Favorite weapon enchantment combinations?


Advice

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I'm curious as to how people prefer their weapons.

Do you use a formula you follow for effect, or strictly adjust to the campaign?

Do you always pick every hit type bonuses, or something making critical hits extra potent?

Do you use or trust enchantments that utilize saving throw effects even though the save DC is usually pretty low?

I know a lot of them are actually class specific, or might as well be... Courageous for Bards, Cunning for Inquisitors, Furious for Barbarians, there's some Swashbuckler types as well... Class specific combinations are welcome and valid answers for the purposes of this thread.

My example of a formula/combination, based on a polearm build using shield brace, bashing finish, and spiked destroyer...

Elven Branch Spear:
Fortuitous, keen, ominous, vampiric
Heavy Shield:
Bashing, cruel, corrosive
Armor spikes:
Keen, cruel, corrosive, ominous

Since critical hits trigger bashing finish, you put ominous on the spear, making them shaken if they fail a DC 13 will save. The critical gives you a shield bash, and the shield has cruel on it, making anyone that is already shaken sickened, as well. The vampiric spear gives you HP on the first hit, the cruel shield and cruel armor spikes both will give you temporary HP if they deliver a killing blow. Since you automatically get armor spike attack with the shield bash, so if the shield doesn't kill them, the spikes just might. Ominous and keen on the spikes just in case they score a critical hit, triggering another DC 13 will save and another the shield bash.


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Unless you're waving a keen scimitar around I'm not a fan of critical hit effects. I mean, with the elven branched spear combo you need

1) an enemy of large size or larger which you're in position to hit with both 5' and 10' range weapons
2) to roll a 19 or 20 when attacking with the spear
3) to hit with the confirmation roll
4) to hit with the shield bash attack
5) to hit with the armor spikes.

Assuming you've got a 60% chance of hitting then I make that a 2.16% chance per attack where you're set up correctly, assuming no miss chance. Also you need two +5 equivalent weapons and a +4 equivalent, 132 000 gp worth (or more with a >+1 enhancement bonus). When you can pay that much DC 13 Will saves are nothing to your enemies.

OK, enough negativity. While straight enhancement bonus is pretty good, on a bow I might want seeking and conductive. If you do hit an invisible enemy then the conductive effect can make it plain to your allies where you were aiming, more believably so than yelling '10' east and 15' south of you!'

Cruel and bewildering is a decent combo on a melee weapon. Bewildering has one of the better save DCs on a magic weapon effect, and making the enemy shaken and sickened beforehand helps further.


Holy Falcata of the Stormlord: Falcata(+1 to +5) with Holy, Shocking Burst, and Thundering.
Just a theme build, but rather potent.


I love Thundering. One of my favorites. Especially on a scimitar with that trait for +2 fire damage on a critical hit with a scimitar. Clean fun.


strait plusses


impact if the base weapon has a good enough damage die, furious if i have rage, bane if the character likes hunting one type of creature all others are kinda meh and i would rather just get a +10 weapon if i don't plan on using any of those 3 which with out some super custom item cant happen unfortunately

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

I could go for a quiver of spellstoring arrows, get those and a wand of faerie fire, you're pretty much set for life on invisible enemies.


Ominous is rather unhelpful - DC 13 and much easier ways to handle giving Shaken out to a single target. Vampiric has too low a daily limit and too little return in combat for me - I'd rather end the combat a little faster and take a round to CLW. Cruel is great for the no-save sickened and the THP; Keen is great for anything that's 19-20 or 18-20 already. I also like Menacing if you have a way to get consistent flanking, and Called and Glamered are personal favorites even if they aren't the most offensively optimum.


Adaptive on a composite bow is a no-brainer. I like ghost touch on melee weapons. Other than that, I like straight bonuses unless there is a character driven reason to have some other kind of enchantment.

Grand Lodge

For me there are only a few options.

+1's they help with accuracy damage and dr.

Furious like +1 but better.

Holy has its place.

Furybourn this is bad for pcs, it is bad on regular weapons it is ok on animal companion's amulet becuase is cheaper than a +5 but can get you there when Dr is an issue. Especially with pounce. If you have greater magic fang it acts as a back up plan.


Fortuitous totally works well with reach weapons. Otherwise straight bonuses are usually better.


I'll be honest, I've only played up to level 8 in this game system as a player, and then mostly as spell casters. I've got 1 level 7 Halfling warpriest/hunter PC in the Rein of Winter AP at the moment. We've never really gotten the chance to throw a lot of enhancements on our weapons and plus with Swift Action/Divine Aid or Sacred Weapon bonuses, I haven't really needed them.

As a default on NPC villains that actually wield magic weapons with enchantments, I usually just add Flaming.


I love me some enhancements, but from a practical standpoint "+" is usuall the best. I imagine New 'n' Pathy! will actually be better in this respect since they appear to be going with something like automatic bonus progression instead of constantly getting magic items with higher numbers. Once "+" is out of the picture, other stuff becomes far more interesting.


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Furious + Dueling Weapon. Even better if you have a flexible Bane. Better still if you have Channel Energy uses to power Greyflame.

+5 Furious Bane Greyflame = potential +10 weapon. With dueling added, you can add a +20 luck bonus to CMB checks for any maneuver that uses the weapon.

In a game where third party materials were allowed, I made a Worldsoul Incarnate Barbarian who is building up to a Furious Greyflame Linked Striking Dueling weapon. Won't be able to buy it till level 15 though (currently level 12).

Anyone know if it's legal to add enhancement bonuses for gauntlets/unarmed strikes to grapple checks?


Intimidation focused Inquisitor with a Cruel Bardiche; simple as that. Had two levels of Viking Fighter for Move Action Demoralize checks.

Move Action: Demoralize (huge Intimidate bonus; almost never failed).
[Opponent Shaken, -2 to saves/hit/etc.]
Swift Action: Attack from Hurtful
[Cruel Weapon triggers, adding Sickened for another -2 to saves/hit]
5' Step out of range
Standard Action: Debuff/SoS spell (Inflict Pain, Terrible Remorse, Hold Monster, etc.)
Enemy saves at -4

All in one turn, inflicted a debuff effect, made an attack, and cast a spell. The Cruel enchantment just makes the effect much stronger with a very minor investment.

Grand Lodge

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As a Pyrokineticist, I am going to get a +1 light crossbow with Bane Outsider (Evil) to take care of the majority of the critters I will run into with SR. I will also take in +1 Frost ammo to hurt critters that are immune to fire. You know, the ones that are usually vulnerable to cold?


Egil Firehair wrote:
As a Pyrokineticist, I am going to get a +1 light crossbow with Bane Outsider (Evil) to take care of the majority of the critters I will run into with SR. I will also take in +1 Frost ammo to hurt critters that are immune to fire. You know, the ones that are usually vulnerable to cold?

If they have the fire subtype you can just use draining infusion, right? If they don't they're probably not vulnerable to cold


I'm a big fan of the Driving enchant on a bow. Best paired with armor that has the Malevolent enchant to even out the bonus an enemy would get from being prone vs your ranged attacks.


CupcakeNautilus wrote:
I'm a big fan of the Driving enchant on a bow. Best paired with armor that has the Malevolent enchant to even out the bonus an enemy would get from being prone vs your ranged attacks.

Legit.


Since I'm a fan of Aoo reach build I like the idea of that +1 ability that grants a extra Aoo for the same triggering effect once per round on a whip build


Fortuitous, sir. On an Elven Branched Spear. High Guardian Fighter gets combat reflexes WITH STRENGTH MODIFIER at level 2.


VoodistMonk wrote:
Fortuitous, sir. On an Elven Branched Spear. High Guardian Fighter gets combat reflexes WITH STRENGTH MODIFIER at level 2.

or just take 3 levels of unchained rogue for 1.5x dex mod to dmg

Silver Crusade

Well this is a rather disgusting combo but on a melee hunter at lvl 7 riding his anicomp with broken wing gambit and paired opportunitiest. The menacing enchantment on the rider and fortuitous on the animal is glorious. At to hit rolls a bonus above 20 the - 5 doest matter


Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

For bows, adaptive is expensive early on, but is definitely worth looking at higher levels.

Bane can be worth it if a specific type of enemy shows up often or there is a central theme to the campaign (such as giants in Giantslayer or evil outsiders in Wrath of the Righteous).

Conductive can be useful, but only for certain characters.

Courageous can be useful at higher "plusses" for barbarians or other characters with rage (rage increases to Str and Con are morale bonuses).

Cunning might be worth looking at for a critical-focused character with a good number of skills (such as a ranger or slayer).

Defending might be useful for a "tank" character that wants to boost AC; possibly in a body wrap of mighty strikes for a character with a single natural attack.

Any ranged weapon will find distance useful.

Furious for a barbarian or other character with rage is pretty obvious.

Ghost touch may be useful if there are a lot of incorporeal foes; although the spell ghostbane dirge is probably more efficient.

Grayflame is probably worth looking at for a character with Channel Energy; especially if they have the Versatile Channeler feat.

For a "typical" (i.e., traditional) campaign (many evil foes), holy is one of the more cost effective weapon special abilities.

Depending on the character and weapon, impact may be worth a look; i.e., a titan fighter 1/mountain druid with the Plant/Growth domain using a Large scythe (increases to Huge with enlarge person, righteous might, or using wild shape to turn into a Large giant; effective size for damage becomes Gargantuan with impact); or a titan mauler barbarian two-weapon fighting with a pair of courageous furious impact nodachi.

Keen is probably worth it for feat-starved critical-focused characters.

Ki focus might be worth looking at for monks (or other characters that get ki attacks) not taking the Ascetic Style feats.

Seeking is another ability useful for most ranged weapons.

Spell storing is most useful to spellcasters, but can also be useful for other characters with friendly casters willing to cast spells into it (possibly a cohort).

Thundering, because it does sonic damage and the chance of deafening a foe, might be useful to help "round out" a weapon (after getting it to +4/+5) at higher levels for a critical-focused character.


Lady-J wrote:
VoodistMonk wrote:
Fortuitous, sir. On an Elven Branched Spear. High Guardian Fighter gets combat reflexes WITH STRENGTH MODIFIER at level 2.
or just take 3 levels of unchained rogue for 1.5x dex mod to dmg

But then you have to take 3 levels in rogue, when you could just use strength and get 1.5 strength to damage anyways because it's a 2H weapon. And 2 levels of High Guardian Fighter gives you the Combat Reflexes feat, and allows strength mod for AoO. And you don't have to be a rogue.


VoodistMonk wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
VoodistMonk wrote:
Fortuitous, sir. On an Elven Branched Spear. High Guardian Fighter gets combat reflexes WITH STRENGTH MODIFIER at level 2.
or just take 3 levels of unchained rogue for 1.5x dex mod to dmg
But then you have to take 3 levels in rogue, when you could just use strength and get 1.5 strength to damage anyways because it's a 2H weapon. And 2 levels of High Guardian Fighter gives you the Combat Reflexes feat, and allows strength mod for AoO. And you don't have to be a rogue.

and those 3 levels in rogue gets you a lot more than the 2 levels of fighter that 1 is a terrible archetype and 2 locks me out of tanking any other fighter archetype.


Lady-J wrote:
VoodistMonk wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
VoodistMonk wrote:
Fortuitous, sir. On an Elven Branched Spear. High Guardian Fighter gets combat reflexes WITH STRENGTH MODIFIER at level 2.
or just take 3 levels of unchained rogue for 1.5x dex mod to dmg
But then you have to take 3 levels in rogue, when you could just use strength and get 1.5 strength to damage anyways because it's a 2H weapon. And 2 levels of High Guardian Fighter gives you the Combat Reflexes feat, and allows strength mod for AoO. And you don't have to be a rogue.
and those 3 levels in rogue gets you a lot more than the 2 levels of fighter that 1 is a terrible archetype and 2 locks me out of tanking any other fighter archetype.

I don't disagree with you that the High Guardian archetype sucks. But it's only two full BAB levels instead of having to taint your character with 3 or any levels in rogue. If you want to have multiple AoO but don't want to be based in dex, it's an option.


VoodistMonk wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
VoodistMonk wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
VoodistMonk wrote:
Fortuitous, sir. On an Elven Branched Spear. High Guardian Fighter gets combat reflexes WITH STRENGTH MODIFIER at level 2.
or just take 3 levels of unchained rogue for 1.5x dex mod to dmg
But then you have to take 3 levels in rogue, when you could just use strength and get 1.5 strength to damage anyways because it's a 2H weapon. And 2 levels of High Guardian Fighter gives you the Combat Reflexes feat, and allows strength mod for AoO. And you don't have to be a rogue.
and those 3 levels in rogue gets you a lot more than the 2 levels of fighter that 1 is a terrible archetype and 2 locks me out of tanking any other fighter archetype.
I don't disagree with you that the High Guardian archetype sucks. But it's only two full BAB levels instead of having to taint your character with 3 or any levels in rogue. If you want to have multiple AoO but don't want to be based in dex, it's an option.

two full bab, levels that only give like 8 skills and 2+int skill points per level, and if they want another fighter archetype they cant stack the two but they can go rogue which yes they lose a bab point but gain 8 skill points per level and get like 20+ different skills and free dex to hit and damage


Lady-J wrote:
VoodistMonk wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
VoodistMonk wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
VoodistMonk wrote:
Fortuitous, sir. On an Elven Branched Spear. High Guardian Fighter gets combat reflexes WITH STRENGTH MODIFIER at level 2.
or just take 3 levels of unchained rogue for 1.5x dex mod to dmg
But then you have to take 3 levels in rogue, when you could just use strength and get 1.5 strength to damage anyways because it's a 2H weapon. And 2 levels of High Guardian Fighter gives you the Combat Reflexes feat, and allows strength mod for AoO. And you don't have to be a rogue.
and those 3 levels in rogue gets you a lot more than the 2 levels of fighter that 1 is a terrible archetype and 2 locks me out of tanking any other fighter archetype.
I don't disagree with you that the High Guardian archetype sucks. But it's only two full BAB levels instead of having to taint your character with 3 or any levels in rogue. If you want to have multiple AoO but don't want to be based in dex, it's an option.
two full bab, levels that only give like 8 skills and 2+int skill points per level, and if they want another fighter archetype they cant stack the two but they can go rogue which yes they lose a bab point but gain 8 skill points per level and get like 20+ different skills and free dex to hit and damage

Before we derail this thread any more, please just know that I come from a history of being the big dumb fighter and EVERY interaction with rogues, both in and out of my party, have been substantially underwhelming. I literally have no respect for rogues and do not ever advise dipping rogue or pursuing the path of a rogue unless it is specifically what you are looking for or pertains to the exact thing you want out of your character. If I know about an alternative to anything rogue, I will always mention the alternative.

Now... back to the scheduled program...

Enchantments!


VoodistMonk wrote:
Fortuitous, sir. On an Elven Branched Spear. High Guardian Fighter gets combat reflexes WITH STRENGTH MODIFIER at level 2.

The whole point of that spear is that it's a finessable reach-weapon. But if you're going to short-shrift your Dex because you no longer need it (due to High Guardian granting Combat Reflexes based off Str), then you might as well carry a much better polearm with a high-threat range and a larger base die.


Favorite: Furious/Fortuitous/Leveraging/Dueling fauchard.

(Theoretical, of course, because I never play high enough to get all that crap installed.)


You can have a lot of fun combining the Training Special Ability with other Special Abilities.

Training (Cleave) on a Mighty Cleaving Weapon.

Training (Enforcer) on a Merciful Weapon.

Training (Combat Reflexes) on a Fortuitous Weapon.


Why do multiple folks endorse courageous weapons? Are bonuses against fear considered that valuable?


Java Man wrote:
Why do multiple folks endorse courageous weapons? Are bonuses against fear considered that valuable?

No, but it also buffs any moral bonus from any other source by half the weapon enchantment... such as a barbarians moral bonus to strength when they rage... The value of this enchantment depends on who wields the weapon.

Sure it's not as universally awesome like Thundering (!!!especially if you have Blinding Critical!!!), but Courageous has its place.


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Only... sadly.. it doesn't. FAQd and responded. Just to fear.


Cavall wrote:
Only... sadly.. it doesn't. FAQd and responded. Just to fear.

How lame. It is as if the powers that be are intentionally making it impossible to be effective as a melee fighter.

So what if it makes one specific class's bonuses higher? Oh no, the barbarian who is paying for custom magical weapons just went from a +4 while raging to a +5. It doesn't make him fly or his enemies turn on one another and kill their friends. His role doesn't change and the bonus doesn't break the game because he is just a melee fighter.

But of course they nerf it. Java Man is right. It's a worthless and sad enchantment to waste your money on.


VoodistMonk wrote:
Cavall wrote:
Only... sadly.. it doesn't. FAQd and responded. Just to fear.

How lame. It is as if the powers that be are intentionally making it impossible to be effective as a melee fighter.

So what if it makes one specific class's bonuses higher? Oh no, the barbarian who is paying for custom magical weapons just went from a +4 while raging to a +5. It doesn't make him fly or his enemies turn on one another and kill their friends. His role doesn't change and the bonus doesn't break the game because he is just a melee fighter.

But of course they nerf it. Java Man is right. It's a worthless and sad enchantment to waste your money on.

only lame if your group runs with all eratad content, doesn't matter much if you group runs with the rule of if paizo nerfed it we use the un nerfed vertion


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At THIS table, WE take the training wheels OFF!


The thing is it wasn't really nerfed, it was a clarification. There were 2 camps and Paizo went with one of them. I was in the other camp but I still can't call it a nerf, really


a Skald with furious and bloodsong


Cavall wrote:

The thing is it wasn't really nerfed, it was a clarification. There were 2 camps and Paizo went with one of them. I was in the other camp but I still can't call it a nerf, really

anything that lowers the power of an option is by definition a nerf


Lady-J wrote:
Cavall wrote:

The thing is it wasn't really nerfed, it was a clarification. There were 2 camps and Paizo went with one of them. I was in the other camp but I still can't call it a nerf, really

anything that lowers the power of an option is by definition a nerf

A nerf lowers the power of an option for game balance reasons. A poorly written option that gets clarified in an FAQ isn't a nerf, imo.

Personally though, I think it's a fair option to have it affect all morale bonuses, as a morale bonus vs fear alone is a poor option comparatively to the other enchantments one might get.


Ryze Kuja wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
Cavall wrote:

The thing is it wasn't really nerfed, it was a clarification. There were 2 camps and Paizo went with one of them. I was in the other camp but I still can't call it a nerf, really

anything that lowers the power of an option is by definition a nerf

A nerf lowers the power of an option for game balance reasons. A poorly written option that gets clarified in an FAQ isn't a nerf, imo.

Personally though, I think it's a fair option to have it affect all morale bonuses, as a morale bonus vs fear alone is a poor option comparatively to the other enchantments one might get.

nerf isn't a balancing term it simply means making a thing less powerful, the"clarification" made the option less powerful and there for it was a nerf


That's not a nerf to tell people what it was the whole time and it was being misread. That's not the definition of nerf


Lady-J wrote:
Ryze Kuja wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
Cavall wrote:

The thing is it wasn't really nerfed, it was a clarification. There were 2 camps and Paizo went with one of them. I was in the other camp but I still can't call it a nerf, really

anything that lowers the power of an option is by definition a nerf

A nerf lowers the power of an option for game balance reasons. A poorly written option that gets clarified in an FAQ isn't a nerf, imo.

Personally though, I think it's a fair option to have it affect all morale bonuses, as a morale bonus vs fear alone is a poor option comparatively to the other enchantments one might get.

nerf isn't a balancing term it simply means making a thing less powerful, the"clarification" made the option less powerful and there for it was a nerf

The original intent of a given option was x, but due to a poorly written description of x, it could be interpreted as x and y. X was clearly misinterpreted due to the poorly written description, therefore the incorrect y assumption was clarified to not exist. Also therefore, y never existed.

This is not a nerf, but rather a clarification of a misinterpreted RAW per original intent.

If x was created and x was deemed too powerful as to create an unfair advantage, x becomes changed to y (where y is an equal but different, or actual lesser version of x), and y is now a changed option FROM x, and x no longer exists.

That is a nerf.

A nerf is a change to the game for balance reasons. You cannot nerf some option that never existed. The only thing you can do, without changing the mechanism, is to clarify how the mechanism ACTUALLY works.


Ryze Kuja wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
Ryze Kuja wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
Cavall wrote:

The thing is it wasn't really nerfed, it was a clarification. There were 2 camps and Paizo went with one of them. I was in the other camp but I still can't call it a nerf, really

anything that lowers the power of an option is by definition a nerf

A nerf lowers the power of an option for game balance reasons. A poorly written option that gets clarified in an FAQ isn't a nerf, imo.

Personally though, I think it's a fair option to have it affect all morale bonuses, as a morale bonus vs fear alone is a poor option comparatively to the other enchantments one might get.

nerf isn't a balancing term it simply means making a thing less powerful, the"clarification" made the option less powerful and there for it was a nerf

The original intent of a given option was x, but due to a poorly written description of x, it could be interpreted as x and y. X was clearly misinterpreted due to the poorly written description, therefore the incorrect y assumption was clarified to not exist. Also therefore, y never existed.

This is not a nerf, but rather a clarification of a misinterpreted RAW per original intent.

If x was created and x was deemed too powerful as to create an unfair advantage, x becomes changed to y (where y is an equal but different, or actual lesser version of x), and y is now a changed option FROM x, and x no longer exists.

That is a nerf.

A nerf is a change to the game for balance reasons. You cannot nerf some option that never existed. The only thing you can do, without changing the mechanism, is to clarify how the mechanism ACTUALLY works.

there has been many a time were paizo has nerfed something under the guise of "clarification" even some instances of literally every one reads it this way and it gets "clarified" to be less powerful


It's not our fault that the people in charge of producing this game and everything that goes into it have absolutely no standard or code on the wording of their own content. The feats are written by a million monkeys in a room with a million typewriters, plain and simple. There isn't a semblance of consistency anywhere to be found.

That being said, I think they screwed the pooch on Courageous, they didn't clarify anything other than that they made an entirely useless weapon enchantment AND really suck at writing what they actually mean the first time.

The Exchange

I've never actually done it, but wouldn't vicious and vampiric go together really well?

Or even just vicious and holy for an extra 4-D6 vs. evil creatures.


You would need vampiric and cruel on a viscous anything just to keep yourself from suffering too much. I have never seen anyone choose to put viscous on anything, personally. I have both received and handed out viscous weapons as loot, though.

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