Pros? Cons? Important tradeoffs?
I'm having a hard time seeing how the sorcerer can compete with a blood arcanist. Sorcerers have always been hard for me to play though, so I've come to the boards for other opinions! As far as combat, the build I have in mind would focus on cranking DC's. Out of combat, the focus would change based on the class (due to casting stat differences).
Here are my thoughts:
Cha vs Int as a casting stat is going to come down to personal preference.
Blood arcanists don't have as many spells per day as a sorcerer, but they have the incredible flexibility of a spellbook.
Blood arcanists have exploits AND the blood arcana/powers that a sorcerer get.
EDIT: The build is focusing primarily on enchantment and conjuration spells.
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Well, I can do a list for you, for completion sake:
1) Int vs Cha casting (Sorcerer can get Int/Wis casting)
2) Blood arcanists have fewer spells per day
3) Blood arcanists have better spell flexibility
4) Blood arcanists have exploits (wider range of abilities to pick from),
5) Sorcerers get access to Wildblooded and CrossBlooded archetypes
6) Sorcerers get access to bloodline familiars and/or bloodline powers
7) Arcanists get Consume spell (to recharge their pool)
8) Blood arcanists do not get bloodline skills, feats, or spells.
If you ask me, its really a tie game between the two. If you want to compare two specific builds, we can pick which one is better, but otherwise they are both fairly even. Individual gameplay variation at different tables may push it over the edge either way too. Longer adventuring days give the edge to Sorcerers, for example.
Arcanists also have terrible spells per day. You will probably run out every day until at least lv12. In comparision my sorcs typically start being able to cast all day around lv8.
Also several good exploits need a charisma score meaning you are a bit more mad than most other full casters
Just looking at the number of spells prepared you do start looking like a sorcerer. Yes they are flexible spells known but it is still very limited at one moment in time
Arcanist is my favorite class but it does have some serious downsides
Also: racial favored class bonuses. They're different between the classes. For the OP, a kitsune fey sorcerer is notorious this way. Also the races which which get extra sorcerer spells known can eventually get a lot more tactical flexibility than an arcanist.
On the wildblooded side, sage sorcerers are notable for casting off Int. Empyreal sorcerers who use Wis are less notable, but your Will save is better at least.
Back to arcanists, the ability to prepare spells with metamagic lets you move and cast, making metamagic more useful. Also since they prepare from a spellbook they can use the fancy spellbooks with boons - some of these are pretty good. In a one-shot or a game where retraining is easy, Expanded Preparation is a feat tax for arcanists.
Spells per day does matter, though it can be surmounted via runestones of power and the like. The bonus spells a sorcerer gets from their bloodline can be mostly replaced via exploit. The extra class skill and bonus feats--will the arcanist miss them? Depends on how feat-starved you are and which feats you'll be passing up.
Kinda depends upon your campaign, group, GM, and personal style.
Some games you never get much if any forewarning on what is coming up. Your group/self doesn't like spying, preparation, planning. So then your arcanist almost always has the exact same list of general spells prepared every day. In that case you will be better off as a sorcerer.
If, on the other hand, you know about changing situations and/or upcoming opponents; Arcanist will be better since you can prepare the 'perfect' spell set.
It's my opinion that blood arcanist is subpar to school savant as that archetype gets you an additional spell per level.
Just going to point out again School Savant does not let you cast an extra spell per level
I'd say that in general, blood Arcanist has more advantages even if less spells; a lot of it just comes down to Potent Magic. They do have to use CHA for powers though. Sorcerer can go with two Bloodlines or Wildblooded, and they have the Bloodline Mutations thing. CHA is maybe useful for Eldrich Heritage, Irrepressible and Noble Scion of War.
It is definitely not as cut and dry as I thought. I'd be playing this in PFS, so being able to cast plenty of spells per day at lower levels is nice. The flexibility of an arcanist is tempting too though, as are the high DCs via potent magic...
My general outline is to use the Naga Bloodline (which I can only find on the Archives of Nethys) on a Kitsune and then focus on conjuration and enchantment.
Is there a way for a sorcerer to get exploits? I see wizards have that option. Potent magic on a sorcerer would be sick...
Fey Bloodline has easily one of best Arcana. Honestly, I would go with whatever feels more right for the character concept; both will work just fine. Wildblooded Sorcerer has some interesting stuff, like Sylvan (gain a Druid companion, which is pretty awesome for a Sorcerer to ride around on), or Empyreal (WIS-based sorcery).
Ok, I didn't realize this was for PFS. That changes my responses a little bit.
First, I didn't think the naga bloodline was legal to play. However I checked the additional resources and it is legal if you have the book.
Second, I would probably lean toward arcanist for PFS play.
- Arcanist will kinda hurt on spells per day until somewhere around level 6 or so. However, there are things you can do to mitigate this issue. Have some area effect spells so you can hopefully effect more than 1 opponent and shut down the fight earlier. Keep some consumables including alchemical items on hand. Put a bit of ability to a missile weapon. Buy some cheap lv 1 wands. Have an attack cantrip so you can still keep plinking away if nothing else.
- Early on, all casters have to realize they can't sling magic every round of every encounter. That condition last slightly longer for an arcanist than it does for a sorcerer.
- Think, be clever, and use cunning to try and resolve encounters without blowing through your spells per day. Many/most PFS scenarios have at least 1 (occasionally 3) encounters that can be resolved without fighting. Or maybe 1 spell gives your side such an advantage that you don't need to do anything else.
- PFS scenarios have 4 encounters. So pretty soon you get to the point where you can use 2 or so effective spells each encounter.
- Not always, but most scenarios you have at least some idea what is ahead of you to assist in preparation. Going to the frozen north - endure elements. Exploring a volcano - resist fire. Problems in a chapel or cemetery distrupt/detect undead. Etc...
- Most scenarios are all in one game day, so the game doesn't have to stop while you go through your spell books again and again.
- Fast Study!
Third, I've played both in PFS and either one is more than viable. They are some of my most successful characters.
I think what makes the sorcerer stand out over the other builds is their ability to nuke better than the other spell casting classes. Orc bloodline + mutated bloodline (I think that's correct) is +2 dmg per dice rolled on your spell. Using varisian tattoo and precocious spell casting talent gets you +2 caster level on a lvl1 spell (burning hands). You COULD throw cross blooded onto this and take draconic blood line for +3 dmg per dice rolled but I think the loss of spells known and the -2 will save is a trap.
Anyways at lvl 1 you're looking at a burning hands that deals 3d4+6 dmg 4 times a day. Taking Daze as a lvl0 spell means that you can be combat effective all day and save your huge burning hands for when it's required. (yes you need to be a human to make this work but I don't think that's a huge disadvantage). This is what makes the Sorc stand out between the other two in my opinion. They are THE boom stick. As they level up it just gets more silly, especially if you take a trait that reduces the metamagic costs by 1. Because when you get to lvl7 you take intensifed spell and suddenly you have a burning hands that deals 7d4+14 dmg and is still a lvl1 spell! Throw on empowered to make it a lvl3-1(cause trait) for a lvl2 burning hands spell that deals 10d4+20. One might say Oh but what about energy resistance? Fine take the second mutation that lets you reduce the ER of your target and continue crushing it.
Now that is just 1 spell. One spell that when it is all said and done you deal 15d4+30 dmg and it will only be a lvl2 spell. You will have other spells for utility and longer range damage when needed and of course you can still cast save or suck spells. Anyways just my 2 cents.
I love the arcanist. Still, with point buy character generation, the sorcerer is usually a lot easier to play.
My arcanist with high INT and CHA was often teased for using his crossbow more often than the bolt ace (who got caught in melee more often).
While the enlarged orc sorcerer with the same CHA but high STR (16+2 enlarge person and reach) as second best score cleaved the enemies with his twohanded falchion after saving the group against recurring swarm attacks with burning hands and other spells.
Edit: At low levels, the sorcerer rules. With point buy, the arcanist is weaker too. Higher levels and high attribute generation methods mean stronger arcanists.
I've been debating on taking the arcanist with the occultist archetype. Basically focus on summons and use potent to shore up other spells. One thing that might be worth it in pfs is consume magic item...since you can probably destroy items and still show up on the sheet (could be wrong)
Thats why I was kinda looking at consume magic item to help...normally consume magic item is bad but in pfs I figured it might help
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Occultist arcanist doesn’t actually do a great job at summoning, compared to the (unchained for pfs) summoner or a plain ole wizard (with acadamae graduate feat)
An 8th level arcanist has 7 reservoir points at the start of each day, barring taking the Extra Reservoir feat- and probably multiple times at that. SM IV costs 4 points- congratulations you’ve used over half your pool points using the ability once. Even with consume magic items you’re not going to be able to sustain using your occultist ability more than 3-4 times a day.
NECRO!!!!
I'm not even sure why this one keeps coming back. The first conversation was about blood arcanists who struggle with a shortage of spells. I probably wouldn't try an arcanist as a blaster, because of the shortage, but the versatility can be good for other kinds of builds
And then we somehow moved to talking about arcanist occultists, which is a super random change. The occultist has the advantage of being more than just a summoner. Sure, the summoner can summon just as well and more often, but it doesn't have actual 9th level wizard casting, nor other nice exploits like dimensional slide. I feel like a summoning wizard doesn't really compare. They have to save vs fatigue and then their summons only last rounds per cast.
Is a double necro a bingo square or something? It has to be, right?