Is the "step up" feat now useless?


Rules Questions

Dark Archive

Step up, page 162
"Step Up (Combat) You can close the distance when a foe tries to move away.
Prerequisites: Base attack bonus +1.
Benefit: Whenever an adjacent foe attempts to take a guarded step away from you, you can also take a guarded step as a reaction as long as you end up adjacent to the foe that triggered this ability."

Attack of opportunity, page 248
"An attack of opportunity is a special melee attack you can make against a target you threaten (usually an adjacent opponent), even if it is not your turn. See Reach and Threatened Squares on page 255 for more details on threatening. You can use your reaction to make an attack of opportunity against an opponent in any of these three cases."

Reactions, page 248
"You can take only one reaction each round; you regain your reaction at the start of your turn."

From this, it looks like step up means you can't attack and is only useful as a prerequisite for "Step up and strike". Please correct me, I want to be wrong!


It can let you follow someone so you can full attack them on your next turn (full attacking uses your move, standard, and swift action), or remain in range to provide flanking during other characters' turns.

It's not much, but it's not totally worthless.

Grand Lodge

Yea you can't attack without spending two feats. The flip side is Guarded Step is a Move action so you're having to spend more resources to 5' step now (and getting more for free by being able to do it as a reaction with the feat.)

If you Guarded Step you can't Full attack for example.

Grand Lodge

It's very powerful against ranged and spellcasters, as they'll keep provoking. :)

Scarab Sages

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Varun Creed wrote:
It's very powerful against ranged and spellcasters, as they'll keep provoking. :)

It doesn't matter if they keep provoking, you've already used your reaction to step up.


Its actually quite handy if you're relying on melee attacks and using full attacks. If the caster takes a guarded step to get away to cast, then you step up to them. They cast, then on your turn you full attack. Or if you ready to strike the spellcaster, then he moves away, you move up and strike when they try to cast.

Hardly useless.

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
Imbicatus wrote:
Varun Creed wrote:
It's very powerful against ranged and spellcasters, as they'll keep provoking. :)
It doesn't matter if they keep provoking, you've already used your reaction to step up.

Step up and Strike gives you the option to hold the attack from SUAS until later...such as to interrupt a spell caster.

Scarab Sages

Glav wrote:
Imbicatus wrote:
Varun Creed wrote:
It's very powerful against ranged and spellcasters, as they'll keep provoking. :)
It doesn't matter if they keep provoking, you've already used your reaction to step up.
Step up and Strike gives you the option to hold the attack from SUAS until later...such as to interrupt a spell caster.

Yes, but I was referring to Step Up alone.

The Exchange

I've taken improved Feint with my Solarian to make combat easier since I'm not super maxed instrength. My next Feat is going to be Step Up so I can continue using my move action to Feint against opponents and debuff them if they try repositioning.

It's not the feat for triggering AoO any more, it's the feat that lets you keep,doing your thing on your own turn.

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
Imbicatus wrote:
Glav wrote:
Imbicatus wrote:
Varun Creed wrote:
It's very powerful against ranged and spellcasters, as they'll keep provoking. :)
It doesn't matter if they keep provoking, you've already used your reaction to step up.
Step up and Strike gives you the option to hold the attack from SUAS until later...such as to interrupt a spell caster.
Yes, but I was referring to Step Up alone.

It still lets the person who steps up have their standard and move actions. Otherwise it would be a move action to do a guarded step to approach. Trading a reaction for a Move action on your next turn is a really good trade.

SUaS as a follow-on feat just makes it even better...a move action and an attack all as a reaction? It's like getting two turns.


Pathfinder Pawns, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

Wow. That sucks. Hopefully the feat will be Errata's to be a bit more useful than that.

Also, readied actions to disrupt spells arguably don't work since they are considered offensive actions that occur after the spell is cast.

The Exchange

Disrupting spells is the worst way to ruin a persons turn.

"I'm going to step back and cast my spell on this guy"

"He follows you and attacks, damaging you so the spell fails"

Your turn is now over, who's next?

Many of the changes I'm seeing are as much about ensuring players enjoy their character and actually get to do stuff.


It's a feat that - even if it worked - only interrupts spells in the one specific case of an enemy caster standing next to you and then stepping away and then casting a spell carelessly after you've followed him and getting hit and failing concentration. Why shouldn't a player who took that feat get to use it and enjoy his character and do stuff?


Ravingdork wrote:

Wow. That sucks. Hopefully the feat will be Errata's to be a bit more useful than that.

Also, readied actions to disrupt spells arguably don't work since they are considered offensive actions that occur after the spell is cast.

Ravingdork, while I love your guides...

I think this feat is really useful. Since even a "5 foot step" (guarded step) takes a move action now, you can't 5ft step then full attack. With step up, they may be able to step away and prevent the AoO, but you are still on them, you don't burn your movement, and a full attack is incoming.

Step up and strike just makes it worse. I mean, look at it in a 1 on 1 vs a level 10 Solarian who is built for melee?

Caster steps back, you step up and hit them for around 4d6+23 damage or more. That is an average of 37 damage. On your next turn you unleash 3 more attacks for an average of 37 each. If they all hit that is 148 damage.

Even without Step Up and Strike, just the average 111 damage from 3 37 damage strikes will either kill or severely injure (if not kill) any caster, mystic, operative, etc.


Pathfinder Pawns, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

Readied actions to disrupt spellcasting still needs clarification. There are discrepancies in the rules.

The Exchange

Matthew Downie wrote:
It's a feat that - even if it worked - only interrupts spells in the one specific case of an enemy caster standing next to you and then stepping away and then casting a spell carelessly after you've followed him and getting hit and failing concentration. Why shouldn't a player who took that feat get to use it and enjoy his character and do stuff?

I think there's like four examples above (including my first post in this thread) that point out ways that step up already allows you to do,something with the feat and still have fun with your class.

Paizo,have made disrupting spell casting more difficult. Particularly important given their changes to 5' foot step becoming guarded step instead.

This is a good balance point. While it seems fun to be,disrupting enemy casters etc., it's far less fun when that same thing is happening to your character.

Also note, there is no concentration check any more. If you take damage , the spell fails

Dark Archive

My understanding is that spellcasting automatically provokes and the AoO from that clearly goes off and can disrupt the spell. So Step Up lets you continue to threaten. If you readied an action that goes off after the spell.

The Exchange

While my first thought on reading the feat was that it was largely useless and just a feat tax going into the second level, it occurred to me later that doing so is purely a result of thinking like this is PF instead of its own game with its own play styles.

While the feat is weaker than the PF version in SF the same abilitiy is many times better. Casters are still a consideration, but less of on since no one is more powerful than say a magus, and this feat is less of a problem for them. But don't forget that a lot of enemies can be expected to be ranged, I don't have any NPCs to go off of but if the percentage is along the same lines as the PC classes then I'd say at least 50% or more. With this feat your ranged opponent has three options, they can either shoot, and get hit by you, which is a bonus attack for you followed by your own full round. They can take a guarded step back, shoot once, and then get hit by you on your full round since you got to stay adjacent for free. Or they can pull out their backup melee option and try to beat your character at his own game.

Really I think this is an anti gun option not anti spell. The next level makes it both, and if you take the tripping feat and something like a tac-lash then they can't even just walk away to be free from you.

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