Reach: No More Donut of Death?


Playing the Game

Shadow Lodge

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Unless I missed something, reach weapons no longer have the donut of death?

Reach wrote:

This weapon is long and can be used to attack creatures

up to 10 feet away instead of only adjacent creatures. For
creatures that already have reach with the limb or limbs that
wield the weapon, the weapon increases their reach by 5 feet.


Correct :D It works the way most newbs think it does now, which made me happy and my first playtest character is Zhao Yun/Jiang Wei XD


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As an aside: I'm not seeing anything on threatening the second diagonal. Has the 5-foot teleport returned?


I was very excited to see this change. Adding a reach martial to my "to test" list...


worldhopper wrote:
I was very excited to see this change. Adding a reach martial to my "to test" list...

Reach martial with the cavalier dedication is my first character.


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Flaming Duck wrote:
As an aside: I'm not seeing anything on threatening the second diagonal. Has the 5-foot teleport returned?

Yup, they kept diagonal movement as it was in PF1 but didn't change this, so the second diagonal is 15ft away and not threatened, allowing for a step without provoking.

Of course, in PF1 they had to do a whole clarification on this that was kind of dumb to say that moving from the 2nd to the 1st diagonal did provoke even though the second diagonal isn't threatened, instead of doing the old 3.0 and just letting Reach weapons threaten those squares.

I hope they actually change the wording this time.


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Good Riddance.

Shadow Lodge

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Glad to see reach weapons can hit adjacent foes now.


Yeah, they made it like Starfinder. Which is nice.

Scarab Sages

TheFinish wrote:
Flaming Duck wrote:
As an aside: I'm not seeing anything on threatening the second diagonal. Has the 5-foot teleport returned?

Yup, they kept diagonal movement as it was in PF1 but didn't change this, so the second diagonal is 15ft away and not threatened, allowing for a step without provoking.

Of course, in PF1 they had to do a whole clarification on this that was kind of dumb to say that moving from the 2nd to the 1st diagonal did provoke even though the second diagonal isn't threatened, instead of doing the old 3.0 and just letting Reach weapons threaten those squares.

I hope they actually change the wording this time.

That clarification is a good thing and makes tons of sense, metric tons of sense, they need to keep that clarification, otherwise GMs like me will cheese the s$%@ out of you reach fighters.

BTW I'm 100% in favor of no more doughnut of death.

Silver Crusade

Build idea: whip-wielding Fighter using the grab feats


Long John wrote:
...first playtest character is Zhao Yun/Jiang Wei XD

<shanghai noon>Did you say your name was John Wayne?</shanghai noon>


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Luceon wrote:
TheFinish wrote:
Flaming Duck wrote:
As an aside: I'm not seeing anything on threatening the second diagonal. Has the 5-foot teleport returned?

Yup, they kept diagonal movement as it was in PF1 but didn't change this, so the second diagonal is 15ft away and not threatened, allowing for a step without provoking.

Of course, in PF1 they had to do a whole clarification on this that was kind of dumb to say that moving from the 2nd to the 1st diagonal did provoke even though the second diagonal isn't threatened, instead of doing the old 3.0 and just letting Reach weapons threaten those squares.

I hope they actually change the wording this time.

That clarification is a good thing and makes tons of sense, metric tons of sense, they need to keep that clarification, otherwise GMs like me will cheese the s+@! out of you reach fighters.

BTW I'm 100% in favor of no more doughnut of death.

The clarification would be entirely unneeded if they just kept the old language that Reach weapons threaten the second diagonal even though it's technically 15ft away.

That is a much simpler solution than a wordy explanation that runs contrary to the normal Threat/AoO rules put in there just so a Reach weapon can AoO someone coming in from the second diagonal but not actually threaten that square.

Especially considering the explanation is nowhere in PF2 at the moment, so right now, per RAW, you can approach anyone with AoO and a Reach weapon through the second diagonal and be perfectly fine.


Yeah, they updated PF1 twice:
1. To say that even though you didn't threaten the second diagonal, moving from there to the first passed through the imaginary 10' distance, so it provoked.
2. To say you threatened the second diagonal.

I'm surprised and annoyed that this didn't make it in, as now you can cheat your way into a creature with 10' reaches' threatened area again.

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