I believe the metaphysical idea is, once you've been judged by Pharasma there's no returning. That's why spells have a time limit based on power, but you end up with not being able to go beyond like 200 years. Pharasma has a long waiting line, but once you're judged you're done.
I remember Pharasma intentionally putting off those who weren't done with life? She is the goddess of fate/prophecy, after all. Basically, if she sees you being resurrected, you're not going anywhere (barring after-death circumstances that might send you directly to a lower plane, do not pass the boneyard, do not collect 200 gp)
A person that became an outsider, you mean like a 20th monk? or do you have some other thing in mind?
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
It doesn't work. The sixth volume of the Mummy's Mask AP has the details on life after death.
1. Death
2. Passage to the Boneyard
3. Waiting for judgment
4. Judgment
5. Go to destination plane as a petitioner, do not collect $200
6. Hang out for some time not to exceed eternity
7. Either merge with the plane, turn into an outsider, or the multiverse ends, whichever comes first
Once step 4 occurs you can't be raised. If Pharasma senses that it is your destiny (i.e. GM fiat/plot) to be raised, she'll delay judging you rather than rush it and artificially cut you off.
Thanks, Xenocrat! I was going to read through that article again to find those details for my game. I'm glad I checked here first.
I was really hoping you were talking about resurrecting a friend whom unwillingly got turned into a an Outsider when they were still alive, like back when a Kaorti latched on to you.
Of course, sometimes souls get shunted past Pharasma's judgment altogether (for instance, failed a Save against Malediction). The spell text itself does give instructions about getting past it -- conceivably, some much more powerful magic might be able to counteract or bypass whatever happens to prevent Resurrection of a soul judged by Pharasma. Malediction is 4th level on various lists, and requires one of the following means to get past it:
- Life restoration by someone of the same alignment as the caster of Malediction -- conceivably someone who had ties to Pharasma could mimic this in the case of a judged soul, but they would also have to have ties to wherever the judged soul went, which would be a tall order, unless the judged soul was also tied to Pharasma.
- Beating an opposed Caster Level Check -- conceivably, boosting the caster level high enough for the Resurrection might do the job, but considering what you're up against, it seems that if you cranked out enough raw power to do the job, the result might go along the path of least resistance and do something like call in the Outsider that the soul turned into instead of doing the kind of Resurrection you were trying to get.
- Wish or Miracle -- these get the job done with no ifs, ands, or buts, but they are 9th level spells going up against a 4th level spell (Malediction is 4th level on every list where it appears at all). So by analogy, since you are trying to beat something that is at least the equivalent of a 9th level spell, you would need something like a 20th or 21st level spell to do the job with no ifs, ands, or buts (this means that you would need a Super-Epic spellcaster, on the order of 39th or 41st level if using the logical extension of 9/9 spellcasting progression. If you could get that much power, you would be effectively at least quasi-divine.
if they are currently living as an outsider then no you cant, however if they as the outsider are dead then yes with the right spell you can rez them
I assume you mean Miracle? (Or possibly Wish, depending on how long the mortal has been dead.)
If the soul has been transformed into an outsider, they are no longer the being they once were. That being does not exist in any capacity. You could resurrect the outsider, but not the human they formerly were.
I don't know if it's specific to the iathavos, but there are listed ways to resurrect the human body that was transformed into a nyogoth qlippoth. Which is an Outsider. It might be specific to that monster, though.
It's difficult to reconcile true resurrection with the whole Pharasma's judgment thing without some serious wibbly-wobby timey-wimey stuff. The spell's vastly increased legal time range doesn't seem very useful if most souls are sent on to their final reward well before the range of regular resurrection expires. It smells a lot like a plot bandage to prevent players from resurrecting important dead NPCs and derailing adventure paths.
I just let it work--if you true resurrection a creature, then they haven't been judged yet. What's a causality reversal among friends?
Edit: For some reason I was under the impression that true resurrection had a better time range than resurrection, but turns out they're both 10 years per caster level. The rest of my post still stands, though--it's an artificial way to say "nuh-uh!" to a spell's stated ability. It feels clumsy to design a spell one way and have the default campaign immediately limit it.
The subject's soul must be free and willing to return. If they have been judged and the soul has become a new being, I would not count that as free and willing to return.
^Conceivably, a soul could have been judged and become a new being, but want its old life back. Not highly likely due to most souls losing their memories, but on rare occasions souls manage to keep their memories all the way through becoming an Outsider. Normally I would say if you've managed to do all that, keep it and run with it (unless you're sure you can repeat it the next time you go to the afterlife), but I could see certain circumstnaces in which a soul might decide that its life as an Outsider is definitely worse than what it had before.
Re: the time span
Remember, Pharasma knows basically everything. She knows exactly when every creature in the multiverse will be born, die, be raised from the dead, and die again. I can totally imagine a waiting room in the Boneyard filled with people waiting to be Raised.
And, of course, the one really lonely, really bored Azlanti guy whose fate it is to be raised from the dead in Starfinder time by a Deathstar Coven.
Arguably she didn't know that Aroden would die. But that's some special circumstance stuff. For mortals she probably knows it all.
Over in homebrew I have a topic, Land of the Dead.
Thoes who expect to be raised or something are prepetitioners.
They might take levels as a reaper, or other spirit classes.
If they do become an outsider, a squatter might step in when the body is raised.