PFS swashbuckler advice


Pathfinder Society

Grand Lodge

Hello everyone!
After some home played game, and 3 game in pfs year ago I think try pfs harder.
Then, now I have last chance to rebuild my first character and I don’t know enough about the differences between good home game PC and good PRC game PC.
I have a conception of halfling - noble fencer (or he just pretend to be noble). So, I make this build and need advice - it’s good or not.

Halfling swashbuckler (inspired blade, noble fencer)
Str 6, dex 18, con 14, int 14, wis 10, cha 14 (after race adjustment)
I select only one trait now - fencer for both roleplay and good bonus. With second I really don’t know: dangerously curios? Fort or will safe buff? Something else?
In skills I plan max acrobatics, perception, diplomacy, perform (oratory) and may be bluff. This left 1 or 2 (don’t decide about FCB - hp or skill point). Knowledge (local) seems really good investment. Steals to.
Of course my first feat is fencing grace (and feat chain is only one thing where I sure enough)
And my last question: spend 3 PP to darkwood buckler and mithral rapir is good idea, or only waste of precious resources?

And excuse me for my language - I not really good in English.

4/5 Venture-Agent, Minnesota—St. Louis Park aka BretI

I would suggest you not dump Strength so hard. You will have problems carrying equipment.

Given your mention of nobles, perhaps you should look at the Sovereign Court faction. A lot of their scenarios utilize the social skills — diplomacy, bluff and sense motive. They will also make use of knowledge Nobility.

Swashbucklers often want Combat Reflexes so they have more attacks of opportunity, especially since parry/riposte often uses one.

Other feats to look at include Steadfast Personality, Iron Will, and likely Weapon Focus with either Slashing Grace or Fencing Grace.


I don't think inspired blade and noble fencer stack as they both alter deeds. I've never played PFS though, so I'm not sure if the rules are different there.

Other than that it looks good.

Grand Lodge

BretI wrote:

I would suggest you not dump Strength so hard. You will have problems carrying equipment.

Given your mention of nobles, perhaps you should look at the Sovereign Court faction. A lot of their scenarios utilize the social skills — diplomacy, bluff and sense motive. They will also make use of knowledge Nobility.

Swashbucklers often want Combat Reflexes so they have more attacks of opportunity, especially since parry/riposte often uses one.

Other feats to look at include Steadfast Personality, Iron Will, and likely Weapon Focus with either Slashing Grace or Fencing Grace.

As I count, this Str enough to carry all my combat gear and clothes and have light load. Yes, all equipment weight more, but I can drop it every fight and pick up later. Also I can think about change my combat trait to Muscle of the society. This change makes me sad, but I really don’t want dump con and will (because weak saves and hp), and other stats...

And as I say - I have a list of chosen feats. Free focus (rapier), fencing grace, combat reflexes, versitale weapon... steadfast personality not really worth more for this character - only 14 base cha (and now I not sure what mental stat I would rise later), and noble fencer already have increased will safe against mind affecting effects.

About faction I need to think more, of course. Liberty edge have my attention because they have they new faction halfling leader. And loves perform oratory. And since I'm not sure that my character is a real aristocrat, and not just pretending to be one of them, I don’t sure about Sovereign Court.

But really thanks for your advice.

Sczarni

Actually, it looks like Noble Fencer and Inspired Blade do in fact stack as neither archetype replaces the same specific deeds.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

str 6???
you will fall down after picking 10 gold coins

Sovereign Court

Mithral rapier is really not worth it. If you need to pierce silver DR, chose silversheen. It doesn't rust, which may help at some occasion. Masterwork buckler is enough, the only reason to buy darkwood version is 0% chance of arcane casting failure. Lowering outfit and armor weight is more efficient.

About build - SERIOUSLY consider extra panache feat. While having bigger panache pool as inspired blade, you can't restore it via killing blows, so, in case you're unlucky, you will get two more parry and riposte uses. I'd say that inspired blade is a bit overrated because of the reason above and I chose more reliable option(only noble fencer archetype), but considering your 6 str... yeah, you really need that dex to damage.

And 6 str can kill you. Literally. There are ghosts which do 1d6 str damage, and I met them in PFS at least twice. Maybe even three. Not the case. Besides the encumberance reason mentioned above, stat damage can come unexpected and with terrible consequences.

Sovereign Court

You've created two topics. I have said everything I wanted in another one, but want to add: if you won't dump str so hard, you may not need dex to damage that badly. This will allow you to get combat reflexes at lvl 1 and increase your survivability and make you extremely hard to kill. My first swashbuckler game was as pregen, which had no dex to dmg at level 4 and still was surprisingly good. Don't try to get most damage possible at first level, barbarian with greatsword will wipe out more enemies and you have to deal with it.

Grand Lodge

Solariel Sunleaf wrote:
Mithral rapier is really not worth it. If you need to pierce silver DR, chose silversheen. It doesn't rust, which may help at some occasion. Masterwork buckler is enough, the only reason to buy darkwood version is 0% chance of arcane casting failure. Lowering outfit and armor weight is more efficient. About build - SERIOUSLY consider extra panache feat. While having bigger panache pool as inspired blade, you can't restore it via killing blows, so, in case you're unlucky, you will get two more parry and riposte uses. I'd say that inspired blade is a bit overrated because of the reason above and I chose more reliable option(only noble fencer archetype), but considering your 6 str... yeah, you really need that dex to damage.

Thanks for advice. As I see:

1. Silversheen can’t be bought by 2 PP - silversheen themselfs cost 750 gp.
And mitral rapier can safe 0,5 pound weight and 520 gp to later purchase
2. For lowering armor weight I wanna buy darkleef studied leather. And use in all entire life of my character.
Darkwood buckler work for some reasons as mitral rapier - safe 1,25 pounds and price of masterwork items.
3. Lowering outfit and carryind stuff weight is hardly desirable, but I don’t find the way to do this.
4. Extra panache is in list of feat I thinking for. But I can by one or two plume of panache. Feats vs gold question.

About overrated inspired blade - yes, I think so. But it work good for roleplaing. And dex to damage from level one too)

Sovereign Court

Consider darkleaf outfit. It will cost you exactly 2 pp and save more weight than mithral rapier and darkwokd buckler. Still, you may just not dump str that hard. You can get 13 int and 8 str, and then put a point in int at lvl 4. This will make your life much easier. You can instead go with 17 dex, which gives you even more spare points, but that's a hard choice(I went for it, though, and regret nothing. Totally worth it).

Grand Lodge

Solariel Sunleaf wrote:
Consider darkleaf outfit. It will cost you exactly 2 pp and save more weight than mithral rapier and darkwokd buckler. Still, you may just not dump str that hard. You can get 13 int and 8 str, and then put a point in int at lvl 4. This will make your life much easier. You can instead go with 17 dex, which gives you even more spare points, but that's a hard choice(I went for it, though, and regret nothing. Totally worth it).

Dark leaf outfit... never think about! Thanks! Really temptation!

17 dex... sound sad. By this way I need to think about mithral chainshirt rather then darkleaf leather I think?

Silver Crusade

Its never wise to have all Stats as a Round number in the Beginning.
Pathfinder doesn't reward that.You STR should at least be 7-8.

I dislike Inspired Blade because it makes you character too mad (Dex>Con>Int>Cha) instead of a simple (DEX!>Cha>Con) since for some reason Charmed Life is still Cha based so you cant dumb it.(Student of philosophy/Bruising Intellect can make Cha dumb then Possible).

I like the Darkwood Buckler/Darkwood Bow on almost all my Chars. The weight reduction for this small of additional Price is worth it.
Mithral Rapier is trash. Adamantine is way way more important and useful.

My suggestion is Going 7/19/14/10/10/15(@4Dex/@8Cha) or 9/19/14/8/10/15(@4Dex/@8Cha) or 7/19/14/8/10/16(@4Dex/@8Str) without Inspired Blade.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

One possibility to consider is to start with inspired blade, and then re-train out of it as soon as you have enough feats to get dex to damage without it. (That’s what I’d be inclined to do.)

In that case you’d want to pick stats that go with Noble Fencer (only) in the long run. I’d be inclined to go for something like:
S 10-2=8
D 16+2=18
C 14
I 10
W 10
Ch 14+2=16

Or if you want to be more well-rounded (and get the extra skill point):
S 10-2=8
D 16+2=18
C 14
I 12
W 10
Ch 13+2=15

Anyway, something to consider.

EDIT: Forgot PFS was 20 pt buy, not 15. Readjusted stats.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

One more note regarding why you might want to reconsider dumping Str so hard: in addition to carrying capacity, a really low Str will drop your CMD even lower (making you even more vulnerable to the frequently encountered grappling monster). Likewise it will make you really susceptible to Str damage. Having seen more than one low Str character bite the dust fighting Shadows, I think it’s something worth being wary of.


MrRetsej wrote:
Actually, it looks like Noble Fencer and Inspired Blade do in fact stack as neither archetype replaces the same specific deeds.

"A character can take more than one archetype (sometimes called 'stacking' archetypes) and garner additional alternate class features, but none of the alternate class features can replace or alter the same class feature from the base class as another alternate class feature."

Both alter the Deeds class feature so they wouldn't stack. I think it would be a reasonable home rule to allow it, but from what I've heard about PFS they strictly adhere to the rules.


Gallant Armor wrote:
MrRetsej wrote:
Actually, it looks like Noble Fencer and Inspired Blade do in fact stack as neither archetype replaces the same specific deeds.

"A character can take more than one archetype (sometimes called 'stacking' archetypes) and garner additional alternate class features, but none of the alternate class features can replace or alter the same class feature from the base class as another alternate class feature."

Both alter the Deeds class feature so they wouldn't stack. I think it would be a reasonable home rule to allow it, but from what I've heard about PFS they strictly adhere to the rules.

i can see the reasoning for that. but if its true that they both alter deeds, that would mean a PFS swashbuckler can never take more then one archetype. so i assume by RAI that Swashbucklers should be able to take multiple archetypes if they can stack (if they don't replace the same deed)


Sir_Andrew wrote:
Gallant Armor wrote:
MrRetsej wrote:
Actually, it looks like Noble Fencer and Inspired Blade do in fact stack as neither archetype replaces the same specific deeds.

"A character can take more than one archetype (sometimes called 'stacking' archetypes) and garner additional alternate class features, but none of the alternate class features can replace or alter the same class feature from the base class as another alternate class feature."

Both alter the Deeds class feature so they wouldn't stack. I think it would be a reasonable home rule to allow it, but from what I've heard about PFS they strictly adhere to the rules.

i can see the reasoning for that. but if its true that they both alter deeds, that would mean a PFS swashbuckler can never take more then one archetype. so i assume by RAI that Swashbucklers should be able to take multiple archetypes if they can stack (if they don't replace the same deed)

The rules do not change out of convenience. If the rules say the archetypes do not stack then they do not stack. There is nothing to indicate that every class must have stacking archetypes.

Grand Lodge 3/5

Faq


Grandlounge wrote:
Faq

Looks like I was wrong. I found an additional FAQ that explicitly states that altering specific subfeatures does not count as altering the feature as a whole.

Grand Lodge 2/5

I would recommend against both the Noble Fencer and Inspired Blade for these reasons:
1: Your main resource pool is a small one that does not get bigger as you level like most other resource pools. As such, you need to rely on replenishing that pool. Inspired Blade takes away your primary way to regain panache. Having a bigger pool to start out with may seem nice but ultimately is pretty short-sighted.
2: You have little motive to invest in high wisdom, as you don't have a SINGLE class ability that relies on it. The same goes for Con, though you usually have 14 Con to start with. That, coupled with low Will and Fort base saves, leaves you incredibly vulnerable to attacks that target those saves. Noble Fencer gets rid of your main defense against that- Charmed Life. Unless you're planning on a 2 level dip in Paladin, don't get rid of Charmed Life. Side note: a 2 paladin dip is a fantastic dip for swashbucklers.
3: Another minus to Noble Fencer: You lose Dodging Panache. Say a Hydra pounces you. On the first attack you use dodging panache to move 5 feet back. The Hydra can now no longer complete it's full attack action on you, as you're out of its normal reach. It's an ability that saves lives.

Honestly, straight swashbuckler is the way to go, in my opinion. Base swashbucklers are in no way lacking in role-play potential. As a halfling, the Mouser archetype is really good as well, but that relies on a different strategy of play than other swashbucklers.


The reason to choose inspired blade is not the extra panache from Int, but the fact you get both Weapon Finesse and Weapon Focus at first, allowing non-humans to take fencing grace at level 1 (or humans to get fencing grace as well as an extra feat). There is also the +2 damage from rapier training as opposed to the +1 damage from swashbuckler training at level 5.

Community / Forums / Organized Play / Pathfinder Society / PFS swashbuckler advice All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.