Aoinse conversion [Spoilers for book 3]


Ruins of Azlant

The Exchange

Hi all,

After finishing The Flooded Cathedral, the party sought to assist Aoinse in dedicating herself to a new deity, Brigh.

Any ideas on how this should play out/how long it might take to convert to a new god?


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The thing about being a cleric is that it takes faith. Although her inability to restore her spells through prayer constitutes pretty strong evidence that Amaznen is dead, that doesn't mean that she will instantly give up on the deity whose priesthood created her.

Also, unless one of your PCs happens to be a devotee of Brigh, where is she going to learn anything about this new deity? She's a fairly obscure goddess, as these things go. A good Knowledge (religion) check would certainly be enough to give a few salient details about her (name, alignment, general areas of concern), but unless one of them happens to be carrying around a copy of The Logic of Design, they probably don't know the details of Brigh's devotions.

Also, there is one serious problem: although Amaznen and Brigh share many traits, chief among them an interest in invention and artifice, they have diametrically opposed views on the sharing of knowledge. Amaznen, the deity to whom Aoinse pledged her faith, was a god of secret knowledge. Some things are too terrible or important to be shared! Brigh, on the other hand, is explicitly about publishing everything. Concealing information slows down progress!

These two views cannot be reconciled. That was, in fact, the source of Amaznen's dislike of Lissala: "Amaznen disliked Lissala, however, for Amaznen taught that some knowledge should be kept secret, while Lissala championed that all knowledge should be freely shared." (Flooded Cathedral pg. 68) Brigh's doctrine is very similar, and therefore converting to Brigh requires Aoinse to repudiate a significant aspect of Amaznen's teachings.

The text says "Aoinse says that she would like to drive out the monsters and restore the cathedral to its former glory, or at least protect the place’s secrets from the enemies of humankind." Those are fairly immediate goals; but the suggest that her goals ("protect the secrets") may not fit Brigh's philosophy very well.

So it's not a one-to-one fit, and it should not be easy. At the very least, she needs the following:

- Definitive proof that Amaznen is dead and gone (shouldn't be too hard)

- A copy of Brigh's holy text to study, or discussions with a current devotee who can lay out Brigh's doctrine for her.

- A seriously difficult Diplomacy check -- we're talking DC 35 or 40 here -- to persuade her that Amaznen's doctrine of secrecy was misguided, and that abandoning it does not dishonor his memory. Maybe even a series of difficult Diplomacy checks over time.

Alternatively, here are several other deities to whom Aoinse might turn:

Bharnarol, NG agathion empyreal lord. He shares Amaznen's emphasis on artifice, and also actively works to contain dangerous knowledge.

Ng the Hooded, N Eldest of secrets and seasons. This one is something of a stretch. He's all about secrets, but has little interest in invention or discovery of new knowledge. Also he's from the First World, which may be off-putting.

Norgorber in his aspect of Reaper of Reputation. Again, this is a stretch. He is interested in keeping secrets, it's true, but he does so primarily as leverage for selfish gain, which does not fit in well with Amaznen's philosophies at all.

Pharasma, because she is the goddess of rebirth. She cares little for artifice, constructs, or secrets; but if Aoinse mourns the loss of Amaznen sufficiently, she might turn to worship of Pharasma, because even gods can be reborn. In fact, if your PCs wish to persuade Aionse to worship Brigh, one argument might be that Brigh is actually Amaznen reborn, and the change from secrecy to openness is a result of learning from his past life. It was, after all, secrets that got Azlant destroyed -- not enough people knew about the veiled masters to effectively oppose them. Aoinse would no doubt want some way to confirm such a theory.

Sivanah. Although she cares little for artifice or constructs, her followers are great at keeping secrets; and if she is somewhat less stable and predictable than Amaznen, well, perhaps Aoinse is feeling somewhat unstabilized by suddenly waking up in a world so utterly changed from what she knew. She could worship Sivanah and take the Madness domain as a result of her unbalancing.

Finally, as to how long it should take, that's up to you. You could easily make it a sub-plot that stretches for several books, provided you can keep the players' interest that long. But it shouldn't be easy or too quick. Changing deities should be a difficult process.


Thanks for the response Tinalles, a lot to think about there. Honestly, the group was so excited to be able to help the cleric find a new deity that they began scouring material to find one that was appropriate.

They have already discussed procuring a copy of The Logic of Design and other means of trying to assist her so I didn't want to stop them from trying.


Oh, by all means let them try! They can always try. It just may not be easy.

Aoinse had sufficient faith in Amaznen to become a cleric; that's a huge investment of belief. From her perspective, she was disabled (somewhat like going to sleep), and then when she woke up he was gone and her entire world has been upended.

She'll probably need to do some serious thinking to choose her path forward.

Grand Lodge Contributor

Tinalles makes a very good point about Amaznen and Brigh's opposing views on sharing information, but I think helping Aoinse convert is such a cool idea that I hope you can make it work.

Aoinse is a machine--albeit an intelligent one--and a cleric to boot, so it's likely her views are quite rigid, and her initial reaction to the new situation is "to do as Amaznen would do".

But then again, her former boss Imosele wanted her to be different from the other clockworks. She even gave her free will, and she definitely has the potential to change and adapt. As reality sinks in, she might come to the conclusion that Amaznen's secrecy was actually one of the contributing factors of Azlant's downfall. As the Wheels of Heaven encounter suggests, Imosele was able to predict Earthfall, but her fellow priests didn't believe her perhaps because they expected more direct communication from their deity. Which of course didn't happen because Amaznen was being Amaznen.

This is not official canon (just my own headcanon), but it's possible that priests of Amaznen or Amaznen himself created Brigh, and when Amaznen died, she inherited some parts of his portfolio.

In other words, it's not impossible for her to convert, but it'll probably take some time and help from the PCs.

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