Medpatch bonus

[Ravingdork]

Do you still get the +10 bonus from a medpatch if your are trained in Medicine?

[ENHenry]

At first, I was going to say "of course" but re-reading both its mechanics and its description, I would say "no", because it's described as a slap-it-on-and-done item, with "little skill required", which implies it does all the work and doesn't benefit from your actual level of skill. From its description, it would look like if you use a medpatch, you make an untrained roll at +10.

(just if anyone asks, it wouldn't make sense to say if you're trained, you can't use a medpatch in the same way an untrained person would, so I ignore that thought completely.)

[KingOfAnything]

Yeah, even if you are trained in the skill, you use an untrained roll when using a medpatch.

[Ravingdork]

So...I basically ignore my ranks and class bonus then?

That's seriously weird.

[Peat]

Ravingdork wrote:

So...I basically ignore my ranks and class bonus then?

That's seriously weird.

Not really. If the whole idea of the item is that it's 'slap on and forget' your medical training is irrelevant. An experienced doctor doesn't apply a bandaid any better than I do. It doesn't matter how much they understand the underlying biology or healing process, they still just put the pad over the injury as completely as possible.

[KingOfAnything]

Unusual, but it makes sense from a "these things are so simple anyone can use them" perspective.

[Martin Laflamme]

The DC to treat deadly wounds is set by the item being used (basic med kit = 25, advanced med kit = 20).. so considering that this item is a 'slap on and forget' to reuse a term above.. then we need to know what the DC is because you are likely not using the above items.

And if this is a +10 circumstance without any ranks.. lets say against a DC 25.. then this is a 50 credit item, that has only a chance of healing 1 hp / level 25% of the time (need to roll 15).

I hope I am getting this wrong.

[Martin Laflamme]

I think that the intent of the item is that it can be used untrained, but I would not agree that because it is simple to use, the medical knowledge of the user is worthless (I do not believe that is the design intent yet I agree the wording could be clearer).

A doctor could, prior to applying the path disinfect the wound, do some preliminary stitches using items found in his basic medkit. Then, he would apply the medpatch, with a circumstance bonus of +10.
That would significantly raise his chance to succeed against the DC 25 of the basic medkit treat deadly wounds.
(ideally exceed it by 5 and get the INT bonus to hp)

This is a level 1 item, and I believe the intent is for it to be useful at level 1 for its worth of 50 credit (same as mk 1 serum of healing)

[Martin Laflamme]

Sorry for the mistake above on my posts.. medpatch cannot be used on treat deadly wounds..
not part of the list of medicine actions we can use it for.

[Nimor Starseeker]

I ran into this question with my group and we figured that the medpatch has two functions:

1.If you are untrained it allows you to make a medicine check for:
-first aid
-long-term stability
-treat disease
-treat drugs or poison tasks

2.It gives you a +10 circumstance bonus for:
-first aid
-long-term stability
-treat disease
-treat drugs or poison tasks

The +10 circumstance bonus, you get regardless if you are trained or untrained.
Reason being you would have untrained Lv1 PC's making medicine checks for first aid checks with a better success rate than a trained Lv1 PC.

-Lv1 Untrained PC: +0 ranks, +10 circumstance/medpatch bonus, +1 INT bonus for 11
-Lv1 Trained PC: +1 ranks, +3 class, +1 INT bonus for +5
OR
-Lv1 Trained PC: +1 ranks, +3 class, +1 INT bonus +10 circumstance/medpatch bonus for +15

And with the Medical Expert feat, the Medpatch will let you treat deadly wounds as a full action without the circumstance bonus.

[azjauthor]

A follow-up on this: Do you apply your Intelligence modifier to the untrained Medicine check? Normally this would apply to an untrained skull use, but if my medical ranks are irrelevant there is no reason my Intelligence would matter either.

[Pantshandshake]

The item doesn't mention your Int bonus, so if you usually add an ability modifier to an untrained check, then you'd do that here as well, I imagine.

[Corsair17]

I would consider like the AED units in public places. It is there with instructions/automated so anyone can use them. A trained Paramedic can't get any more out of it than someone who never touched one before.