into Heavenly Sorcerer - So we know it's coming soon.


playtest rulebook page 89 sidebar wrote:
Press: Actions with this trait allow you to follow up earlier attacks. An action with the press trait can be used only if you are currently affected by a multiple attack penalty. Some actions with the press trait also grant an effect on a failure. Effects on a failure can be gained only if the action took a –4 multiple attack penalty or worse. The effects that are added on a failure don’t apply on a critical failure. If your press action succeeds or critically succeeds, but it deals no damage and causes no other effects (typically due to resistance), you can choose to apply the failure effect instead.

Perhaps I'm just revealing my lack of system mastery, but AFAIK it's impossible to have a nonzero MAP (as per first bolded sentence) but not be at -4 or worse. So is the second bolded sentence redundant, or very careful futureproofing?

Re the third bolded sentence, if the failure effect deals damage, does it bypass resistances etc, or do they get applied twice? The former seems potentially overpowered, the latter quite underpowered. Also, if you have a rider effect present (say a poisoned blade) is the damage from the failure effect enough to trigger it after all?


playtest rulebook page 89 sidebar wrote:
Stance: A stance is a general combat strategy that you enter by using an action with the stance trait. You can enter a stance only in encounter mode. A stance lasts until you get knocked out, until its requirements (if any) are violated, or until you enter a new stance, whichever comes first.

Please make explicit that you can't be in a stance outside encounter mode, whether by changing the bolded "enter" to "be in" or adding "until you leave encounter mode" to the ending conditions.


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Fuzzy-Wuzzy wrote:

Perhaps I'm just revealing my lack of system mastery, but AFAIK it's impossible to have a nonzero MAP (as per first bolded sentence) but not be at -4 or worse. So is the second bolded sentence redundant, or very careful futureproofing?

Re the third bolded sentence, if the failure effect deals damage, does it bypass resistances etc, or do they get applied twice? The former seems potentially overpowered, the latter quite underpowered. Also, if you have a rider effect present (say a poisoned blade) is the damage from the failure effect enough to trigger it after all?

Agile Grace with an agile weapon means you're attacking at -3 on your 2nd attack and -6 on your 3rd+ attacks. This came up during my DPR calculations and affected Certain Strikes in particular. Can't do Strike + Certain Strike if you have Agile Grace and attacking with an agile weapon.


Fuzzy-Wuzzy wrote:
playtest rulebook page 89 sidebar wrote:
Press: Actions with this trait allow you to follow up earlier attacks. An action with the press trait can be used only if you are currently affected by a multiple attack penalty. Some actions with the press trait also grant an effect on a failure. Effects on a failure can be gained only if the action took a –4 multiple attack penalty or worse. The effects that are added on a failure don’t apply on a critical failure. If your press action succeeds or critically succeeds, but it deals no damage and causes no other effects (typically due to resistance), you can choose to apply the failure effect instead.

Perhaps I'm just revealing my lack of system mastery, but AFAIK it's impossible to have a nonzero MAP (as per first bolded sentence) but not be at -4 or worse. So is the second bolded sentence redundant, or very careful futureproofing?

Re the third bolded sentence, if the failure effect deals damage, does it bypass resistances etc, or do they get applied twice? The former seems potentially overpowered, the latter quite underpowered. Also, if you have a rider effect present (say a poisoned blade) is the damage from the failure effect enough to trigger it after all?

Agile Grace (fighter 10) is one way that pops into mind to drop MAP to -3/-6


Aha, I totally missed Agile Grace! Thanks guys.


Orichalcum has a higher hardness than Adamantine, so it should probably say that it overcomes adamantine resistance.


Xenocrat wrote:
Orichalcum has a higher hardness than Adamantine, so it should probably say that it overcomes adamantine resistance.

I don't think so because...

Playtest Rulebook 354 wrote:
Weapons made from adamantine treat any object they hit as if it had half as much Hardness as usual unless the object’s Hardness is greater than that of the adamantine weapon.

Already covers the fact that, for example, a master-quality adamantine katana doesn't halve the hardness of a whole slew of objects; including: A legendary-quality steel katana. Master-quality steel or cold iron armor, legendary-quality mithral armor. Anything made from orichalchum. Any stone or metal structure except less-than-master quality silver structures, and any expert-or-better quality wooden structure.


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Acid Splash, which requires an attack roll, does not have the Attack trait. Electric Arc, which does not require an attack roll, does have the Attack trait. These should be reversed for MAP purposes.

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