cover wrote: To determine whether a target has cover from an attack, the attacking creature or object draws a line from the center of its space to the center of the target’s space. If that line passes through any blocking terrain, the target has cover. The cover grants that creature a +2 circumstance bonus to AC against the attack. screening wrote: When you’re attempting a ranged attack, or a melee attack against a nonadjacent target, your target might be screened from you if another creature is between you. If you must attack or shoot through the space of a creature that’s one size smaller than you or larger, your target is screened from you and gains a +1 circumstance bonus to AC against your attack. Unlike cover and the concealed condition (see page 320), being screened doesn’t allow a creature to attempt to Hide.
To determine whether your target is screened from your attack, pick the corner of your space with the least obstructed line to your target and draw a line to the center of the target’s space. If you can’t reach the center of the creature’s space without passing through either blocking terrain or another creature that’s one size smaller than you or larger, the target is screened against that attack.
Screening and cover both mention blocking terrain, it needs to be removed from screening as that leads to confusion.
Also screening needs "one size smaller than you or larger" to be changed to "within one size category of you", right now it's jsut confusing.
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I would agree if there is terrain issues it should just be cover and if it is some monster/person/animal between then that should be screening. The second part of the description of screening muddies the waters.
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kaid wrote: I would agree if there is terrain issues it should just be cover and if it is some monster/person/animal between then that should be screening. The second part of the description of screening muddies the waters. The issue is creatures 2 sizes larger act as blocking terrain and thus provide cover, that's why the description of screening needs to be changed.
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willuwontu wrote:
The issue is creatures 2 sizes larger act as blocking terrain and thus provide cover, that's why the description of screening needs to be changed. Thank you! Missed the connection that screening upgraded to Cover and was totally confused by Screening. Plus I am with you on the size description of Screening it's very confusing the way it's written.
In the picture, the ogre has both Screening and Cover from Kyra, but I thought you only benefit from the larger of a particular bonus (so +2 from cover) making the Screening have no effect?
willuwontu wrote: Also screening needs "one size smaller than you or larger" to be changed to "within one size category of you", right now it's jsut confusing. The phrasing you suggest changing to is a change of how the currently phrased rule works.
To elaborate, lets use a practical example:
You are a size Medium creature. A size Small or larger creature between you and your target can provide screening. If the creature between you and your target is size Huge, and your target is Medium or smaller, its space is treated as blocking terrain (and so on with larger sizes of intervening creature and target, so long as the intervening creature is at least 2 sizes larger than you and your target, whatever the target's size might be)
If changed to the phrasing you suggest, a size Large creature would providing screening to your target, but a size Huge creature wouldn't, and if your target was size Large or larger that Huge creature also wouldn't count as blocking terrain - meaning the creature between you and the target could improve your accuracy against targets behind it if it enlarged itself from Large size to Huge size.
That example is also problematic as Kyra could also just aim up, picking a corner at the top of her cube aiming at the four unblocked spaces above Valeros.
I’m also annoyed they removed firing around a corner. Which means if you have cover from enemies, enemies also always have cover from you.
Arrow slits don’t work in PF2.
Jester David wrote: Arrow slits don’t work in PF2. That's not necessarily true, given that PF2 uses the "specific beats general" rules style.
An arrow slit sounds like a perfect thing to have a specific rule overriding the general cover rules so that you can fire out of the slit without your target benefiting from cover while firing into the slit from the outside could remain extremely difficult.
thenobledrake wrote: willuwontu wrote: Also screening needs "one size smaller than you or larger" to be changed to "within one size category of you", right now it's jsut confusing. The phrasing you suggest changing to is a change of how the currently phrased rule works.
To elaborate, lets use a practical example:
You are a size Medium creature. A size Small or larger creature between you and your target can provide screening. If the creature between you and your target is size Huge, and your target is Medium or smaller, its space is treated as blocking terrain (and so on with larger sizes of intervening creature and target, so long as the intervening creature is at least 2 sizes larger than you and your target, whatever the target's size might be)
If changed to the phrasing you suggest, a size Large creature would providing screening to your target, but a size Huge creature wouldn't, and if your target was size Large or larger that Huge creature also wouldn't count as blocking terrain - meaning the creature between you and the target could improve your accuracy against targets behind it if it enlarged itself from Large size to Huge size. If the creature is 2 sizes larger than you, it doesn't provide screening, it provides cover, which doesn't stack with screening.
willuwontu wrote: If the creature is 2 sizes larger than you, it doesn't provide screening, it provides cover, which doesn't stack with screening. Not quite.
If the creature is 2+ sizes larger than you and your target it provides cover, rather than screening.
If the creature is 2+ sizes larger than you but not 2+ sizes larger than your target, it provides screening rather than cover.
Cover is also relevant for some targeted spells ( I think those with ranged attacks can avoid it by testing for screening) which will surprise players.
So what does screening do if the person inbetween is your size?
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Suggestion:
Remove screening. Leave it up to the DM and Common Sense whether or not enough crap is in the way for Cover.
Recent threads in Playing the Game
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