Better combination wizard or witch with Sorcerer


Advice


Starting a new campaign and a bit torn on whether to go a wizard with a sorcerer or a witch. I have some experience now with a witch as I am playing one in a different campaign and enjoying it immensely. Which class would you recommend to team up with the Sorcerer and Polearm fighter in the group?


Witch. Different spell list = more versatility.


Either one. Witch, just like Blahpers said, has a different spell list and you can Hex. Get a Rod of Abrupt Hexing, and you can Hex as a swift action 3x per day.

Admixture Evocation Wizard works wonders for Sorcerer because you can change your elemental dmg type with any Evoc spell on the fly, but the Sorc cannot.

Versatile Evocation (Su): When you cast an evocation spell that does acid, cold, electricity, or fire damage, you may change the damage dealt to one of the other four energy types. This changes the descriptor of the spell to match the new energy type. Any non-damaging effects remain unchanged unless the new energy type invalidates them (an ice storm that deals fire damage might still provide a penalty on Perception checks due to smoke, but it would not create difficult terrain). Such effects are subject to GM discretion. You can use this ability a number of times per day equal to 3 + your Intelligence modifier.

Grand Lodge

Witch, especially if the sorcerer builds in some versatility. Takes the right metamagic feats/buys rods, invests in scrolls, buys a mnemonic vestment, grabs versatile spontaneity, and/or buys rings of spell knowledge they can close the prepared caster gap a fair bit.

There are other casters that can complement a sorcerer well. Oracles can make strong casters (spirit guided, dual cursed or Ancient Lorekeeper), any number of shaman builds, druids, and clerics. They have lists that have less overlap with the sorcerer than the witch (this is a guess, I have not counted).


Eh, either or. A conjuration wizard would also go well in that party. You're going to need to protect yourself a lot; the shift power of the teleportation subschool is really useful for that. Summoning will also be helpful.

On a whole you'll have access to a whole lot more spells than tthe sorcerer so it's another form of avoiding list duplication.

Either are fine, but I'd say wizard.


Any particular reason you're not considering druids, oracles, shamans or clerics?

They can all do control or debuff style casting to varying degrees on success.

Between witch and wizard I'd choose witch.


I'd go with the wizard simply because I don't like playing similar characters twice in a row. Or one of the options CD suggests.


Psychic and Silksworn Occultist would also probably work.


Does the Group have a Divine caster and someone who can remove bad status effects? Shamans are a ton of fun, come with a lot of witch hexes. And has a unique spell list all their own.

If it is a choice between witch and wizard I always go wizard because of my love for them. I would just coordinate your spells so you guys are not stepping on each other's toes. I tend to play Necromancers (yes there are such things as Neutral Necromancers). I Tend to worship Nethys the god of magic and accepts all magics.

The more diversity pick will still be the witch since it is a different spell list and Hexes can help your Sorcerer feel special for helping them land their spells more regularly. If you take the right archetype you can also provide some status removal and healing. I am a fan of Herb witch for that. Herb Lore and Cauldron hex can go a long way in keeping the group healthy. You can even go Half-Elf or Human and grab skill focus Level 1 in Profession Herbalist so you have a much better chance to remove conditions.


Since you've just started playing a witch in another campaign, I wouldn't play another one right away. You'll just end up getting confused about which one can do what and it'll be a mess in your mind.

But why limiting yourself to only those two choices? If you want to stay Arcane, how about a Magus? Tons of fun, completely different play dynamic than your wizard, and complements both your Sorcerer and your Fighter.

Alternatively, since you've already got an Arcane caster and a front line fighter, go in a completely different direction: something Divine (Oracles are really fun, would give you experience as a spontaneous caster, and you could get a pet (with the right mystery) to add some front line beef to help your fighter; Clerics of course are always welcome; or even try an Inquisitor or a Ranger). How about a Rogue? A Bard? One of the Occult classes? There are ton of fun options.


I think it depends on what the sorcerer is doing. If he's spamming save or suck spells, he's really going to appreciate having a witch cripple enemy saves. But there are various spells/builds which won't care as much.

That said, there are plenty of good suggestions for other classes that could fit.


Hmm ya I've gone through some of the other casters and have played a druid in the past who was a lot of fun. I'm not a big fan of there spell list as it leans a little bit more towards self buffs. The bard is an interesting option but I have heard its one of the weaker classes in Pathfinder?


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LOL.. personally I agree with you. But there are a bunch of bard fanatics that will pick up that gauntlet and argue it is the strongest pathfinder class.


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Witch = excellent casting stamina via hexes


Atalius wrote:
Hmm ya I've gone through some of the other casters and have played a druid in the past who was a lot of fun. I'm not a big fan of there spell list as it leans a little bit more towards self buffs. The bard is an interesting option but I have heard its one of the weaker classes in Pathfinder?

You have heard wrong.

Core Rogue, Core Monk, Swashbuckler are the weaker classes mechanically.

Bard can do a lot and if you want some combat efficiency dipping levels into dragon disciple after Level 7 (for Haste) is a strong option. The Casting sucks outside the buffs as 6th level caster do not make great SoS/SoD casters. They do ok affecting NPCs but do not try to make an enchantment Bard trying to mind control CRs above your group Level. Just doesn't work out as well as a Sorcerer and other full casters. But you can easily make a Gish style character who buffs the party (& himself) uses a Longspear to grab AoOs for more damage in a round.

Quote:
LOL.. personally I agree with you. But there are a bunch of bard fanatics that will pick up that gauntlet and argue it is the strongest pathfinder class.

I don't agree that it is either weakest or strongest class. But it is in the middle tiers of power.

Grand Lodge

If you want a bard like class that is a much stronger casting class the mesmerist is amazing.

They can hand out damage to teammates, protect their friends, debuff like crazy, and crush action economy.

They are a control class but the do so by moving people around the battle field, saving them from attacks, debuffing and limiting actions. This is different then God wizard style play but it is very satisfying.


Bards aren't the weakest class in pathfinder, they're fine, although if you don't like the Druid because of buffing then you're not going to like the bard.

I'd vote Oracle or Shaman if you're against the druid, which for the record can do a lot more than just buff.


doc roc wrote:
Witch = excellent casting stamina via hexes

I have experienced this and it is sheer ecstasy. Unlike those wizards which I've seen have been very near useless early game as a witch I still felt among the strongest for sure and most impactful vs bosses.

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