What is your favorite non magical martial class?


Pathfinder First Edition General Discussion


This question is about classes that does not have magic or spells, Such as Fighters, Barbarians, Rogues, Cavaliers and such. What one of them is your favorite, And why do you like it?

So far of non magical classes I'v only played a Mutagenic Mauler Brawler and a Cavalier, And I havent been enjoying them that much..


why haven't you been enjoying those two?

Beatsticks all play pretty much the same, see target, kill target.
So switching to a different beatstick probably won't solve your issue of finding them boring.

But I like barbs and fighters they do really well at their job.


I myself have a liking for barbs and rogues
barbarians are strong beatsticks, and simpler to use than fighters with the overabundance of feats among which to choose from and that gets me lost...
Rogues, well I like the skill monkey and the sneak attack... so I like them better than slayers

I have no liking to cavaliers, and brawlers are like fighters, too complicated to handle without enormous preparation.


I dont realy know why i havent been enjoying it.. Let me think.. Hmm...

The Brawler.. What did I do in combat..? Drink mutagen, Run in, Punch as hard as i could (And I had bad luck and kept missing more then I hit.. xD) Variety did not exist..

The Cavalier.. I get my lance and charge on my wolf! Trying to charge past and stab them as I go, If that is not possible I draw my Falchion and charge in and try to hold them in place, Of if it is a narrow hallway and I cant reach the enemies cus friendlies are in the ay, I charge up and lance stab past them as the lance has reach. More fun then the Brawler, But still not quite doing it for me..

Sorry for the poor analysis.. I have a realy hard time with words..


Mutagenic mauler takes away the martial flexibility, , it takes away what I deem the brawlers most flavorful (and unmanageable) trait... I might try it just for that reason


It sounds like, for you, playing pure martial classes just isn't where your fun lies.

That's ok. There's no One Right Way to play Pathfinder.

You're absolutely right that it is possible, and quite easy, to make combat far more repetitive with a pure martial character than it typically is with a spellcaster who has the ability to make combats much more varied from fight to fight.

It doesn't have to be. You don't have to use the same tactics every battle. Brawlers can be quite versatile if you're willing to play with Martial Flexibility, and take advantage of the Brawler's Manuever Training. You could play with Trips and Grapples and Dirty Blows, and not just focus on "Punch 'em hard."

Fighting from atop your mount can have a lot of variety, as it sounds like you've discovered.

But overall, it sounds like you've just found a playstyle that doesn't appeal to you. There's no shame in that. There's a large variety of character classes in this game for a reason. :)

EDIT: I missed that you were playing a Mutagenic Mauler Brawler, which does remove Martial Flexibility.


I just have a realy hard time figuring out what I want to play.. My two favorite characters (And the only two i havent already mentioned here) Was a Cleric (Second favorite) And a Alchemist (All time favorite) And I'm trying realy hard to decide what to play after my Cavalier (He will be leaving the party after our current quest due to not wanting to travel to another continent with the party, He dosent want to go that far from home. Also partly because i'm not enjoying him much)

Sorry for all the posts I make.


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Merellin wrote:

I dont realy know why i havent been enjoying it.. Let me think.. Hmm...

The Brawler.. What did I do in combat..? Drink mutagen, Run in, Punch as hard as i could (And I had bad luck and kept missing more then I hit.. xD) Variety did not exist..

The Cavalier.. I get my lance and charge on my wolf! Trying to charge past and stab them as I go, If that is not possible I draw my Falchion and charge in and try to hold them in place, Of if it is a narrow hallway and I cant reach the enemies cus friendlies are in the ay, I charge up and lance stab past them as the lance has reach. More fun then the Brawler, But still not quite doing it for me..

Sorry for the poor analysis.. I have a really hard time with words..

Yeah, sounds like most melee's aren't your thing then.

Fighters = I move and hit, then hit till it's dead then repeat. Nothing else for their turns.
Barbs = I rage and then do exactly what the fighter does.
paladins = I smite if applicable and then do what the fighter does.
your brawler = I spend a round buffing then do what the fighter does.
slayer = I study and then maybe try to get flanking when I move and follow the rest of the fighter plan.

See a trend? all of their jobs are reaching target and killing target. that's the DPR plan.

Now it's not like they have less options than other characters. A LOT of wizards are
I cast haste on party, then maybe a spell to help the beatstick beat like fly or something, then sit and wait.

Also note, that you don't need to not have casting to do damage, investigators, bards, magus, inquisitors, basically most 3/4 bab class can do damage comparable to a beatstick while still doing their other role.


I love the idea of the mighty warrior who protects the helpless and takes on the horrible monster with only his strength and weapon! I guess it might not be for me in Pathfinder characters though..

On the opposite spectrum we got the pure casters and I havent played one, But I worry so much about running out of spells, Or preparingt he wrong spells and being useless for a day and such..

Maybe the classes for me are the more versatile classes, The classes with some combat capability and some spellcasting capability, Like the Alchemist (Love it) And Cleric (Much good)and other 3/4 classes and such..

Hmm... I have considerd trying a Witch (Cus hexes means I dont run out of spells fully) a Bard (I like buffing and they can cast and fight a bit too)Another Alchemist (Cus I love them, But kind of wanna try something I havent tried) A Summoner (Love the idea of the character but hesitant to try due to all I'v read about it bing OP and ruining the game for the other players) and also considerd Oracle (But we have one already) a Hunter, And a Inquisitor.. Though the Hunter and inquisitors I have no ideas for..

Liberty's Edge

Barbarian, even if I haven't gotten to play one as a PC yet.


if you're afraid of running out of spell go for a sorcerer or oracle, you get more, but who knows, maybe you just hit your sweet spot with the alchemist and yet have to realize it


I do love the alchemist, such an awesome class. I just want to try more classes aswell as I'm still pretty new, Though I do want to return to the Alchemist at some point. Maybe I should try the Bard after my Cavalier..

Dark Archive

Depending on how complicated you want your characters and what your GM allows you could try an iron caster. Essentially a fighter who bonds with his weapon to cast spells through it and sometimes his other magic items. It requires some tracking and rules savvy to run and relies on non-PFS-legal options but it can add some variety to a beatstick.

If that's too magicy then try something interesting like wielding a giant shield in two hands as your primary weapon. Rather than just hitting things you should look for opportunities to flank or shove someone into a wall to knock them down. It also gets cool abilities like getting a free attack with armor spikes on every bull rush that you get for free every time you hit with your shield. You could argue that Shield Trained would let you use a huge heavy shield two-handed but I didn't use that in this build.


Fighter, followed by Bounty Hunter Slayer.

Paizo Employee Organized Play Developer

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Spheres of Might includes a bunch of new non-spellcasting classes that currently serve as some of my favorites, but from Paizo only it's got to be the Vigilante (avenger specialization). I love having a class that's competent on and off the field and has mundane solutions to magical threats. The fact that the vigilante talents are largely comprised of either multiple feats or "super feats" that give you a key feat and a related special ability is also something I really enjoy about the class.


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If 3pp material is on the table, I like to use the Genius Guide to the Talented Ranger (and its More Ranger Talents supplement) to play a ranger without spells. Spells never fit my vision of a ranger anyway.


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Zhayne wrote:
If 3pp material is on the table, I like to use the Genius Guide to the Talented Ranger (and its More Ranger Talents supplement) to play a ranger without spells. Spells never fit my vision of a ranger anyway.

When I start my next campaign one of my players has already rolled up a Spell-less Ranger from Kobold Press. The Genius Guide version is really well put together as well, IMHO.


I mostly GM, so all but one of my martial PCs are from PFS. I'm quite fond of my primary PFS PC, a rogue, but he dipped into cleric so no longer fits your criteria. Two of my other PCs are a stonelord paladin (so no spells) and a brawler. Both of them are fun, but the brawler (an Osiriani oread who will eventually become a living monolith) is my fave at the moment. He's the first hybrid class I've played, and I chose the one that looked least complicated.

My wife's primary PFS PC is a halfling underfoot adept monk, who has proved very good at knocking foes down so that they have to waste actions and draw AoO's. She's also very fond of the iconic barbarian Amiri and her bigass sword, and will usually choose her when she has to play a pregen.

My previous Pathfinder campaign included an urban ranger/skirmisher (no spells) and a freebooter (from Green Ronin's Freeport: The City of Adventure), both of which were pretty versatile and entertaining in combat.

Our current campaign includes a scout rogue, a zen archer monk, and an order of the dragon cavalier. They're only 3rd level, so we haven't seen them really shine yet, though the monk is getting there.


For me, having a fun-to-play martial character requires two things: being very good at whatever their combat shtick is, and having something interesting to do when not fighting. Hyper-optimizing for DPR and nothing else is boring, because you tend to end up useless outside combat.

I'll use my brawler Neferanu as an example. I chose the class after reading the living monolith prestige class, and wanted to build a PC designed to qualify for it ASAP. That PrC requires some knowledge skills and languages that most brawlers wouldn't take, but they help define Nef's purpose in life: he was trained as a temple guard, so is an obvious candidate for the Scarab Sages faction. One or more of those "background" skills have proven useful in almost every scenario so far.

Nef's only 3rd level, but he's been fun to play in every session, regardless of how much combat he saw. In the most recent scenario I played him in, the final fight was as much fun for the roleplaying aspect (provoking a brawl, kung fu movie style) as it was for showing off his fighting prowess (flawless victory!).


Admittedly, I haven't played too many Pathfinder games, but from a flavor standpoint, barbarians is my favorite. Primal warrior for LIFE! Ranger also works, provided it's the Skirmisher archetype.

However, my dream martial class would be a bard, but non-magical. A good example would be the Dancer/Troubadour classes from the Etrian Odyssey series. Uses swift, multi-hitting attacks in a melee, buffs allies with stat or even elemental boosts, but is not a spellcaster.

I also don't necessarily have something against casters, but I've always liked the idea of a regular mortal fight monsters and slaying otherworldly beings.


I know you are looking at non casters, but have you considered a bloodrager?

Bonus Feats (+5), Some sweat spots of the barbarian, and spells...


Jason Wedel wrote:

I know you are looking at non casters, but have you considered a bloodrager?

Bonus Feats (+5), Some sweat spots of the barbarian, and spells...

I HAVE actually! When I first made characters to play for Pathfinder, I created a half-elf brother and sister duo who are a barbarian and bloodrager respectively! ...My only problem is that my only way to play is Society, and spellcasters, even partial ones, often require WAY more sourcebooks than what I can afford. I even had to retool the former to a budget build that only uses 3 books (Core and APG only, with UC for traits). Still, I really like the concept of the bloodrager!


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Ssalarn wrote:
Spheres of Might includes a bunch of new non-spellcasting classes that currently serve as some of my favorites, but from Paizo only it's got to be the Vigilante (avenger specialization). I love having a class that's competent on and off the field and has mundane solutions to magical threats. The fact that the vigilante talents are largely comprised of either multiple feats or "super feats" that give you a key feat and a related special ability is also something I really enjoy about the class.

Yeah, probably vigilante above all.

Hypothetically I love monks and rogues and all things related, but the practice has left me less enthused.

In practice, I've found rangers extremely potent (mechanically), though I found them a bit fiddly for my tastes in such folk. (Also technically magic casters.)

I loved the swordlord fighter when I played him. Other fighters I've found less inspiration for. Similarly, ninjas, which I enjoyed (though the GM was rather lax with requirements for sneak attacking).

I heart slayers. So daggum much.

EDIT: added monks and ninjas which I'd somehow managed to forget...


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I like the Slayer a lot. A less niche Ranger, but its abilities always apply, and a more competent Rogue. Lots of skill points, can cherry-pick a lot of good feats, and get early/easy access to them as well. And there are a few very cool, very weird archetypes that make them really stand out.


I'm fond of the Vigilante, the Fighter, and the Monk (either Unchained or with one of the good archetypes.)


Without knowing your financial situation:

Advance Class should be the only one you "NEED". Espesialy if you emphasise the full BAB/Warrior aspect with spells being a sideline

something like

Unnamed Hero
Half-orc bloodrager 1 (Pathfinder RPG Advanced Class Guide 15)
CG Medium humanoid (human, orc)
Init +4; Senses darkvision 60 ft.; Perception +5
--------------------
Defense
--------------------
AC 16, touch 12, flat-footed 14 (+4 armor, +2 Dex)
hp 12 (1d10+2)
Fort +5, Ref +3, Will +3
Defensive Abilities sacred tattoo[APG]
--------------------
Offense
--------------------
Speed 40 ft.
Melee greataxe +4 (1d12+4/×3)
Special Attacks bloodrage (7 rounds/day), claws
--------------------
Statistics
--------------------
Str 16, Dex 14, Con 14, Int 8, Wis 12, Cha 14
Base Atk +1; CMB +4; CMD 16
Feats Power Attack
Traits indomitable faith, reactionary
Skills Acrobatics +0 (+4 to jump), Intimidate +8, Perception +5, Survival +5; Racial Modifiers +2 Intimidate
Languages Common, Orc
SQ fast movement, orc blood
Other Gear chain shirt, greataxe, 30 gp
--------------------
Special Abilities
--------------------
Bloodrage (7 rounds/day) (Su) +4 Str, +4 Con, +2 to Will saves, -2 to AC when enraged.
Claws (Su) Gain 2 Claw attacks deal 1d6 damage when raging.
Darkvision (60 feet) You can see in the dark (black and white only).
Fast Movement +10 (Ex) +10 feet to speed, unless heavily loaded.
Orc Blood Half-orcs count as both humans and orcs for any effect related to race.
Power Attack -1/+2 You can subtract from your attack roll to add to your damage.
Sacred Tattoo +1 to all saves.

Hero Lab and the Hero Lab logo are Registered Trademarks of LWD Technology, Inc. Free download at http://www.wolflair.com
Pathfinder® and associated marks and logos are trademarks of Paizo Inc.®, and are used under license.


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I love the monk. Lots of variation in the way the character can function, and many abilities that act like spells.


Jason Wedel wrote:

Without knowing your financial situation:

Advance Class should be the only one you "NEED". Espesialy if you emphasise the full BAB/Warrior aspect with spells being a sideline

Hmm, good point! The idea WAS to have a frontline warrior with a side of fireball slinging, and Fireball and the like IS Core. I'll hafta look back and check my sources again, but that could work!

(...However, THEN there's the issue of playing my favorite character, my fire staff-wielding Flame Dancer/Flamesinger Bard, who requires 9 books in all when it's all said and done, and even THEN I was showing restraint. The Fiery Glare/Thunder and Fang Performer/Blistering Invective combo I want to eventually make use of requires 3 books ALONE, and those would pretty much be the only things I need from them. ...It's times like this that I wish Society didn't have such stringent rules on source purchasing. I can't even FIND some of these books, let alone buy them.)


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Vigilante, hands down.

After that, a Kitsune Martial Master fighter with Realistic Likeness and the full set of Magical Tail feats and Item Mastery feat abuse to basically play a shapeshifting sorcerer with full BaB. that still qualifies as a non-magic class character, right?


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Barbarian and Slayer, depending on whether I want to be a walking WMD of Awesome or a skillful dude with lots of feats and talents.
Honorable mention for monks of the tetori and zen archer varieties.


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I’m playing a Barbarian (Mad Dog) in a Giantslayer game that’s great fun. Eventually I’m planning on going into the Mammoth Rider prestige class and riding around on my huge wooly rhinoceros. It’s great fun.

Some of my favorite non-casters are actually the Paladin archetypes that give up spellcasting, like the Stonelord, Warrior of the Holy Light, and Tempered Champion, but I’m not sure you’re counting those, since they come from a casting class.


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Path of War Warder is great (although you CAN have magic with them, depending on the martial disciplines you grab), especially with archetypes:

All types - d12 HD, Full BAB, Good Fort and Will saves, 4+Int Skills (on an Int-based class)
Standard Warder - "Sword and Board" with Heavy Armor
Dervish Defender - Dual wield with light armor (and Int to AC)
Zweihander Sentinel - Two-hander with Heavy Armor
Hawkguard - ranged tank with medium armor


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IfritSlasher wrote:


(...However, THEN there's the issue of playing my favorite character, my fire staff-wielding Flame Dancer/Flamesinger Bard, who requires 9 books in all when it's all said and done, and even THEN I was showing restraint. The Fiery Glare/Thunder and Fang Performer/Blistering Invective combo I want to eventually make use of requires 3 books ALONE, and those would pretty much be the only things I need from them. ...It's times like this that I wish Society didn't have such stringent rules on source purchasing. I can't even FIND some of these books, let alone buy them.)

Two questions:

A, Which books are you having trouble finding?
2, What's the PFS position on buying the Paizo PDFs of books as a source?


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dysartes wrote:
IfritSlasher wrote:


(...However, THEN there's the issue of playing my favorite character, my fire staff-wielding Flame Dancer/Flamesinger Bard, who requires 9 books in all when it's all said and done, and even THEN I was showing restraint. The Fiery Glare/Thunder and Fang Performer/Blistering Invective combo I want to eventually make use of requires 3 books ALONE, and those would pretty much be the only things I need from them. ...It's times like this that I wish Society didn't have such stringent rules on source purchasing. I can't even FIND some of these books, let alone buy them.)

Two questions:

A, Which books are you having trouble finding?
2, What's the PFS position on buying the Paizo PDFs of books as a source?

To answer your second question, PDFs ARE an option, but my phone doesn't have room for them, and I don't have a laptop that works at the moment. That pretty much means I have to get the books in my current situation. That then leads to the issue of having to scour my local bookstores for copies (in which I've never seen Bastards of Golarion (Fiery Glare) or Elemental Master's Handbook (Flamesinger) available for purchase. Weapon Master's Handbook WAS for a while, but then they sold out before I could get my hands on it.).

And of course, I don't have the disposable income at the moment to go for either option anyway. My one saving grace however... If I can somehow get an external storage device for my phone, then maybe I can download the things there when I get the funds. I actually prefer physical copies, but PDFs are the most realistic and cost effective option.

But basically, I'm pretty much out of luck at the moment.


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YO.


Skirmisher- Ranger Archetype. Pure martial, Ex fun. It's an archetype, so I'm not sure if it qualifies for the thread.

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