General Class Errors


Classes

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The purpose of this thread is to point out perceived editing errors and mistakes in the Classes section of the Playtest rulebook that do not warrant an entire thread about them. Please reference class and the the page number and along with your submission, and describe why you believe it to be an error.

Paladin
Pg. 109
LOYAL WARHORSE FEAT 6
You and your mount have grown closer, and your loyalty to
each other is unbreakable. The mount you gained through the
righteous ally class feature is now treated as a full-grown animal
companion (see page 284). In addition, your mount never attacks
you, even if it is magically compelled to do so. Finally, you can
make a Retributive Strike against anyone who hits your mount
with a Strike, even if the attack was not a critical hit.

The bold text does nothing. According to the Retributive Strike rules on pg. 106, the Trigger requires that the target be an "ally or friendly creature", and the text does not reference a Critical Hit at all. Since a Steed Righteous Ally counts as an animal companion, it already counts as a friendly creature. Bearing these facts in mind, the bold text does nothing.


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The Bard is missing their Level 20 class feat to allow 10th level spells.


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Guess I can put this here?

The entire first page of spell descriptions (Aberrant Whispers to Aerial Form) aren't in the bookmarks list.

"Oh, but you can just use the bookmark for 'A'" to which I say. Baleful Polymorph is bookmarked even though its the same page as 'B'


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I'm baffled that martials have so few skills. Bards having 7, versus Clerics 5, sounds about right, but Barbarian 3 in comparison? barbarians are rugged survivors, thematically, and should have wilderness skills. As it stands, their signature skills do not support this at all, and with only 3 trained skills (plus Int), there's not a lot of room for them, either. The same goes for Fighter, although they probably should have slightly different additional Signatures.

Barbarian Proposal:

* Increase trained skills at level 1 for barbarian to 5.
* Add Survival to the Barbarian Signatures.
* Add a trained skill to the barbarian at level 3, specific to each totem. At level 9 and 15 this skill increases to Expert and Master, respectively. This skill is also added to the Signature list, of course.

Fighter Proposal:

* Increase trained skills at level 1 for Fighter to 4.
* At level 3, 9 and 15, a Fighter can add Deception or one Lore skill to their trained and signature skills. They do not automatically advance.


The wizard gains general feats starting at 3rd level, but on the wizard's progression, this is tagged as 2nd level.


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No one has unarmored defense training innately (and there is no way to gain it)

Monks get expert as a class feature, so they're fine, but all characters (and this especially effects wizards and sorcerers, even under mage armor) are at -2 AC for not being trained.

--
The class section on proficiencies (p43) specifically calls out that anything not mentioned in the class entry is considered untrained.


Colette Brunel wrote:
The wizard gains general feats starting at 3rd level, but on the wizard's progression, this is tagged as 2nd level.

Clarification: the table (3-21) is correct, the text is correct. The error is in the 'highlighted' level next to 'General Feats' which says 2nd.

I couldn't find the error at first, because I was reading the table and the text.


Makarion wrote:

I'm baffled that martials have so few skills. Bards having 7, versus Clerics 5, sounds about right, but Barbarian 3 in comparison? barbarians are rugged survivors, thematically, and should have wilderness skills. As it stands, their signature skills do not support this at all, and with only 3 trained skills (plus Int), there's not a lot of room for them, either. The same goes for Fighter, although they probably should have slightly different additional Signatures.

Barbarian Proposal:

* Increase trained skills at level 1 for barbarian to 5.
* Add Survival to the Barbarian Signatures.
* Add a trained skill to the barbarian at level 3, specific to each totem. At level 9 and 15 this skill increases to Expert and Master, respectively. This skill is also added to the Signature list, of course.

Fighter Proposal:

* Increase trained skills at level 1 for Fighter to 4.
* At level 3, 9 and 15, a Fighter can add Deception or one Lore skill to their trained and signature skills. They do not automatically advance.

If you think the fighter and barbarian base skill seems low check the alchemists. They get 2 skills + int modifier. Now they generally will be decent because they are focusing on int but still kinda how few skills they get by default.


General typo in doubling/halving damage (p293):

Quote:

For example, if you critically hit with a +1 longsword,

you would roll 4d8 and add your modifier twice instead
of rolling 2d8 and adding your modifier once.

Longswords do 1d8 damage (no listed weapon does 2 dice of anything) according to p180

Scarab Sages Order of the Amber Die

Draco18s wrote:

General typo in doubling/halving damage (p293):

Quote:

For example, if you critically hit with a +1 longsword,

you would roll 4d8 and add your modifier twice instead
of rolling 2d8 and adding your modifier once.
Longswords do 1d8 damage (no listed weapon does 2 dice of anything) according to p180

+1 weapons do an extra die of damage when they hit, which then gets doubled on a critical hit


Shpaackle wrote:
+1 weapons do an extra die of damage when they hit, which then gets doubled on a critical hit

Where's that stated? I haven't been able to find it.


Draco18s wrote:
Shpaackle wrote:
+1 weapons do an extra die of damage when they hit, which then gets doubled on a critical hit
Where's that stated? I haven't been able to find it.

Weapon potency rune, page 371

The Exchange Order of the Amber Die

Draco18s wrote:
Shpaackle wrote:
+1 weapons do an extra die of damage when they hit, which then gets doubled on a critical hit
Where's that stated? I haven't been able to find it.

Pg 371 top right of the page under Weapon Potency Rune.


Voss wrote:
Weapon potency rune, page 371

Thanks.

The double/half damage section could probably still be clarified with a second example, because the +1-ness in PF2 is so different than PF1, you can't take a +1 longsword as dealing 2d8 damage as fact (it relies on looking up two other rules in two other places in the book, which haven't even been addressed yet!)


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

Not sure if this is an error... Bard pg 64, spell repertoire states that they begin with one first level spell and gain spells as they gain spell slots. However, this leaves them with less first level spells known than any other level, 2 (gained from 2nd) compared with 3 spells known (starting at 2 and gaining another the following level) for every other level.


Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Alchemist's Poison Touch ability: You can spend 1 Resonance Point to apply a dose of contact or injury potion of your level or lower to your hands. Applying the poison does not poison you, but after the poison is applied, you can make a melee touch attack with your hand or a fist attack to poison your target. On a success, the poison is applied to the target. On a failure, the poison is wasted.

Two things here. First is that this can be interpreted as allowing an additional attack after applying the poison, making it a single action to apply the poison and then make an unarmed attack. The wording should be changed to something like "After the poison is applied, the next fist attack you make poisons your target. You can also make a melee touch attack in place of a fist attack." Bit wordier, but more airtight.

Second, the "on a failure, the poison is wasted" part is out of line with similar stuff in 1e. I can't tell if that's in-line with how 2e works though since I can't seem to find any rules on how held touch spells work.


It seems consistent with other abilities (rogue has a poison weapon ability that is wasted on a miss).

The action does seem odd. The rogue version specifies the next attack, while this does imply a free one as part of this action. But then it's level 12 rather 4 and costs resonance.


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Perhaps I'm reading it wrong, but I'm having a hard time determining where Alchemists get 8 starting formulas (as stated in the class preview).

The Advanced Alchemy class feature (pg. 45) states "You gain the Alchemical Crafting feat (see page 162), even if you don’t meet that feat’s prerequisites, and you gain the four additional common 1st-level alchemical formulas that feat grants."

This makes it sound like you only get the 4 common formulas from the feat. It seems like this should read "and you gain four additional common 1st-level alchemical formulas beyond the four that are granted by the feat." Or, "and you gain four additional common 1st-level alchemical formulas along with the ones that feat grants."

Just my thoughts.


Clerics and Druids, starting skills
Everyone else (even sorcerer, though its expressed oddly), trained skills is equal to the number of signature skills.

Cleric gets trained in 5, druid in 4, and get 4 (Druid: 3) set signature skills plus one determined by deity/order.

But cleric and druid also get trained in a skill set by deity/order.

Are they actually supposed to start with 6 (druid: 5) trained skills, and one less signature skill, or is the sidebar effectively counting the bonus trained skill already, and they only have the free choice of 4 (or 3 for druids) plus one determined by deity/order?

It seems at odds with the way sorcerer skills are handled (This is also true for powers vs class feats- sorcerers are penalized in class feats but cleric/druids are not)

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Starfinder Society Subscriber
Darkwood71 wrote:

Perhaps I'm reading it wrong, but I'm having a hard time determining where Alchemists get 8 starting formulas (as stated in the class preview).

The Advanced Alchemy class feature (pg. 45) states "You gain the Alchemical Crafting feat (see page 162), even if you don’t meet that feat’s prerequisites, and you gain the four additional common 1st-level alchemical formulas that feat grants."

This makes it sound like you only get the 4 common formulas from the feat. It seems like this should read "and you gain four additional common 1st-level alchemical formulas beyond the four that are granted by the feat." Or, "and you gain four additional common 1st-level alchemical formulas along with the ones that feat grants."

Just my thoughts.

I had a fun couple times re-reading the Alchemist's number of starting formulas. Because the Formula Book on the bottom of page 46 also states "The formula book contains formulas for your choice of 4 common 1st-level alchemical items."

Until you pointed out that the preview shows 8 formulas, I was starting to wonder whether they get four. Or if both class feature's stack and make 8.

After the preview, I am certain they are supposed to stack. It is just a very wordy way of having them both stack.

EDIT: Read over the Alchemical Crafting feat, and realized its again, just 4 common ones... I still think the two effects stack.


Class: Alchemist Page Number 49

The debilitating bomb feat's trigger condition says "You craft an alchemical item that has the elixir trait using the Quick Alchemy action." It seems like the trigger should be You craft an alchemical bomb using the Quick Alchemy action. Like the other bomb feats.


Kitsune Kune wrote:

I had a fun couple times re-reading the Alchemist's number of starting formulas. Because the Formula Book on the bottom of page 46 also states "The formula book contains formulas for your choice of 4 common 1st-level alchemical items."

Ahhhhhh...

I can't tell you how much that confused me. For whatever reason, I didn't connect the default four in the book with the four from the feat. Maybe because the feat was mentioned before the book (I dunno). Thanks for pointing that out.

Scarab Sages

Camellen wrote:
Not sure if this is an error... Bard pg 64, spell repertoire states that they begin with one first level spell and gain spells as they gain spell slots. However, this leaves them with less first level spells known than any other level, 2 (gained from 2nd) compared with 3 spells known (starting at 2 and gaining another the following level) for every other level.

Yup, came here for this. I'm guessing it should be 2 spells at level 1, and up to 3 at level 2. It would be silly to only have 2 level 1 spells and 3 of every other level.

I kept reading and found that you gain a 1st level spell from your muse. I'm guessing that's where the missing spell comes from?


Rogue feat: Bludgeoneer
You can deal sneak attack damage with one-handed weapons of the club and mace groups even if they don't have the agile or finesse trait.

1) should be traits (there are two of them).
2) there is no 'mace group,' maces are in the club group.

3) As written, this works for staff. It may or may not work if using the staff as 'two hand d8'


Pathfinder Rulebook, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Feral Mutagen on page 49:

"Your feral mutagen truly brings out the beast lurking within you. Whenever you’re affected by a feral mutagen, you gain the mutagen’s item bonus to your Intimidation checks..."

There is no "feral mutagen" item defined in the rules. Based on the other mutagen feats, it's presumably referring to the "Bestial Mutagen"


Noticed some odd things with Fighter. The 6th level class feat Exotic Weapon Training gives you trained proficiency with a single exotic weapon but the Fighters class proficiencies say their trained in all exotic weapons, making that feat mostly redundant.

Both Weapon Specialization at level 13 and Weapon Legend at level 19 say you gain access to the critical specialization effects of all weapon groups. Only thing I can figure here is that at level 13 it only applies to simple and martial given the ordering of that paragraph.


Pathfinder Rulebook, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

The class table on Page 13 says Rangers can choose between Strength or Dexterity for their key ability score. The Ranger class page on Page 113, however, lists only Dexterity under "Key Ability Score".


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Just a cut paste of a post I made earlier that I think applies to this thread:

Abberation sorcerers gain the 9th level spell of shapechange.

"You transform yourself into any form you could choose with a
different polymorph spell you know of 7th level or lower. You
choose the type of creature as you cast the spell rather than
when you prepare it. You can Concentrate on the Spell to change
your form to any other form you could choose with this spell.
You can dismiss this spell by using an action (this action has the
concentrate trait)."

SO umm there are no polymorph spells on the occultist list, nor on the list of gained spells from your abberation bloodline. So you cast this spell to become yourself I guess for one minute.

The spell seems a little underwhelming anyway even just for a primal sorcerer. One of the few advantages I have as a spontaneous caster is that I dont have to pick the form I become in the morning. So if I have dragon form I can become whatever color dragon I need to fit the occasion. That is slightly better than say a druid who will have to guess. That said, the only advantage that shapechange gives a primal sorcerer is that I can change into a red dragon, then a dinosaur(I guess), then into a blue dragon. That is provided that
1)I know both the polymorph dino spell and polymorph dragon spell and
2) I need to change into those forms within one minute of casting the shapechange spell.

This spell seems a bad option for primal sorcerers and of course a bad joke for abberation sorcerers as printed.

If they allowed sorcerers to duplicate any of the lower level non offensive polymorph spells with it, I could see it being a pretty decent spell with lots of potential utility.


Alchemist's fire deals 1d8 damage per the rules on 360. However per the empower bomb ability listed in the alchemist class you can double the base damage of alchemist fire to 2d6.

So is the base damage 1d6 or 1d8?


Alchemist debilitating bomb ability trigger is making an elixir and not a bomb.

Liberty's Edge

There seems to be no way to learn a ritual.


Let me know if this is my confusion rather than a typo, please!

Barbarian
Page 57

Raging Courage (Barbarian, Concentrate, Rage) - You concentrate on the power of your rage, overcoming your fear. When you Rage, reduce your frightened condition by 1.

Either "When you Rage" is the text or the "Rage" tag seems out of place here -- "When You Rage" is generally used to indicate something that is triggered at the time you initiate a Rage, but the "Rage" tag indicates you must already be raging to use it. (vs "when you are raging / while you are raging", which indicate states that are ongoing throughout a rage.)

I think this feat is trying to let an already-raging barbarian take 2 actions to pull herself together and shrug off a level of fear, which would mean just striking "When you Rage" -- compare to the text of "Renewed Vigor" on page 59.


Most Monk Stances are worded as so:

Tiger Stance, p.99
You enter the stance of a tiger, using your hands like claws. You can make tiger claw attacks. (emphasis mine)

Meanwhile, Crane Stance is worded differently:

Crane Stance, p.99
You enter the stance of a crane, standing on one leg while folding your arms in an imitation of a crane’s wings. You gain a +1 circumstance bonus to AC, but the only Strikes you can make are crane wing attacks. (emphasis mine)

So my point is, is it intentional that only Crane Stance forbids the use of other strikes?

Grand Lodge

Barbarian and Fighter both have the Sudden Charge class feat, but different tags.

Fighter Sudden Charge has the following: Attack, Fighter, Move, Open

Barbarian Sudden Charge: Barbarian

Is this intentional or a typo, I think the latter.

Also Acute Vision and Raging Intimidation should have the Rage tags too, I assume. Since they require you to be raging! Didn't check others.


5 of the 8 feats for the Alchemist that trigger off of Quick Alchemy don't list the trigger: quick alchemy.

Eg. Delayed Bomb:

Quote:

DELAYED BOMB FEAT 6

When using Quick Alchemy to craft an
alchemical item with the bomb trait
, you can build it to explode
automatically after a certain amount of time. This delay can be
any number of rounds up to your level, chosen when you craft
the bomb.

Compared to Smoke Bomb:

Quote:

SMOKE BOMB FEAT 1

Frequency once per round
Trigger You craft an alchemical bomb using the Quick Alchemy action.
You cause the bomb to create a cloud of thick smoke in addition to its normal effects.
When thrown, it creates a cloud of smoke in a 10-foot-radius burst.

Sovereign Court

Draco18s wrote:

5 of the 8 feats for the Alchemist that trigger off of Quick Alchemy don't list the trigger: quick alchemy.

Eg. Delayed Bomb:

Quote:

DELAYED BOMB FEAT 6

When using Quick Alchemy to craft an
alchemical item with the bomb trait
, you can build it to explode
automatically after a certain amount of time. This delay can be
any number of rounds up to your level, chosen when you craft
the bomb.

Compared to Smoke Bomb:

Quote:

SMOKE BOMB FEAT 1

Frequency once per round
Trigger You craft an alchemical bomb using the Quick Alchemy action.
You cause the bomb to create a cloud of thick smoke in addition to its normal effects.
When thrown, it creates a cloud of smoke in a 10-foot-radius burst.

Since you can only activate one feat per trigger, it might be correct. It seems you can create a delayed smoke bomb. Otherwise you could create a delayed bomb or a smoke bomb, but not apply both feats.


just noticed that you can't actually make Mutagens using either Advanced or Quick alchemy.

"Mutagen crafting" only allows you to add them to your formula book, while both Advanced and Quick Alchemy have the double limitation of "COMMON recipes from your recipe book"

in fact, even if you find uncommon/rare/etc formulas, you'll never be able to make them the way the abilities are worded...


uuuhhhh is Lamashtu supposed to allow you to channel POSITIVE energy??


Secret Wizard wrote:
So my point is, is it intentional that only Crane Stance forbids the use of other strikes?

I believe that is intentional. Crane Stance is explicitly called out as not working with monastic weapons, but the other stances work just fine with them. I think this is mostly to represent that it's hard to do stuff not designed to work with the "standing on one leg" stance when you're standing on one leg.

Secret Wizard wrote:
uuuhhhh is Lamashtu supposed to allow you to channel POSITIVE energy??

She is. As a goddess of motherhood (albeit a perverse version of it) she has an interest in preserving and promoting life, ergo healing.


Secret Wizard wrote:
uuuhhhh is Lamashtu supposed to allow you to channel POSITIVE energy??

I believe so. It is so her followers can heal all her misshapen and malformed creatures. It was discussed in... the cleric blog (I think).


Ranger is meant to be Animal Companion abilities but never gets the ability to let the AC take a single action without you telling it to take an action.


Fury of the Tempest wrote:
Ranger is meant to be Animal Companion abilities but never gets the ability to let the AC take a single action without you telling it to take an action.

Possibly intended, as elsewhere you can note that they intend for druids to be simply better at Animal Companion-ing, given that they get advancement options earlier. Though it does seem odd that Cavaliers get that ability but not rangers.

Dark Archive

"You select how many items are in the batch, up to half the normal maximum batch size (half a typical batch is two items, but see the Crafting Trained Activities section on page for more information)." Page 45

The page number is missing.

Dark Archive

Multi-classing:
Fighter - Advanced Maneuver - Take a fighter feat up to half your level
Rogue - Advanced Trickery - Take a rogue feat up to half your level
Wizard - Advanced Arcana - Take a wizard feat up to half your level

Cleric - Advanced Dogma - Gain one Cleric feat. For the purposes of meeting its prerequisites your Cleric level is equal to your Actual Level.

So if you MC into Cleric, you can take Miraculous Power and have 10th level Cleric Spells.


Rogues get Trained in all simple weapons, plus the hand crossbow, rapier, sap, shortbow, and shortsword.

Hand Crossbow is a simple weapon.

Something that I don't know if its intention or not, but is Retributive Strike supposed to ignore multiple attack penalty like Attack of Opportunity? Reactions which are strikes are not effected by multiple attack penalty (p182) and some reactions mention this (such as Attack of Opportunity) and others do not (suck as Retributive Strike).


ebfi3e wrote:
Something that I don't know if its intention or not, but is Retributive Strike supposed to ignore multiple attack penalty like Attack of Opportunity?

Multiple attack penalty never applies to attacks made off your turn. (page 178)


Fuzzy-Wuzzy wrote:
ebfi3e wrote:
Something that I don't know if its intention or not, but is Retributive Strike supposed to ignore multiple attack penalty like Attack of Opportunity?
Multiple attack penalty never applies to attacks made off your turn. (page 178)

Was in the process of editing post when you posted this :).


Darkorin wrote:
Since you can only activate one feat per trigger, it might be correct. It seems you can create a delayed smoke bomb. Otherwise you could create a delayed bomb or a smoke bomb, but not apply both feats.

Plausible, but confusing

Scarab Sages

1) Druid's feat table p. 82 is incomplete, stopping at letter s, while there are feats with t and w.

2) Druid feat Savage Slice works only for slashing damage weapons, which is only scimitar (all wild from attacks are unarmed) Probably, it should be just slashing melee strike.

3) Table 1-2 Classes indicates Druid's secondary stats are Con and Dex, while the class uses strength for one of core abilities. Either wild shape should use Constitution or table should have strength.


Boulder Roll action icon doesn't match other 2-action icons used elsewhere in the book.

Direct comparison

Power Attack on left, Boulder Roll on right.

The base square is smaller and the first wedge thicker, as well as the square having a solid pure-white outline (instead of being transparent to let the subtle background texture show through). The outline is harder to see without boosting the contrast, but there's some evidence of it in the comparison (bottom) where the blue "minor difference" has a diagonal edge in the upper left while the majority of the background differences are square.

I happened to notice this when grabbing the icon for use on my custom excel character sheet for the actions my character has available in chapter 3.

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