Licence question


Product Discussion


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Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook Subscriber

When I read a bit about the licenceses for PF and SF I got the impression, that it is quite uncomplicated to use either system and put sourcebooks or rule modification books out for them (please correct me if I'm wrong there).

What intrigues me the most there though is...for digital media like computer games I've read that they are not explicitely mentioned in the licenses there. Are they also allowed the same way as books? Or does that work differently?


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My understanding is that the Open Gaming License is only used for RPG, tabletop games. I believe even the Pathfinder Card Game falls under different licensing.

IANAL, nor do I represent Paizo. Blah, blah, blah...


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Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook Subscriber
GinoA wrote:

My understanding is that the Open Gaming License is only used for RPG, tabletop games. I believe even the Pathfinder Card Game falls under different licensing.

IANAL, nor do I represent Paizo. Blah, blah, blah...

Thanks. I found an old thread in the meantime where it was stated that computer games are not falling under the ogl licence (are excempt so to say).

Which means that if one wants to create a computer game using the pathfinder rules paizo must allow it.

Is licensing@paizo.com still the correct address there? (found that in the old thread and tried to write a mail to there but never got an answer).


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Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Lost Omens, PF Special Edition, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

The OGL is a WotC license, and if you want an explicit yes/no on computer games using OGL you’d need to somehow convince Wizards of the Coast to give you free legal advice (good luck). I recommend contacting a lawyer who specializes in this sort of thing to read over the license and give you legal advice as to how a computer game using OGL would work. I do not personally see anything in the OGL that prevents computer games, but complying with all license terms may be tricky.

Only contact Paizo’s licensing email if you are planning on using Paizo’s IP (e.g. setting the game in Golarion or using the Pathfinder name or logo).


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Pathfinder Maps, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

I think one issue with applying the OGL to a computer program is that you would have to release the source code to the general public in order to comply with that license -- and that is something that is almost never done with computer programs, since that would make it possible for others to modify said program and release their own versions of it.

So I am not entirely sure whether the OGL prohibits computer programs or just makes them an extraordinarily bad idea.


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Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook Subscriber
David knott 242 wrote:

I think one issue with applying the OGL to a computer program is that you would have to release the source code to the general public in order to comply with that license -- and that is something that is almost never done with computer programs, since that would make it possible for others to modify said program and release their own versions of it.

So I am not entirely sure whether the OGL prohibits computer programs or just makes them an extraordinarily bad idea.

Not necessarily there. I've done a few computer programs in the past that used open source material. There it was so that only the part that you modified from the original source had to be made public (thus if you changed a specific method from teh source material that had to be public, not the other code, ...).

Silver Crusade

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Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Hi, I'm Gorbacz and I am a lawyer.

The best answer to the question "how easy it is to make a OGL video game" is to point out that to date, only one was ever made. And it was a small, fan project, which largely did not need to worry about things like WotC suing them into the ground.

Why not more? Why no Bethesda or EA doing an OGL D&D-ish video game? Well, that's because there are a ton of not so easy to answer questions about how does OGL apply to a modern video game ... and WotC won't answer them. They'll just C&D you if they believe that you've gone against the license. For any serious corporate actor, this is risk best not undertaken.


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A friend of mine made an XP calculating app for 3.5, but because because the XP tables are not OGL and he wanted to be absolutely sure it was OK, he asked WOTC if it was OK to share. He got a resounding "NO! And if you persist in this there will the TROUBLE" in response.

An app for calculating XP. Intended for free distribution to save people a minute or so worth of work.

That's how touchy they are about these things.

Silver Crusade

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Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Bjørn Røyrvik wrote:

A friend of mine made an XP calculating app for 3.5, but because because the XP tables are not OGL and he wanted to be absolutely sure it was OK, he asked WOTC if it was OK to share. He got a resounding "NO! And if you persist in this there will the TROUBLE" in response.

An app for calculating XP. Intended for free distribution to save people a minute or so worth of work.

That's how touchy they are about these things.

To be fair, 3.5 XP tables are *not* open content, so WotC kind of were in the green to chase your friend around. If you want to use the 3.5 SRD, you need to come up with your own XP tables and calculations, because that one detail is missing from the SRD.


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Pathfinder Maps, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

You might be able to get around that problem by using literally any other XP table but the main one put out by WotC in their PHB. I think the XP table in Unearthed Arcana is open content, as are the trivially different table in Arcana Evolved and the radically different table in Pathfinder.


This can still be found on the WotC site. The relevant part:

Quote:

Q: I want to distribute computer software using the OGL. Is that possible?

A: Yes, it's certainly possible. The most significant thing that will impact your effort is that you have to give all the recipients the right to extract and use any Open Game Content you've included in your application, and you have to clearly identify what part of the software is Open Game Content.

One way is to design your application so that all the Open Game Content resides in files that are human-readable (that is, in a format that can be opened and understood by a reasonable person). Another is to have all the data used by the program viewable somehow while the program runs.

Distributing the source code not an acceptable method of compliance. First off, most programming languages are not easy to understand if the user hasnÍt studied the language. Second, the source code is a separate entity from the executable file. The user must have access to the actual Open Content used.

See the Software FAQ for more information.

You can make software (which I assume includes games), but there are some major hurdles to overcome to do so. I can't find the Software FAQ they mention.

Paizo Employee Chief Technical Officer

The original post appears to have been regarding the Pathfinder and Starfinder Compatibility Licenses, and later discussion shifted to the OGL. It is important to realize that these are different licenses that serve different purposes.

When it comes to the Pathfinder or Starfinder, our intellectual property generally falls into two categories: Open Game Content (generally game mechanics) and Product Identity (generally setting material, trademarks, artwork, and other non-mechanical stuff).

Anything we've declared as Open Game Content in our products is available for use under the Open Game License; anything we've declared as Product Identity is not available under the OGL. In most of our products, you'll find the statements of OGC and PI on the title or credits page at the front of the book. Note that these statements occasionally vary from product to product, so you'll need to check the individual statements in each product you wish to draw from.

If you are a noncommercial user, you may be able to use some of our PI by way of our Community Use Policy, which you can find at http://paizo.com/paizo/about/communityuse. If you are a commercial user, our PI is not available for your use without a specific license.

To use Open Game Content in your own projects, you need to use the OGL, which you can find in any OGL product. The OGL itself tells you how to use it. Please note that the OGL is Wizards of the Coast's license, not Paizo's, and so I can't provide any advice about its suitability for your use. You may wish to consider speaking with an intellectual properties legal specialist.

Note that the OGL specifically restricts you from using "any ... trademark or registered trademark clearly identified as Product Identity by the owner of the Product Identity", or from "indicat[ing] compatibility or co-adaptability with any Trademark or Registered Trademark in conjunction with a work containing Open Game Content except as expressly licensed in another, independent Agreement with the owner of such Trademark or Registered Trademark." So to indicate that your OGL project is compatible with the Pathfinder Roleplaying Game, you'll need to follow our free Pathfinder RPG Compatibility License, which you can find at http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/compatibility; the equivalent license for the Starfinder RPG is at http://paizo.com/starfinder/compatibility. Note that these Compatibility Licenses are applicable only to books, electronic books, and freely available websites. You can still use Open Game Content in a OGL product that's not a book, ebook, or free website, but you can't say it's compatible with the Pathfinder RPG or the Starfinder RPG or use trademarks like Pathfinder, Starfinder, or Paizo in any way; you may, however, use the non-trademarked terms “PFRPG” or “SFRPG.”

Addressing the topic of computer games specifically:

Wizards of the Coast published a FAQ specifically about using the OGL with software (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=d20/oglfaq/20040123i). (The FAQ, which is from 2004, makes many references to the d20 System Trademark License, which is not the same as the OGL, and which is apparently no longer available.)

The Pathfinder/Starfinder Compatibility Licenses can only be applied to books, electronic books, and freely available websites, so they can only be applied to a computer game if that game exists solely in the form of a free website.

The Paizo Community Use Policy does not have limitations on the media types it can be used with.

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Solasta Crown of the Magister being D&D 5e srd game without being D&D license game made me wonder again on how this works. The steam page does state that they do have permission to use the srd 5.1 license, but I'm bit unclear on details.

So if someone did PF 2e game without it being Pathfinder setting(or without it being "Pathfinder" game aka just game that uses same rules but isn't "Pathfinder TM" game), would they need permission from paizo or wizards(or both) for using the OGL? Does same apply to Starfinder? (I'd assume yes, but for all I know stuff has changed in two years since last time someone posted in this thread)

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