Strength based magus Elf.


Advice


Hey so im thinking about making a strength based magus, normally i wouldnt take elf, but its because of a concept i have.

I havent decided on anything else, all suggestions and help is appreciated. Thanks


By the way, its 20 point buy.


Actually ive wondered if it was possible to be mostly strength but also some dex, for the versatility.


Stats:
str- 16 dex- 14 (12) con- 14 (16) int- 14 (12) wis- 10 cha- 7

You basically put your whole point buy into str/con, then get points from cha and combine them with your racial bonuses to get your other important stats up to par. These stats are good enough for a basic gish- I usually use something similar (except I don't need a dump stat) for my other gishes.

After that, just grab a scimitar, and have fun with it. Probably use the str magus. Walter's Guide to the Magus is old, but good for the basics of feat selection and such.

Maybe grab a bit of hex crafter for a couple of good hexes (evil eye and flight are good, and don't rely much upon the save DC).


Sure sounds great, Ill try to go with that. Anything Else?


Oh
I Think Im going bladebound/hexcrafter.


Since strength is your highest stat and your tanking dex, you can use full plate. Mithral Full plate counts as medium so you can wear it at 7th and get some extra dex to it or you can go armored battlemage which heavy at 7th and medium at first.

Dark Archive

Shocking Grasp is a spell that obviously goes well with the class, bu5 Chill Touch and Frostbite are also reliable Spellstrike canidates, especially since they give you X attacks per caster level for each cast. Lot of mileage out of your lkmited spells per day.

Chill Touch in particular is a brutal main spell. Rime Spell metamagic feat lets it entangle people, and the Enforcer feat (when paired with the trait that lets you key intimidate off of intelligence) also lets you demoralize for free with each attack. Slap a Cruel enchantment onto your weapon and suddenly you'll be throwing half of the Condition Card deck at every opponent.

It isn't flawless. Things immune to cold/nonlethal/intimidate are harder to shut down, but that's what Shocking Grasp is for.

Regardless of your approach, I strongly suggest picking up a favorite spell, taking the Magical Lineage trait to make it easier to modify, and building around it accordingly.


Alright.. so what if i go like this
Elf, Bladebound Hexcrafter magus
Str: 17, Dex: 14, Con: 12, Int: 14, Wis: 8, Cha: 10.
Traits: Magical Lineage: Shocking grasp, Seeker?
Feats??
Hexes: Flight at 4th level.
Weapon: Black blade rapier. (I dont see a reason to go scimitar, since im not going dervish dance)
I will try to get a belt of strength
To pump up my int i will get a headband at the later levels.

Dark Archive

Rapier is a great weapon thanks to the crit range, but scimitar slightly outperforms it. DR/Slashing is a more common kind of Damare Reduction and when you're not casting spells you can 2-hand the scimitar for 1.5 times your strength modifier in damage.

Plus, if you get Power Attack, the bonus damage is even better when 2ha ding it.

But at the end of the day, just go with what seems fun. Hell, was planning a strength Magus with a mere 19-20 range crit weapon for funsies.


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Thunderlord wrote:
Since strength is your highest stat and your tanking dex, you can use full plate. Mithral Full plate counts as medium so you can wear it at 7th and get some extra dex to it or you can go armored battlemage which heavy at 7th and medium at first.

Something to keep in mind: You don't get heavy armor proficiency until 13th level, so you'd still have the armor check penalty to attack rolls and movement checks unless you spent a feat on proficiency or picked it up from another class.


Oki, it just crossed my mind, is it possible to make additional 5-foot steps?


Magdyyret wrote:
Oki, it just crossed my mind, is it possible to make additional 5-foot steps?

What do you mean by this? More than one 5-foot step per round? No you can't (possibly you can with specific items/spells).

What exactly are you trying to achieve? There might be a way to do something similar that will suit you ...?


MrCharisma wrote:
Magdyyret wrote:
Oki, it just crossed my mind, is it possible to make additional 5-foot steps?

What do you mean by this? More than one 5-foot step per round? No you can't (possibly you can with specific items/spells).

What exactly are you trying to achieve? There might be a way to do something similar that will suit you ...?

My plan would be to cast a spell, 5 foot step closer, attack, 5 foot step out.

Or is it possible for a magus to charge in , spell shocking grasp, attack and 5 foot step out. The reason i wanted to know if i could 5 foot step 2 times was so i didnt had to cast it with provoking an attack.


Just wanted to point out that my magus is gonna go up in level really quick, because my other character got taken out, so i had to reroll, the rest of the party is level 7.


You can't take a 5ft step and movement. BUT you can totally cast a touch spell and then reguarly move into combat, which doesn't provoke.


Okay, i actually thought about going dex magus, and ofc. Go dervish dance, but then take a dip into shadowdancer to get hide in plain sight.. then i would go for a more sneaky type of build.


If i go dex magus, ill atleast want to have a decent strength for roleplay purposes.
This is what im thinking
Str: 13
Dex: 18
Con: 12
Int: 14
Wis: 10
Cha: 10

Is it decent?


A decent strength is almost always required IMO, because carrying capacity is just that annoying. That looks fairly decent, consing what you're doing. Maybe dump Cha a bit to get more points to spend elsewhere.


Brolof wrote:
A decent strength is almost always required IMO, because carrying capacity is just that annoying. That looks fairly decent, consing what you're doing. Maybe dump Cha a bit to get more points to spend elsewhere.

Normally i maybe would dump it, but for this concept i dont want any dumbstats.. roleplay vise i prefer no dumbstats.


Check out the alternate racial traits Arcane Focus and Overwhelming Magic:

Arcane Focus
Advanced Race Guide
Some elven families have such long traditions of producing wizards (and other arcane spellcasters) that they raise their children with the assumption each is destined to be a powerful magic-user, with little need for mundane concerns such as skill with weapons. Elves with this racial trait gain a +2 racial bonus on concentration checks made to cast arcane spells defensively. This racial trait replaces weapon familiarity.

Overwhelming Magic
Inner Sea Races
Some elves obsess over the fundamentals of magic, training for decades to add layers of potent spellwork before they ever begin practicing true spells. This builds a foundation that makes their magic increasingly difficult to resist. These elves gain Spell Focus as a bonus feat. This racial trait replaces elven magic and weapon familiarity.

You can’t take them both, because they both replace Weapon Familiarity. But unless you really have to have an elven racial weapon, you probably want to pick up one or the other.


Alright, anyone else wanna share their thoughts?


Magdyyret wrote:
MrCharisma wrote:
Magdyyret wrote:
Oki, it just crossed my mind, is it possible to make additional 5-foot steps?

What do you mean by this? More than one 5-foot step per round? No you can't (possibly you can with specific items/spells).

What exactly are you trying to achieve? There might be a way to do something similar that will suit you ...?

My plan would be to cast a spell, 5 foot step closer, attack, 5 foot step out.

Sorry it's been a little while.

Short answer: No it's not possible.

There is LUNGE. It won't come online quickly, but it'll help.

Also LONG ARM is a 1st level Magus spell. I think it's a decent choice for a wand with WAND WIELDER. Get yourself a SPRING LOADED WRIST SHEATH and open every combat with Long Arm. You can just drop the wand and pick it up after the fight.


Can't believe I didn't see anyone point out at the Mindblade archetype yet.

If you're building on STR, it's the best archetype to go for, for 2 simple reasons:
1- It negates the spellcasting failure chances of armors, allowing you to wear a fullplate and get out of any need for DEX
2- From level 13, it allows you to use a 2H weapon with spell combat and spellstrike, which optimize you STR-based damage

Basicaly, you can end with an heavy armored magus doing 2H power attack shocking grasp strikes...
And since you plan to be an elf, the 2H weapon could be either:
- an Elven Curved Sword, featuring a 15-20 critical range
- an Elven Branch Spear, giving your reach

... or both, in fact, since the Mindblade allow you to reshape your weapon at will, depending of the needs.

Note that if you use the Elven Branch Spear, you can exploit reach to hit someone at 10ft, then 5-foot step back at 15ft, forcing them to make a normal move to get back in range to hit you, and taking an attack of opportunity from you in the process.


The mindblade seems cool, but i already decided to go with Bladebound and Hexcrafter..


Well, go dex, then, because IMHO you cannot be truly good as a STR magus with those archetypes.


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Moonheart wrote:
Well, go dex, then, because IMHO you cannot be truly good as a STR magus with those archetypes.

I would like to offer a counterpoint. Nothing in either archetype is counterproductive to Str-based weapon wielding. The extra feats saved would lets you pick up metamagics or extra arcana more freely.

Magdyyret wrote:

Alright.. so what if i go like this

Elf, Bladebound Hexcrafter magus
Str: 17, Dex: 14, Con: 12, Int: 14, Wis: 8, Cha: 10.
Traits: Magical Lineage: Shocking grasp, Seeker?
Feats??
Hexes: Flight at 4th level.
Weapon: Black blade rapier. (I dont see a reason to go scimitar, since im not going dervish dance)
I will try to get a belt of strength
To pump up my int i will get a headband at the later levels.

Personally I'd grab slumber at 4th and flight at 6th, so actual flight is already online when you grab it. But that's a style choice. I would recommend magical lineage: frostbite over shocking grasp; frostbite lasts longer and will do more damage over a couple full attack than shocking grasp will. You can still keep 1-2 shocking grasps prepared for boss-type enemies. The shenanigans Rosc mentioned are very effective indeed, and rather than seeker you'd want bruising intellect to have intimidate key off Int.


Darigaaz the Igniter wrote:
I would like to offer a counterpoint. Nothing in either archetype is counterproductive to Str-based weapon wielding. The extra feats saved would lets you pick up metamagics or extra arcana more freely.

The Magus class itself is counterproductive to a Str base.

You basicaly play an arcane spellcaster, which is prone to the armor spell failure chance, and which goes in melee.
Which means you need AC, but you cannot truly wear an armor going beyong a mithral chain without just gimping yourself by screwing your spellcasting abilities.

Dex is almost the only good way to build a Magus, except if you make it a Mindblade, which cancel the armor penality entierly.


Moonheart wrote:
Darigaaz the Igniter wrote:
I would like to offer a counterpoint. Nothing in either archetype is counterproductive to Str-based weapon wielding. The extra feats saved would lets you pick up metamagics or extra arcana more freely.

The Magus class itself is counterproductive to a Str base.

You basicaly play an arcane spellcaster, which is prone to the armor spell failure chance, and which goes in melee.
Which means you need AC, but you cannot truly wear an armor going beyong a mithral chain without just gimping yourself by screwing your spellcasting abilities.

Dex is almost the only good way to build a Magus, except if you make it a Mindblade, which cancel the armor penality entierly.

And there's nothing stopping you from wearing mithril chain as a str-based magus. Especially with all the defensive spells you have access to. One can even buff and attack at the same time with spell combat if necessary.


Moonheart wrote:
Darigaaz the Igniter wrote:
I would like to offer a counterpoint. Nothing in either archetype is counterproductive to Str-based weapon wielding. The extra feats saved would lets you pick up metamagics or extra arcana more freely.

The Magus class itself is counterproductive to a Str base.

You basicaly play an arcane spellcaster, which is prone to the armor spell failure chance, and which goes in melee.
Which means you need AC, but you cannot truly wear an armor going beyong a mithral chain without just gimping yourself by screwing your spellcasting abilities.

Dex is almost the only good way to build a Magus, except if you make it a Mindblade, which cancel the armor penality entierly.

I don't know where you're getting your info but a magus can wear medium armour at level 7 and heavy armour at level 13 without incurring the normal arcane spell failure chance.

I help put together a Bladebound Hexcrafter magus for another player in our group and it's a very good combo. Blade Tutor's Spirit is a useful spell for reducing/negating the voluntary attack penalties incurred from using Spell Combat and Power Attack.

In addition to Flight I'd take at least the Evil Eye hex with which you can further offset any penalties to hit/being 3/4 BAB by lowering you target's ac.

The Wand Wielder and Wand Mastery arcana can further offset the loss of spell recall form the Hexcrafter archetype, save your spell slots and unleash a little magic when you can't make concentration checks/cast defensively.


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things I've picked up playing my current Magus (Kensai) to level 16;
don't waste feats or traits on anything that bumps up Concentration. As a reduced level caster, your Concentration DCs never get high enough to justify the feat or trait, plus you can eat off your accuracy if a spell is really clutch.
Intensified Shocking Grasp is your best friend, get the Magical Lineage trait so you can still cast it as a 1st level spell and pick up a Ring of Wizardry I ASAP, ZOT some people!
The Lingering Pain arcana is really all you need for magical opponents, don't feel like you need Disruptive or Spellbreaker
Remember that Spell Combat is not just for blasting/shocking grasp, use it to cast buff spells and attack. The most annoying probably being FA + Spell Combat with Vanish at the end, but Shield, Resist Energy, Bull's Strength, etc...also up your effectiveness in combat greatly.

also Corrosive Consumption is pretty gross with the swift Maximize arcana at higher levels...


I would put the starting stats: 16 str, 14 dex, 13con, 16 int, 10 wis, 7 cha. Normally I don't really dump stats, but your stats are working against you enough to rationalize it.

If you are really dead set against dumping then I'd go:
15 str, 13 dex, 13 con, 16 int 10 wis, 10 cha

If you don't mind a 9:
15 str, 14 dex, 13 con, 16 int 10 wis, 9 cha

lvl 4 +1con, equvalent to 3 point buy. All other +stats to str. If the first point buy

lvl 4 +1 str, lvl 8 +1 con the rest str. If the second or third.

You don't need amazing strength as a magus, so I wouldn't bother starting with 17, I can understand why you want to, but it's a real pity to have an elf magus starting with less than 16 int. The stat does a hell of a lot for you, it's a lot more than just save dcs, trust me you want it.

Also you will really want the 14 con no magic items, as a d8 front liner 12 con is really pushing it without incredible AC, and you aren't really there.

So you mentionned that the rest of the party is still level 7 and you are level 1? You should discuss things with your GM, you won't be able to acomplish very much, and you will die if hit once, or caught in one AoE. Most people start at the same level as the rest of the party, if that isn't on the table, see if your GM will let you at least not start at 1.

There is an arcana that would really benifit from 16 int, you can add your int to attack for a round, it's pretty nice.


Hogeyhead wrote:

I would put the starting stats: 16 str, 14 dex, 13con, 16 int, 10 wis, 7 cha. Normally I don't really dump stats, but your stats are working against you enough to rationalize it.

If you are really dead set against dumping then I'd go:
15 str, 13 dex, 13 con, 16 int 10 wis, 10 cha

If you don't mind a 9:
15 str, 14 dex, 13 con, 16 int 10 wis, 9 cha

lvl 4 +1con, equvalent to 3 point buy. All other +stats to str. If the first point buy

lvl 4 +1 str, lvl 8 +1 con the rest str. If the second or third.

You don't need amazing strength as a magus, so I wouldn't bother starting with 17, I can understand why you want to, but it's a real pity to have an elf magus starting with less than 16 int. The stat does a hell of a lot for you, it's a lot more than just save dcs, trust me you want it.

Also you will really want the 14 con no magic items, as a d8 front liner 12 con is really pushing it without incredible AC, and you aren't really there.

So you mentionned that the rest of the party is still level 7 and you are level 1? You should discuss things with your GM, you won't be able to acomplish very much, and you will die if hit once, or caught in one AoE. Most people start at the same level as the rest of the party, if that isn't on the table, see if your GM will let you at least not start at 1.

There is an arcana that would really benifit from 16 int, you can add your int to attack for a round, it's pretty nice.

Well first i dont need that much con since we already have 2 other frontliner (Fighter and Barbarian), second ive decided to go with dex and my abilities are as follows:

Str: 13
Dex: 18
Con: 12
Int: 14
Wis: 10
Cha: 10
For feats im going to build into fencing grace since my blackblade is going to be rapier.


Well here's my 2 cents about a Str Magus build.

With a 20 Pt build as an Elf i'd go this without dropping stats.
Str(16) Dex(12+2) Con (13-2) Int (14+2) Wis (10) Cha (10)
No idea at what Lv your starting out, so I'll assume its Lv1.
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A Str Magus wont have to burn a feat for weapon finesse(dex to hit) and a feat for (dex to dmg) -Dervish dance(3 perform included)-
(Note: Also heard somewhere that slashing grace or fencing grace does not work with spell combat but maybe your DM houseruled it.)

Also since your an elf, i assume you haven't known about the Elven Thornblade as a replacement for a rapier. Its a one handed elf martial slashing or piercing weapon as long as your char has weapon familiarity. 1d6 18-20/2x S or P and +2 Atk roll for crit confirms.

Another reason for going Str depends on the campaign, if you were to lose your equipment and left with a wooden club for example, you wont be too helpless.

A Chain Shirt or Leather Lamellar (4 Armor AC) and Shield spell (4 Shield AC) should be good enough starting out. Sure you lose 2 dex ac, 2 reflex and 2 initiative in comparison but that's where your later Debuff spells, Curse spells, Hexes, Buffs like Haste/Blur/Displacement/Mirror Image comes in.

Now about armor penalty.

It affects your fly skill a little bit but not too much, unless your in a severe wind speed area. By Lv6 with Flight Hex, assuming you grab it at Lv6, remember that Fly spell from hex gives you 1/2 Caster lv bonus(+3 fly bonus assuming Lv6), as well as good flight (+4 fly bonus). As long as you have like 15 on fly checks, you wont have to roll doing any flying except 180 degree turn in normal conditions.

Acrobatics, well instead of rushing past enemies if you don't need to move safely and hex them while letting your frontline deal with them. As well as Spellstrike them.

Stealth, I hope your party has a rogue for that, if not then have invisibility-like spells ready.

Escape Artist, one way to escape from a grapple, and if any knowledge check told you about the enemy's saving throws & immunities. Use that supernatural ability hex like Slumber to sleep them, and hopefully evileye'd their saving throws.
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As a hexcrafter magus, i'd recommend a higher int mod for higher dc against your hex and spell effect saves.

Slumber for that Sleep Lv=turns or Evil eye for the 3+IntMod turns of debuff if succeeds. If you want better chances to succeed debuffing, you'd need int. Debuffs can help your allies to change the tide of battle.

Flight is good for early Flying & emergency falling. Healing hex is nice for the extra one heal per person, or the downtime community service of healing others. Misfortune is good if they fail their save.
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Feats

Depending if your the only caster or DM allows crafting, consider craft magic item feats to help the party getting gear at discounted gold.

If your crit heavy, maybe consider the Eldritch Assault feat line. Allows crit to proc on threat once per round as long as you have some sort of concealment against enemy.

Also Kurald Galain has some nice tips on magus here
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As a magus with your archetypes, to be honest, its not wise to jump into the flay off the bat. Remember use shield and/or flight before a fight if possible. Best identify the enemy info with your skill in knowledge and spellcraft first, then consider your options.

Running at a Huge creature without buffs up or debuffs down is near suicidal. Surviving a fight is more important.


First I'll jump in to the STR/DEX argument and say I think the Magus works perfectly well as a STR or DEX based character. Play whichever you prefer. If you have a lot of feats you want then STR is better, if you want to have better skills/initiative then DEX is better (Or go with what suits your character portrait).

I recently played a level 7 Bladebound Magus in a 1-shot and I took PREFERRED SPELL (Shocking Grasp) and heighten spell as my 5th level feats. With Preferred Spell and Spell Recall it basically turned me into a pseudo-spontaneous caster who could learn every spell - it was glorious!

Hexcrafter loses Spell-Recall (but secretly gets it back at level 11), but what you get instead is Hexes - which are amazing!

The way I've always thought of Hexes is that they should either be something that you can't otherwise do, or should be something that you want to do all the time. For example, the Flight Hex. A Magus can fly, but since they want to do it all the time the Flight Hex will save your spell-slots. It's probably the most used hex until level 13 (when you can get Overland Flight). The Flight hex also fulfils my "do something you can't normally do" criteria since it gets you flight 2 levels earlier than a Magus would normally get the spell.
Another Hex I really like for a Magus is the Healing Hex. Magi are fairly limited healers, but the Healing Hex lets you be a backup healer and save the party some resources.
Some people already mentioned Evil Eye. I think this Hex is great for a Hexcrafter for 2 reasons. First, if it lands it'll affect the enemy for the entire combat (which is good coz you probably want to get in there and fight, rather than standing back and hexing). And second, it has an effect even on a failed save. Since hexes are designed around the Witch class they expect you to have a higher INT, which means they're balanced around (probably) having a higher save DC than a Hexcrafter is likely to have. If you're going Evil Eye, I also like the Soothsayer Hex, it's like 1 free round of Cackle when you use Evil Eye - if the enemy fails their save they're still affected by the hex on your next turn when you attack/cast/etc at them.


Decimus Drake wrote:
I don't know where you're getting your info but a magus can wear medium armour at level 7 and heavy armour at level 13 without incurring the normal arcane spell failure chance.

Most characters needs to have their base "surviving" package ready by level 3-4, not more. Not 7, not 13. 3-4.

That's especialy true when you speak of the frontliner's AC and hp which is the very first thing Pathfinder put to trial at low levels.

To give you an exemple, I saw 2 days ago a lvl 6 Invulnerable Barbarian with good AC, some DR, and insane HP get almost shred into pieces in two rounds by a Shambling Mouth.
Your STR magus that can't even wear medium armor at this level 6 would not even have lasted the first round if the shambling mouth targeted it.


MrCharisma wrote:
First I'll jump in to the STR/DEX argument and say I think the Magus works perfectly well as a STR or DEX based character. Play whichever you prefer. If you have a lot of feats you want then STR is better, if you want to have better skills/initiative then DEX is better (Or go with what suits your character portrait).

I'll say it depends who you play with, and what kind of setting you play.

In a hard campaign, with a strict DM, a non-mindblade STR magus can be shred into piece like nothing, believe me, I tried
Now the STR magus isn't bad if the trials aren't the hardcore type, or if you play with a 5 man party featuring another, more tanky, frontliner.

One thing many players on this forum forget is that what kills you in pathfinder are not standard situations... in standard situations, a STR magus is doing truly fine.
What is killing you is "oh s$**" situations, that happens from time to time.

The example I gave above is one of those: the frontliner got ambushed by a Shambling Mouth. Try to imagine what it would mean if the frontliner is your level 6 STR-based magus...

The monster will use the rather low AC (even lower due to being caught flat footed) of the STR magus to land 2 slam attacks of 2d6+5 damage each, when you're unbuffed. Those attacks will trigger his Grab ability, so it will then land a 2d6+7 constrict in addition.
First round, your Magus will have taken 38 average damage and is grappled. His spellcasting abilities are hindered, and the monster is electric immune and fire resistant for 10, killing a few of your best spells... even if you succeed to undo the grapple, he's going to double slam you and constrict you in the next round again.
At level 6, no priest can heal you for 38 damage per turn, either, so you're unable to do serious damage, unable to escape, and unable to be kept alive... all of those because of one thing: your AC is barely average instead of being what a true frontliner AC is supposed to be for a hard CR6 encounter

So, that's why STR magus are "setting dependant".
Once again, a leniant DM, an easy campaign, a tank ally, all of these make a STR magus fine... otherwise, you -need- a DEX magus or a Mindblade magus if you don't want a "oh s~&$" encounter to kill you.


Moonheart wrote:
MrCharisma wrote:
First I'll jump in to the STR/DEX argument and say I think the Magus works perfectly well as a STR or DEX based character. Play whichever you prefer. If you have a lot of feats you want then STR is better, if you want to have better skills/initiative then DEX is better (Or go with what suits your character portrait).
...The monster will use the rather low AC (even lower due to being caught flat footed) of the STR magus to land 2 slam attacks of 2d6+5 damage each, when you're unbuffed...

Wouldn't a Strength-Magus and a Dex-Magus have the same flat-footed AC? That's how flat-footed AC works, you lose your Dex bonus.

Also the next bit about being Grappled. You can make a CMB check to escape a grapple (no escape artist needed). If you're dex based your CMB will likely be lower, and even if you have Agile Maneuvers you still take a -4 penalty to Dex for being grappled.

Long story short: Everything you just described sounds like it would have been easier with a Strength-Magus.

I'm happy for you that you've found a build that you can play and enjoy, but it's 100% not the only viable option - even in highly optimised games.

With all that out of the way, let's get back to answering the OP's question (I will say it's easier to make a Dex-Magus as an elf. Those Stat bonuses just speak for themselves).


I think you are not picturing the situation right.
Remember: our Invulnerable Barbarian got killed by that monster... and he had a ton of STR too.

The problem with monsters with Grab is that they don't f!%%ing care about your escape checks.
Even if you succeed one, you just spent your turn doing this, and the monster re-slam your face at his turn, triggering free grapple checks, and catching you again.

That's exactly what happened to our barbarian: he escaped twice, and he saw that because his AC was too low, he was just wasting his turns in vain: that doesn't even slow down the damage, since the monster don't have to chose between attack and grapple... he's doing both.

What keep a Grab monster in check is high AC. As long you avoid the slams, he's not doing any grapple check... so you just have to escape once and he's not going to catch you back.
And a STR magus have a rather low AC until level 13.


Dex Magus isn't the answer to killer DMs, the answer is a different table ;) You can't win if the DM is determined. Putting that aside, STR magus can still cast cast shield, vanish and mirror image, that really ought to tide you over through difficult fights. It also doesn't have to wait to level 3 to come online.


Moonheart wrote:
That's exactly what happened to our barbarian: he escaped twice, and he saw that because his AC was too low, he was just wasting his turns in vain: that doesn't even slow down the damage, since the monster don't have to chose between attack and grapple... he's doing both.

Sorry, but this sounds more like a tactics problem than a build or encounter problem. Instead of desperately trying to escape, a barbarian should rather do it the barbarian way: Grapple the foe himself, or beat the crap out of it. The former has a solid ~50% chance to succeed (CMB +11? vs. CMD 22), the latter works even with unarmed strikes (1d3+5? is a serious increase to grapple DC).

And it needs a standard action to maintain a grapple - if the creature fails the check, it can't attack during this round. Well, it can do AOO again.

Hence I'd join the "play the STR magus, if you like" choir. Tactics and rule knowledge matter more than build - as it should be.


SheepishEidolon wrote:
Moonheart wrote:
That's exactly what happened to our barbarian: he escaped twice, and he saw that because his AC was too low, he was just wasting his turns in vain: that doesn't even slow down the damage, since the monster don't have to chose between attack and grapple... he's doing both.

Sorry, but this sounds more like a tactics problem than a build or encounter problem. Instead of desperately trying to escape, a barbarian should rather do it the barbarian way: Grapple the foe himself, or beat the crap out of it. The former has a solid ~50% chance to succeed (CMB +11? vs. CMD 22), the latter works even with unarmed strikes (1d3+5? is a serious increase to grapple DC).

And it needs a standard action to maintain a grapple - if the creature fails the check, it can't attack during this round. Well, it can do AOO again.

Hence I'd join the "play the STR magus, if you like" choir. Tactics and rule knowledge matter more than build - as it should be.

Agreed, barbarians are grapple monkeys, not as good as monks but the barbarian could reverse the grapple and tie the monster up with and unbreakable dc due to barbarian stats.


Don't want to be TOO necro about it, but I think it's pretty relevant. The Deep Marshal is actually a fairly decent archetype for a strength Magus who isn't looking to crit-fish, in my opinion. You lose a single point at low levels, two by the time PFS ends. But in exchange, you gain medium armor at level 1 AND the ability by level 3 to boost your caster level by at least 1 as long as you've got an enchanted weapon OR (I assume; that's how I've been interpreting it) using your arcane pool to enhance your weapon. You'll have at LEAST the same AC as a dex Magus.

This assuming you're comfortable figuring out how an Elf became a Deep Marshal.


If it's for PFS, deep marshal is sadly(and inexplicably) not legal.

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