Monster conversion


General Discussion


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I was just wondering if anyone had started converting legacy monsters to SF?

I am about to start the task of converting a whole bunch and will be happy to shre if people will find them useful.

It seems a relatively straightforward task but there's a little bit of work to convert multiple attacks, assign SF gear, change spells and so on.

Anyone already started doing this?

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I haven't yet, but that sounds absolutely amazing, especially since it's so long until we get access to alien archives.


I have, and it's fairly easy the way I do it. I start by chucking multiple attacks out the window for everything but the big solo monsters (I'm looking at you dragons!) and have them use full-attack actions for more than one attack, just like the players and with the same penalties. Hit points I try to follow the guideline of +25%, unless it seems crazy for that particular monster. Next I add armor if needed and go by that instead of what is listed, otherwise it's KAC=AC and EAC=AC-1, with certain conversions/creations varying as necessary (meaty foes KAC+2, EAC-2, and vice versa for brainy foes.). If the creature uses weapons i try to make them on par with what the party has, plus one or two lootable items on a case by case basis.

I only have a few done so far, including an ogre turned into a construct.

Liberty's Edge

I think waiting for Alien Archive and using the monster creation rules in there to make equivalents with that is probably not gonna be much harder than direct conversion, and will likely work much better with Starfinder rules. So I'm waiting to do that.


True, but there is First Contact. It gives just enough for comparison and it's a free pdf, so even if it doesn't meet al your needs you still get your money's worth.


I'm working on converting Grey aliens from Bestiary 5 for a one shot adventure to introduce my group to Starfinder. It's pretty easy. I'm giving them weapons and armor and adding appropriate skills (pilot being the main one for the space battle). The only thing that needs to be adjusted are the psychic powers, but that's easy enough.


Actually, after seeing "Alien Archive" for the first time, I'm wondering about the reverse: I would love to use some of these critters in a 'baseline' Pathfinder game ^_^

The Archive doesn't offer any suggestions itself, but it probably won't be to hard to do myself, although I'll ask elsewhere here to see if anyone else has any guidelines.


Honestly, with the Archive out, I wouldn't bother with converting Pathfinder monsters using the rules in the Core Rulebook, but instead using the monster creation rules in the Alien Archive and then adding unique special abilities from the Pathfinder version to the Starfinder version. It will be more different than a straight conversion, but it will be more balanced for Starfinder and would probably be less of a hassle over time.


I tried converting a chain devil using the monster creation rules, and it seems far stronger than it should be:

Chain Devil CR: 6 XP: 2400
LE Medium Oustider Outsider, Kyton, lawful, evil
Init +9, Darkvision 60ft, Perception +13
Defenses HP: 90
EAC: 18 KAC: 24 Fort +8, Ref +10, Will +5
Regeneration (3, good spells and weapons, silver weapons)
DR 5/good, silver Immune to cold, SR 17
Offense
Speed: 30ft
Melee: Spiked Chain +18 (2d4+9 P) Multiattack: 4 Chains +12 (2d4+9 P)
Space: 5ft Reach: 5ft (10ft with chains)
Offensive Abilites: Dancing Chains, Unnerving gaze (DC 14, 30ft)
Stats
Str +3; Dex +5; Con +2; Int +0; Wis +0; Cha +0;
Acrobatics +18; Athletics +13; Intimidate +13;
Feats: Blind-Fight
Languages: Common, Infernal

Granted, I used the cr 7 to get the attack values since it was the first cr with 4 attacks


Yeah, that's a bit much for CR 6.

I'd say that would probably be CR 7, mainly just due to it's offensive power. Also, it's KAC seems a little high? Not sure if I'm missing that one of the grafts increases it's AC, but it should just be 20 for it's KAC.

Plus it has several special abilities and no weaknesses.


The chain devil has an ability that says it's chains grant +4 armor to AC, I added that to it's AC in the statblock.

I also got a little confused about when you add the ability mods. For example saves: are they included in the array or do you add them to the array value. In this case I didn't.

Here's a link comparing the Pathfinder version:
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/outsiders/kyton/kyton/

Liberty's Edge

SirShua wrote:
The chain devil has an ability that says it's chains grant +4 armor to AC, I added that to it's AC in the statblock.

This is incorrect. The listed AC includes all modifiers from worn armor, never mind creature abilities that merely count as armor. It's the final AC after everything.

SirShua wrote:
I also got a little confused about when you add the ability mods. For example saves: are they included in the array or do you add them to the array value. In this case I didn't.

This is correct. Ability mods matter for Initiative and untrained skill checks, but very little else.

And yeah, if you upgrade the offense to be CR 7 the creature should be CR 7 in general (thus giving it various minor boosts), or to give it a compensating weakness of some sort.

Another option is to not have four attacks, listed creatures with multiple tentacles often have only one attack with all of them in Starfinder.


Allright so drop the AC back to 20, and overall take the creature up to cr 7 with these?

Another that came to mind when I was wondering why it seemed so powerful was that I don't remember seeing spells or weapons with the good descriptor, meaning the party would need to actively acquire a holy weapon fusion or silver weapons, anticipating a creature with defenses like this.


The Shobhad Warleader seems to be the only monster below CR10 with four attack multiattack, and it seems on the stronger end for its CR as well (CR 7), but the chain devil you listed has much greater defenses due to higher KAC, DR, and SR at the cost of weaker attacks (seriously that Shobhad warleader has insane damage).


Something else is the unnerving gaze which applies the shaken condition, a -2 to attacks saves, skills and ability checks. That boosts it's resilience some.

Dancing chains doesn't seem to have as much of an impact in the sci-fi setting unless I included them in the encounter, which would boost the CR by having it be in a favorable setting. Or a piece of gear is described as having a chain on it such as a necklace. There's actually a named devil whose tactics include strangling enemies with their own jewelry in PF.


As a point of comparison, using the conversion rules in the CRB gives the kyton 75 hitpoints, similar ac, and only a +11 to hit for only 2d4+2 damage and worse saves, putting it firmly behind the boss enemy in Incident at Absalom Station.

So it appears using the Alien archive rules tends to give stronger creatures compared to using the conversion rules in CRB.

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