9th level pony animal companion

[PreacherJeremy]

Would a pony get a third hoof attack at 9th level, even though hooves are considered a secondary attack?

[Jakkedin]

PreacherJeremy wrote:

Would a pony get a third hoof attack at 9th level, even though hooves are considered a secondary attack?

Animal Companions only ever get what attacks are listed in their stat block. They never get additional attacks because their BAB goes over 5, 10, 15 etc...

So per their stat block at level 1, a pony gets 2 hoof attacks. Their level 4 improvement lists nothing for their attacks, so they only get 2 hoof attacks.

[PreacherJeremy]

At 9th level, animals that don’t qualify for multiattack get a second attack with their primary weapon at a -5 penalty, in order to qualify for the feat, you have to have 3 or more natural attacks. Ponies only have their two hoof attacks, but hooves are secondary weapons, not primary, so thus the question.

[nicholas storm]

Pretty clear you get a third hoof attack at -5.

[Paladin of Baha-who?]

Creatures with only secondary natural attacks treat their attacks as if they were primary.

[PreacherJeremy]

Thanks for the information!

[blahpers]

nicholas storm wrote:

Pretty clear you get a third hoof attack at -5.

Nope.

[blahpers]

Paladin of Baha-who? wrote:

Creatures with only secondary natural attacks treat their attacks as if they were primary.

Also nope.

Edit: I'm a dummy:

Universal Monster Rules wrote:

If a creature has only one type of attack, but has multiple attacks per round, that attack is treated as a primary attack, regardless of its type.

[nicholas storm]

blahpers wrote:

nicholas storm wrote:

Pretty clear you get a third hoof attack at -5.

Nope.

Multiattack: An animal companion gains Multiattack as

a bonus feat if it has three or more natural attacks and does
not already have that feat. If it does not have the requisite
three or more natural attacks, the animal companion
instead gains a second attack with one of its natural
weapons, albeit at a –5 penalty.

[blahpers]

A "second attack", not an "extra attack" or an "additional attack". It already has a second attack, so nothing is gained here.

[nicholas storm]

I don't know what you are reading. I read it as another attack. It says a second attack with one of its natural weapons.

[LeMoineNoir]

But the text seems contradictory in that it specifies 'one of its natural attacks' get a second attack, which wouldn't be necessary if it only meant one, as it would just say 'with its natural attack'. Plus, why not just say that if it has two attacks, it doesn't get anything, rather than encompassing it with a 'less than three' clause. If this is the case, than the animal can't even take an Archetype that trades Multiattack out, per a ruling from Ultimate Wilderness.

Anyways, the level 9 Pony in the NPC Codex gets three hooves.

Edit: Actually looking it over, a lot of companions seem to be getting extra attacks when they shouldn't. A dinosaur that already had a Bite, two Claws, and two Talons is getting an iterative Bite. It looks like the Horses are the only 3+ attack companions to actually have Multiattack as a bonus feat.

[blahpers]

nicholas storm wrote:

I don't know what you are reading. I read it as another attack. It says a second attack with one of its natural weapons.

Aha, I see how you're reading it. Yeah, you're right and I'm wrong. A second attack with one hoof would mean three hoof attacks total.

/natural weapon rules are . . . something.