why alignment (for characters) needs to go


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Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Planpanther wrote:
Steelfiredragon wrote:
Planpanther wrote:
MuddyVolcano wrote:


How about we just remove Law and Chaos?

No thanks. I love taking on maruts and devils and stuff. I need lawful and chaotic bamfs to do it.

umm think that might just have been for pcs....

though could be wrong there....

but I'm totally on board for removing the lawful and chaotic axis for player characters

Still no thanks. I want my PC to be laying down the law or delivering discord to their foes!

Which you can do without alignment? I mean most RPGs don't have an alignment system. I can still play an order loving Ventrue or chaos ridden Malkavian in Vampire and that doesn't have alignment. In the Malifaux RPG you can play a lawman without an alignment system. Etc. Alignment really isn't required for any roleplaying choices.


Malk_Content wrote:
Planpanther wrote:
Steelfiredragon wrote:
Planpanther wrote:
MuddyVolcano wrote:


How about we just remove Law and Chaos?

No thanks. I love taking on maruts and devils and stuff. I need lawful and chaotic bamfs to do it.

umm think that might just have been for pcs....

though could be wrong there....

but I'm totally on board for removing the lawful and chaotic axis for player characters

Still no thanks. I want my PC to be laying down the law or delivering discord to their foes!
Which you can do without alignment? I mean most RPGs don't have an alignment system. I can still play an order loving Ventrue or chaos ridden Malkavian in Vampire and that doesn't have alignment. In the Malifaux RPG you can play a lawman without an alignment system. Etc. Alignment really isn't required for any roleplaying choices.

Required? No. Interesting and unique item not every RPG has. Yes.


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Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

Not even sure what you are saying there. You used "I want my PC to be laying down the law or delivering discord to their foes!" as a counterpoint against removing Law/Chaos. Saying the mechanic isn't required doesn't go against my point at all.


Malk_Content wrote:
Planpanther wrote:
Steelfiredragon wrote:
Planpanther wrote:
MuddyVolcano wrote:


How about we just remove Law and Chaos?

No thanks. I love taking on maruts and devils and stuff. I need lawful and chaotic bamfs to do it.

umm think that might just have been for pcs....

though could be wrong there....

but I'm totally on board for removing the lawful and chaotic axis for player characters

Still no thanks. I want my PC to be laying down the law or delivering discord to their foes!
Which you can do without alignment? I mean most RPGs don't have an alignment system. I can still play an order loving Ventrue or chaos ridden Malkavian in Vampire and that doesn't have alignment. In the Malifaux RPG you can play a lawman without an alignment system. Etc. Alignment really isn't required for any roleplaying choices.

Then Go play one of those.

And if you think V:TM didn't have alignment then you never played with Humanity properly.


Malk_Content wrote:
Not even sure what you are saying there. You used "I want my PC to be laying down the law or delivering discord to their foes!" as a counterpoint against removing Law/Chaos. Saying the mechanic isn't required doesn't go against my point at all.

Your point has no value. You can make it against anything. Classes, the D20, Ancestries, etc. None of them are required in any number of RPGs.


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Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Planpanther wrote:
Malk_Content wrote:
Not even sure what you are saying there. You used "I want my PC to be laying down the law or delivering discord to their foes!" as a counterpoint against removing Law/Chaos. Saying the mechanic isn't required doesn't go against my point at all.
Your point has no value. You can make it against anything. Classes, the D20, Ancestries, etc. None of them are required in any number of RPGs.

No it isn't. For Classes, the dice, ancestries etc you need some rule or mechanic to replace it. Removing alignment has no effect on roleplaying whatsoever.


Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
KujakuDM wrote:
Malk_Content wrote:
Planpanther wrote:
Steelfiredragon wrote:
Planpanther wrote:
MuddyVolcano wrote:


How about we just remove Law and Chaos?

No thanks. I love taking on maruts and devils and stuff. I need lawful and chaotic bamfs to do it.

umm think that might just have been for pcs....

though could be wrong there....

but I'm totally on board for removing the lawful and chaotic axis for player characters

Still no thanks. I want my PC to be laying down the law or delivering discord to their foes!
Which you can do without alignment? I mean most RPGs don't have an alignment system. I can still play an order loving Ventrue or chaos ridden Malkavian in Vampire and that doesn't have alignment. In the Malifaux RPG you can play a lawman without an alignment system. Etc. Alignment really isn't required for any roleplaying choices.

Then Go play one of those.

And if you think V:TM didn't have alignment then you never played with Humanity properly.

I do play some of them sometime. Whats your point? Doesn't change the fact that alignment is entirely unnecessary to represent a specific character.

Humanity isn't alignment in the DnD/Pathfinder sense. A character can have 3 Humanity and still not be evil. A character can have 8 Humanity and still be what we would consider evil. The ability to choose other paths is even more wibbly, actually being closer to a selection of anathemas for a philosophy.


Malk_Content wrote:
Planpanther wrote:
Malk_Content wrote:
Not even sure what you are saying there. You used "I want my PC to be laying down the law or delivering discord to their foes!" as a counterpoint against removing Law/Chaos. Saying the mechanic isn't required doesn't go against my point at all.
Your point has no value. You can make it against anything. Classes, the D20, Ancestries, etc. None of them are required in any number of RPGs.
No it isn't. For Classes, the dice, ancestries etc you need some rule or mechanic to replace it. Removing alignment has no effect on roleplaying whatsoever.

On RP it has no effect, but on the mechanics it does.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Planpanther wrote:
Malk_Content wrote:
Planpanther wrote:
Malk_Content wrote:
Not even sure what you are saying there. You used "I want my PC to be laying down the law or delivering discord to their foes!" as a counterpoint against removing Law/Chaos. Saying the mechanic isn't required doesn't go against my point at all.
Your point has no value. You can make it against anything. Classes, the D20, Ancestries, etc. None of them are required in any number of RPGs.
No it isn't. For Classes, the dice, ancestries etc you need some rule or mechanic to replace it. Removing alignment has no effect on roleplaying whatsoever.
On RP it has no effect, but on the mechanics it does.

True. Which is a separate point of debate entirely.


Alignment isn't needed to role play a character. Humanity isn't needed either, lots of games don't have it (every game but Vampire)

However, that's the wrong question. The thing is the game is possible to play without alignment, or humanity, but if alignment (or humanity) adds something to the game itself, in the game style that game try to promote.

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