Thief character that isent Rogue?


Advice


So, I was pondering and thinking, Our party's rogue is leaving soon, Her storyline is compleated and her player wants to try a fighter, So I was thinking of maybe making a rogueish character for my next character, Someone who can sneak and pick locks and disable traps. But I was curious, Is there any classes that are good for this, That isent the Rogue?


Any class?

If you want to be good at sneak and disabling (mechanical) traps there isn't anything restricting you from doing so with literally every class. You only need to put the appropriate skill points into those tasks.

However, classes with more skill points are better suited to such task. As you're also going to want perception. And probably several other skills as well.


What about magical traps? Those tends to be more dangerous.. (I still remember that mega acid spray trap in the first dungeon that almost TPKd us cus we where new and stupid.. xD)


If you're after trapfinding, then a trapper ranger, urban ranger, slayer, investigator, archaeologist bard, seeker oracle or seeker sorcerer can do that. And probably some more archetypes somewhere. Or a wizard who gets the Aram Zey's Focus spell.


Thanks! I shall look into all of them ^_^


The main feature of rogues that an adventuring party typically looks to them for trapfinding. There are a handful of other classes however, that can also pickup trapfinding.

Alchemist (Crypt Breaker or Trap Breaker or Vault Breaker)
Bard (Detective)
Druid (Nature Fang)
Magus (Spiderhawk)
Ranger (Trapper or Urban Ranger)
Oracle (Seeker)

There's also a few prestige classes that can give you trapfinding. One of which (Brotherhood of the seal) has monks in mind.

So, you could easily take any of those, put ranks into disable device and stealth and pretty much be good to go.


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Slayers and Investigators are quite good at rogue stuffs. And they should be, given they are both hybrids containing rogue class features. Both offer different and interesting options for character development.

The Archaeologist Bard sounds like it would be worth looking at for what you're looking to do.


It's worth noting that Trapfinding only allows you to disable magical traps. You can still find them just fine. Which means you should be able to figure out how it is set off, which would allow you to either go around it or use a wand of mount to summon a mount to set it off. Or, as a worse case scenario you can use dispel magic on it. So while your character might not be able to tackle tackle magical traps all on their own, you really don't need to limit yourself to classes with trapfinding.


Claxon wrote:
It's worth noting that Trapfinding only allows you to disable magical traps. You can still find them just fine. Which means you should be able to figure out how it is set off, which would allow you to either go around it or use a wand of mount to summon a mount to set it off. Or, as a worse case scenario you can use dispel magic on it. So while your character might not be able to tackle tackle magical traps all on their own, you really don't need to limit yourself to classes with trapfinding.

This is about as true as the idea that in combat healing is bad. It really depends on your group. There's all kinds of magical traps that can't be bypassed, dispelled or set off by a summoned something or other.

Trapfinding is just a trait away. If your DM likes traps the way mine does and your DM wants you to succeed playing the character you find most enjoyable, there should be little trouble getting him to let you take the it even though it is a campaign trait and access to it should technically be limited.


Wait...what kind of trap wouldn't be set off by a summoned creature? Summoned creatures have all the same physical qualities of a regular creature. Unless someone basically created a homebrew trap that ignores summoned creatures, I can't think of how it would fail to set it off.


Yep, you can play pretty much any class as a thief and/or trap solver.

Smaller summoned creatures might not set off some weight-triggered traps, but mount would cover nearly all of those. Traps that only trigger on certain kinds of interaction (e.g., explosive runes on page 37 of the wizard's spellbook, or a spring-loaded poison needle in a lock, or any number of other published instances) could still be a problem.


Poison needle would be a regular non-magical trap though, that would be defeated by regular disable device.

Explosive runes is a good example. But then, I don't actually know how one doesn't set it off when you notice it and try to disable it.


Claxon wrote:

Poison needle would be a regular non-magical trap though, that would be defeated by regular disable device.

Explosive runes is a good example. But then, I don't actually know how one doesn't set it off when you notice it and try to disable it.

Maybe explosive runes smell funny. : )


Summon natures ally I and have the mite open chests/doors/etc and read scrolls for you.


I'm a fan of the 3pp Time Thief. It's rogue, as modeled after Prince of Persia.


So, the only real big key that you get as an actual rogue that other classes don't get is the ability to find and disable magical traps without Dispel Magic. But this can be solved with [urlhttp://www.d20pfsrd.com/traits/campaign-traits/mummy-s-mask/trap-finder/]the Trap Finder trait[/url], if your GM is a little generous with traits. This trait is actually fairly broken for a skill trap, since it gives you a class feature, makes a skill a class skill, AND gives you a +1 to it, so you should definitely talk to your GM about it.

Beyond that, ANY class can be a decent thief, if you give them stealth abilities and a reasonable dex. My Kitsune Oracle doubles as our trapper because of that trait. Being able to cast Detect Magic on a constant basis is pretty nice, too. Our actual 'rogue' is actually a grappler (levels of Monk and Brawler, plus some levels of a prestige class), and just HAPPENS to have more levels rogue than anything else.


Merellin wrote:
So, I was pondering and thinking, Our party's rogue is leaving soon, Her storyline is compleated and her player wants to try a fighter, So I was thinking of maybe making a rogueish character for my next character, Someone who can sneak and pick locks and disable traps. But I was curious, Is there any classes that are good for this, That isent the Rogue?

I had fun playing this role as a bladebound kensai.

You just need to use a few traits for the extra class skills and trapfinding.


What magical trap can't be snuffed out by dispel magic?

Adding to the point that anyone can deal with traps and such, I have a cleric who took an archetype that gives 4+int skill ranks and invested in int. He is my "rogue" character and has most of the traditional rogue skills. His domain even gives him invisibility, nondetection, and some other spells rogues love to have! In combat he summons.


Rogue 1/Wizard 3/Arcane Trickster X (take Accomplished Sneak Attacker at level 3) only has one level of Rogue (that can be replaced by Vaultbreaker Vivisectionist Alchemist).


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Gummy Bear wrote:

What magical trap can't be snuffed out by dispel magic?

The one you encounter at a level too low to cast that spell.

The one you encounter when you've already cast the one dispel magic you prepared that day to stop the dominated barbarian from killing you.

The one you encounter with a high caster level and you can't seem to roll high enough on your caster level check.

Etc.


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Also some magic traps may very well be automatically resetting, so at best a dispel magic merely suppresses it for a couple rounds. Hope you don't have to run back through that spot later.


It was already mentioned, but Slayer is phenomenal at this.

At level 2 take the Trapfinding slayer talent. At level 4 take the Rogue talent Trap spotter. You are pretty much good to go after that. To make it better, they are a 6+Int skill point class so you have the extra to put into disable device, sleight of hand, and/or UMD if you want to go that route.

Icing on the cake is that this is only 2 slayer talents out of 10, and combined with the 10 feats you get leveling up, you have a ton of room for customization made all the better by the ability to take Ranger Combat Style Feats as Slayer talents.

Some may wonder why I suggested putting points into diable device when you already get such a nice bonus from tripfinder, but the way I see it, is if you put a point in each round up to 4 when you are good to go, then you offset the armor check penalty of almost all medium armors, and even a masterwork chainmail set. That means combined with the Ranger combat style, your studied target bonuses, and full BaB progression you will be a very viable damage dealer as well.


The Slayer does sound awesome! I have one class I absolutely love in Pathfinder (Alchemist. Cant go wrong with Alchemist, Love the class) But there is so many others I realy want to try too!


What level is this character going to be?


Another class I didn't see mentioned is the Kineticist. Take the aether element and you can pick pocket and disable traps from a distance and (eventually) turn invisible at will and fly.


Well, It would be after my current character, Like if I die, And we are level 9 right now, So level 10 or above most likely. Not sure what level it would be since my current character is still alive.


pocsaclypse wrote:

Another class I didn't see mentioned is the Kineticist. Take the aether element and you can pick pocket and disable traps from a distance and (eventually) turn invisible at will and fly.

Second this. I was a Gnome Aether Kineticist (expanded into Air) for a little while, and I envied no thief.

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