Kingmaker + Ultimate Intrigue: Interest check


Recruitment


I ran a tabletop Kingmaker/Ultimate Intrigue combination campaign a while back, and it was a blast – right up until about the end of book 2, when half my players decided they weren’t into the whole kingdom-building thing any more, while the other half were really into it. It kind of fell apart after that.

I would really like to give it another shot, going all the way through the AP as I had it planned out. I’m therefore wondering whether there’s any interest on these boards in doing a more ‘political intrigue’ version of Kingmaker.

I think the Kingmaker AP as written is a great start, but in my view it misses the mark slightly. Let’s be blunt: you have an entire kingdom where the ruling line ended and a new noble family claims the throne as regent, with the kingdom roughly split in two between north and south, with all the politicking that suggests – and the players spend all their time on the border of that country and essentially don't interact with the power politics. Therefore, in addition to the wilderness exploration and kingdom-building themes of this AP, I would be looking to introduce some elements from Ultimate Intrigue. In particular, I would be looking to use the Game of Nobles (which incorporates Relationships and Loyalty, The Importance of Appearances, Bargains and Compromise, and The Power of Secrets elements); and also Verbal Duels.

If that’s of interest, then this thread is for you! If I get enough posters then I will put up a recruitment thread.


I'd definitely be interested. Kingmaker is my favorite.

Scarab Sages

Pathfinder Starfinder Society Subscriber

Interest here as well


Is it a deal breaker if I've read the modules? I'm running a heavily modified Kingmaker set in Azlant at the moment, but Kingmaker is probably my favorite AP. I have some really fun concepts but I figure it's better to ask before I start going in depth with them.


I've heard good things about Kingmaker, so I'd also be interested.


JDPhipps wrote:
Is it a deal breaker if I've read the modules? I'm running a heavily modified Kingmaker set in Azlant at the moment, but Kingmaker is probably my favorite AP. I have some really fun concepts but I figure it's better to ask before I start going in depth with them.

Not an issue at all! I'm planning to change significant parts of the AP so your prior knowledge is no help at all :-)


Provisionally interested as long as I can find an idea that I'll enjoy enough. I've made a lot of (similar) intrigue characters recently so I'd need to think of something else...

Perhaps a 'Noble Savage' type character who doesn't like being lied to... :D

Grand Lodge

I'd love to play in a game like you're describing.


I'd be interested in this for sure. I have applied for at least 15 Kingmaker games, and though I keep seeing the same people get selected before me, I haven't given up hope just yet!


Interested!


Sounds interesting.


Intrested.


Interested


Kingmaker is always a favorite. Add a twist to make it "new" again and you definitely have my interest.


(waves to some old sparring partners in R0B0 and Nik)

Also very interested - thinking a Sword Binder Wizard - neophyte trying to follow the ancient warrior-diplomat path.


Yes, I would be very interested. I haven't read up on all the systems from ultimate intrigue in a while, but I am sure it would be great in the context of kingmaker. I'v had a few ideas in the past for kingmaker characters. Depending on creation rules I'll see what works, or make something completely now, but you can color me intrigued.

Dark Archive

dot for interest.

depending on what's allowed, i may shoot for the crazy court jester, that just so happens to also be the royal spymaster, but he/she cannot really confirm that for sure...

this jester will either be a Kobold, Ratfolk, or catfolk if possible


OK, I think that's a solid 'yes' to the interest check. Thanks to all who posted.

I still need to dig out my notes from wherever I've kept them, and maybe update them a bit with some more thoughts I've had on how to kill challenge my players. I'll have the recruitment thread up in a week(ish) and will post a link to it here.

william Nightmoon wrote:

dot for interest.

depending on what's allowed, i may shoot for the crazy court jester, that just so happens to also be the royal spymaster, but he/she cannot really confirm that for sure...

this jester will either be a Kobold, Ratfolk, or catfolk if possible

Just a heads-up: I will probably go core races. I haven't decided yet, but anything particularly outlandish would need a fabulous backstory in order to get in. Something to work on in the meantime :)


Fairly interested. I'm never sure how I feel about verbal combat. I worry that part in particular, it feels like it would bog things down a bit more than it would offer to the game. (That's just my thoughts on it) Cause most verbal duels would be between one player and the GM right?

I'm good for all of the extra layer kind of thing to a very appropriate game

Dark Archive

I was thinking of Kobold In the hopes I could be from thw Kobold tribe in the first module, which doesn't nessisarily need to be erraticated, as the Kobolds are actually all pretty nice... For Kobolds.

I could be an ambassador, or possibly just a gift they decided to get rid of. I was planning Bard with either the Court fool archetype or the Court Bard archetype,
And the idea was to be... Well the fool. I make jokes, snide remarks, funny quips and all the while folks get so used to having g the fool around they don't think of sending him away during the Serious stuff ;P


Vitaliano da Riva wrote:

Fairly interested. I'm never sure how I feel about verbal combat. I worry that part in particular, it feels like it would bog things down a bit more than it would offer to the game. (That's just my thoughts on it) Cause most verbal duels would be between one player and the GM right?

I'm good for all of the extra layer kind of thing to a very appropriate game

I've adapted the rules slightly so that it is (or can be) a party-based activity: you decide who's going to allocate which skill to which tactic (so you can't have 2 people using Bluff for different tactics) but it allows everyone who wants to to participate. I also give significant bonuses for good RP :-)

It worked at the tabletop. If it doesn't work on PbP (and I'd rely on player feedback for that) then we'd either rebuild it or scrap it.

@William Nightmoon: OK, that might work (I'd have to think about it, but I'm not ruling it out immediately). I've expanded significantly on the kobold presence and they have an important role to play - provided the PCs don't just do the murderhobo thing and wipe them all out, that is >.<


william Nightmoon wrote:

I was thinking of Kobold In the hopes I could be from thw Kobold tribe in the first module, which doesn't nessisarily need to be erraticated, as the Kobolds are actually all pretty nice... For Kobolds.

I could be an ambassador, or possibly just a gift they decided to get rid of. I was planning Bard with either the Court fool archetype or the Court Bard archetype,
And the idea was to be... Well the fool. I make jokes, snide remarks, funny quips and all the while folks get so used to having g the fool around they don't think of sending him away during the Serious stuff ;P

@William Nightmoon: There is a kobold specific bard archetype that might be a decent flavour/crunch fit for what your proposing.

Have linkified it for you: Dragon Herald

Archetype does requires you to have a "dragon patron" - perhaps Choral's red dragons? You could claim a link to House Rogarvia by your proud wyrm lineage :) Edit; Apologies if you'd already considered (and discounted this)


Well, I'm late to the party, but I am certainly interested.
Kingmaker is probably the one AP that fascinates me the most, I have always enjoyed the whole building thing, a combination of kingdom building and regular rpg? Perfect.
And there is a lot of openings for social interaction in an intrigue game to boot.


Pathfinder Lost Omens, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Sounds awesome. Kingmaker is one of my favorite APs, and intrigue is always fun.


Good to know! and you aren't late - I haven't put the recruitment thread up yet :)


I am super excited for this. I got an idea for an Investigator rolling around in the noggin. Can't wait to see the character build rules.

Silver Crusade

Dot!

Dark Archive

I did consider rhe dragon herald, but I want d a concept that I could stick intk Almost any race. If I do not get to do something like a Kobold then my next race would be half-elf or just full elf.
Go for something like the Jester from DMC3 heheh..

But I also have a few backup concepts in the case that having a somewhat negotiably evil Character is out the window.

One such concept would be a Grand General cavalier dedicated tk the protection of the throne, likely having pledged himself to one of the other players, the one he believes is the rightful king.

Another concept would be the secretive court alchemist, dedicated to his own work, and using his large budget and endelss supply of subjects to his advantage.

And last is my divine type, a prodegy of Cayden. Likely an Inquisitor or something not restricted as a Palidan, after all what use is worshiping a god of ale if you can't drink some?


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I am intrigued.


This sounds very interesting to me.


I'd be curious about a LN or LE king. I think that is probably the most iconic behavior of a King. It'd be interesting to see a conqueror born in the Stolen Lands.


I am interested! Kingmaker sounds like a really fun one, but my RL players have never been very interested in the idea at all. I like the bookkeeping, they find it a bit of a chore.

I would likely be trying out my first bard as a PC


Super interested in this concept ever since first hearing about it. In our current intrigue game I ended up submitting my Cleric whom thematically I love how he came together but for an intrigue game is painfully lacking in skills. Would definitely love to try out something a bit different from that.


TheUnthinker wrote:
Super interested in this concept ever since first hearing about it. In our current intrigue game I ended up submitting my Cleric whom thematically I love how he came together but for an intrigue game is painfully lacking in skills. Would definitely love to try out something a bit different from that.

Have you looked at the Cardinal archetype? You drop a domain and some other stuff but you get 6+Int/level on skills!


I'm giving serious thought to a house rule that all 2+ skill point characters go to 4+ points. IMO, it's one of the few things that Starfinder got right.

@Vitaliano da Riva - an Evil aligned group will have a horribly difficult time in this AP. Although some problems will be solved more easily (kill em all and take their stuff), making allies is problematic. And you WILL need allies.


Well, it all really depends on what you consider interesting to play, personally though, the very fact that LN might be the most logical choice for a king makes me think that TRYING to be any of the good alignments might make for a fun challange.
Trying to balance being lawful AND good for example...
Can you be a strong ruler while at the same time being genuinely benevolent?


BoggBear wrote:
Can you be a strong ruler while at the same time being genuinely benevolent?

You are Niccolò Machiavelli and I claim my 5 ducats.


I'd be very interested in this.
I'd love to make a follower of Olheon for this. With a patron that is the empyreal lord of appointed rulers my characters would keep a very close eye on whoever is king/queen, if not fulfilling the position.


I mean true, but Evil doesn't mean stupid. You're just essentially greedy. Most cities are considered evil by pathfinder rules.

But I digress. It'd be rare to see it actually happen.

I'm not sure how you plan on doing recruitment but it might be better to recruit players over characters and then form the party after that for intrigue based games. It also would help potentially to have peoples character goals in line. If everyone wants to be king it'd be hard to play out. (Though, I mean a ruling cast of nobles would be interesting.)

Shadow Lodge

I’m actually DMing a game over Skype of kingmaker but if you’ll have me i’d Love to join in
I could bring in a venomblade Nagaji who served 5 years as a soldier in Orlovsky’s armies
Or a thunder striker bard (maybe Kitsune for race) of house Medyved interested in mapping out the stolen lands to their fullest.


I am interested in trying out the vigilante. Not sure if it will work with Kingmaker


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Wandering GM Wastrel wrote:
You are Niccolò Machiavelli and I claim my 5 ducats.

*laughs* Yes I have read the prince, it was required reading for me back in the day.


I'd be all over this, and if it helps The Prince was required reading for my college lit class so I've read it too.


@GM Wandering Wastrel - Not that I am excited but...

Shadow Lodge

I would say at this point you have found interest in your interest check


Definitely!

I like the prince too... now whether to play a character called Cesare?


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Recruitment thread now up. Thanks for your patience.

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