Guns... lots of (viable) guns.


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Magazine-shaped and -sized batteries seems like a simple solution for energy weapons. Easy quick change in combat, then you can plug them into a charger later. For weapons with a bigger power draw, maybe a backpack-mounted generator.


We know energy weapons have ammo - quite limited, at least in some cases (6 shots seen).

I think I have heard mention that recharging is one of the functions of the party starship.


Jimbles the Mediocre wrote:
Torbyne wrote:
I agree with what you are saying but then how do you make Sniper weapons feel like something other than any other rifle?

Sniper rifles could be distinguished from longarms in any of the following ways:

  • takes a full round to fire
  • single attack (no auto-fire)
  • operative may use sniper rifle for trick attack at high levels
  • large range increment
  • short range penalty
  • bonus from prone and/or penalty for not firing while prone

    I agree that an "auto-kill" or a guaranteed one-shot kill is not a terribly fun concept when attached to someone's main weapon. Pathfinder relegated it to a few spells (save or die) and the coup de grâce action (which is almost always performed out of combat), and I would assume Starfinder does something similar.

  • I think it would be kinda cool for it to be unwieldy or something but if the sniper class weapons were the only way to get called shots without penalty and maybe at higher level get the assassinate ability with requirements or something


    You know there will be a black market at some point for the space version of "solid uranium core tephlon coated uber penetration" rounds they always have in the movies. Like Showtime's guns and then also like that sniper in Trigun's gun.


    JRutterbush wrote:
    Steven "Troll" O'Neal wrote:
    plus one that targets kac.
    Can we please, please all agree to call them EC and KC, just right from the start? I know how gamers are with acronyms, and I do not relish the thought of having a rowdy group of players shouting about their KAC at the table all night.

    Seconded


    EC/KC much better terms i think, i will try to push them as well.

    Sniper weapons, "Only an operative with the exploits for it is at all likely to get an instant KO with a sniper rifle (against a threatening opponent, anyone could assassinate a soft target if they were good enough), though anyone with proficiency could use it to attack from the distance." i take this to refer to the Operative talent to add Trick Attack to a Sniper weapon? It sounds like Sniper weapons are defined by larger than normal for their tier dice pools and slow firing, big pool of weapon dice + big pool of Trick Attack dice = chance to KO a big threat? Are no other classes innately proficient with sniper weapons since only the Operative calls them out as a group? It feels weird that only the one class knows how to use a scope... you'd think a bolt action/slower firing rifle would be easier to use than a more complex automatic one but this is also crazy space tech so...

    Been thinking about how much fun specialist ammo and weapon mods could be. A fusion or special build gun that charges a physical projectile, ionizes a path following the bullet and adds an eletric discharge, some extra D6s of electricty to every hit. Or payload weapons that deliver toxins or alter physical damage to acid/napalm etc. exploding rounds that deal splash damage to surrounding squares? What about armor piercing bullets that come in tiers of their own, type 1 reduce weapon damage by 1D6 but ignore 8 points of Hardness/DR, Type 2 reduce by 2D6 and ignore 12 and Type 3 reduce 3D6 but ignore 18. I dont know what the scales for hardness will be but effectively lets you use a move action to modify a weapon for a specific threat but isnt so good that you'd use them for every shot.


    EAC and KAC seem to be the official terms, no reason to change it


    Seisho wrote:
    EAC and KAC seem to be the official terms, no reason to change it

    I think the idea is that at the table they would be pronounced as words instead of spelled out, "eek!" and "cack" respectively and at least one of those is very close to an inappropriate word to be using in public spaces or would derail a table over crude humor, using EC and KC as the spoken shorthand is a quick and easy fix to stop that from happening.

    Scarab Sages

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    Seisho wrote:
    EAC and KAC seem to be the official terms, no reason to change it

    The concern is someone shouting out "I rolled a 20 to hit cock!"


    A weema-way, a weema-way, a weema-way, a we-BOOM HEADSHOT


    Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
    Torbyne wrote:
    Are no other classes innately proficient with sniper weapons since only the Operative calls them out as a group? It feels weird that only the one class knows how to use a scope... you'd think a bolt action/slower firing rifle would be easier to use than a more complex automatic one but this is also crazy space tech so...

    Soldiers are proficient with sniper weapons as well as operatives.


    Tie Len wrote:

    My current questions stand more around the concept of ammunition. After all, will energy weapons need a simple recharge? Could this be done at a civilian terminal or will there need to be adaptors?

    What about solid projectile weapons in that instance? Will they be similar to the guns from Mass Effect which just need solid matter?

    In my current games of Pathfinder I tend only to track my players when they use special ammunition. However I have also used that to create dramatic tension, having it run out mid-battle.

    Will anyone else be tracking ammo for their players?

    I've never played a game where tracking ammo fell to the DM. It's always been up to the players. That said, I've known players that after the fact revealed that they were never tracking it. I tend to regard that as excessively poor behavior.


    Ouachitonian wrote:
    Magazine-shaped and -sized batteries seems like a simple solution for energy weapons. Easy quick change in combat, then you can plug them into a charger later. For weapons with a bigger power draw, maybe a backpack-mounted generator.

    I'm hoping for this but also a scaling of ammo costs as guns get better. But reloading should be simple unless it's some hand cranked lasmusket.

    Fardragon wrote:

    We know energy weapons have ammo - quite limited, at least in some cases (6 shots seen).

    I think I have heard mention that recharging is one of the functions of the party starship.

    I'm hoping so, for energy weapons al least. But solid projectile weapons will be another matter. Will the game favour energy weapons for ease of use (a low hassle choice) but make solid projectile weapons more powerful as a result of having to buy and haul ammo... not to mention that they won't work in a vacuum.

    Wikrin wrote:
    Tie Len wrote:

    My current questions stand more around the concept of ammunition. After all, will energy weapons need a simple recharge? Could this be done at a civilian terminal or will there need to be adaptors?

    What about solid projectile weapons in that instance? Will they be similar to the guns from Mass Effect which just need solid matter?

    In my current games of Pathfinder I tend only to track my players when they use special ammunition. However I have also used that to create dramatic tension, having it run out mid-battle.

    Will anyone else be tracking ammo for their players?

    I've never played a game where tracking ammo fell to the DM. It's always been up to the players. That said, I've known players that after the fact revealed that they were never tracking it. I tend to regard that as excessively poor behavior.

    Same trouble as me then! But this simply incurs DM wrath through hidden dice rolls.


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    Tie Len wrote:
    not to mention that they won't work in a vacuum.

    Why wouldn't they? Since roughly the 15th century, firearms didn't need atmospheric oxygen for ignition. Firearm ammunition/powder generally contains oxidiser within it for centuries by now so they can easily work in vacuum.

    Given that real life humans could do it back with 15th century firearms, I fail to see any reason for sci-fi people with magitech to be unable to shoot projectile weapons.


    There gets to be a point where i dont expect players to track arrows though, once they have extra-dimensional quivers, letting them say they bought a few hundred arrows in town for a price so minute that they barely need to track it i dont see the need to track. though weapons that need reloading, a repeating crossbow or seemingly every ranged weapon in Starfinder, i expect magazine/charge remaining will be more important. Do we know yet what kind of action it is to reload?

    Glad to know Soldiers can be marksmen too.


    Mashallah wrote:
    Tie Len wrote:
    not to mention that they won't work in a vacuum.

    Why wouldn't they? Since roughly the 15th century, firearms didn't need atmospheric oxygen for ignition. Firearm ammunition/powder generally contains oxidiser within it for centuries by now so they can easily work in vacuum.

    Given that real life humans could do it back with 15th century firearms, I fail to see any reason for sci-fi people with magitech to be unable to shoot projectile weapons. [/QUOTE

    Well I'll be damned. Recoil must still be a concern though?


    Tie Len wrote:
    Mashallah wrote:
    Tie Len wrote:
    not to mention that they won't work in a vacuum.

    Why wouldn't they? Since roughly the 15th century, firearms didn't need atmospheric oxygen for ignition. Firearm ammunition/powder generally contains oxidiser within it for centuries by now so they can easily work in vacuum.

    Given that real life humans could do it back with 15th century firearms, I fail to see any reason for sci-fi people with magitech to be unable to shoot projectile weapons.
    Well I'll be damned. Recoil must still be a concern though?

    Yeah, recoil is a thing, but you could just compensate for it with some form of fancy jetpacks.

    The bigger concern than recoil is that a bullet will fly forever. If you're orbiting a planet and fire around yourself, the bullets will become dangerous orbital junk.

    Liberty's Edge

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    Dangerous orbital junk.


    Mashallah wrote:
    Tie Len wrote:
    Mashallah wrote:
    Tie Len wrote:
    not to mention that they won't work in a vacuum.

    Why wouldn't they? Since roughly the 15th century, firearms didn't need atmospheric oxygen for ignition. Firearm ammunition/powder generally contains oxidiser within it for centuries by now so they can easily work in vacuum.

    Given that real life humans could do it back with 15th century firearms, I fail to see any reason for sci-fi people with magitech to be unable to shoot projectile weapons.
    Well I'll be damned. Recoil must still be a concern though?

    Yeah, recoil is a thing, but you could just compensate for it with some form of fancy jetpacks.

    The bigger concern than recoil is that a bullet will fly forever. If you're orbiting a planet and fire around yourself, the bullets will become dangerous orbital junk.

    Hooray! Flintlock railguns for everyone!


    Mashallah wrote:
    Tie Len wrote:
    not to mention that they won't work in a vacuum.

    Why wouldn't they? Since roughly the 15th century, firearms didn't need atmospheric oxygen for ignition. Firearm ammunition/powder generally contains oxidiser within it for centuries by now so they can easily work in vacuum.

    Given that real life humans could do it back with 15th century firearms, I fail to see any reason for sci-fi people with magitech to be unable to shoot projectile weapons.

    There's also weapons whose ammo isn't explosive. Something like a gauss rifle, that uses magnets to accelerate a solid slug of ferrous metal, or plasma guns that superheat a bit of plastic or something and spray it out, etc.


    Shisumo wrote:
    Dangerous orbital junk.

    You have made me weep with joy sir.

    Mashallah wrote:
    Tie Len wrote:
    not to mention that they won't work in a vacuum.

    Why wouldn't they? Since roughly the 15th century, firearms didn't need atmospheric oxygen for ignition. Firearm ammunition/powder generally contains oxidiser within it for centuries by now so they can easily work in vacuum.

    Given that real life humans could do it back with 15th century firearms, I fail to see any reason for sci-fi people with magitech to be unable to shoot projectile weapons.

    Exactly this.

    As well, in the future perhaps gundpowder as we know it has been replaced completely with a different common, stable explosive compound. One that bonds easily so does not require a case, reacts 100% clean and requires no oxygen whatsoever.

    Or magnetic accelerator weapons that need no chemicals at all. The future is bright with destructive possibilities.

    SCIENCE!


    .... sniper this, sniper that.

    give me this the big nasty
    and I'll take out your sniper, the jerk behind him and then your sniper rifle.

    and that brick wall you are hiding behind wont help///

    anyone want to spoil me if AM rifles are in SF?


    Steelfiredragon wrote:

    .... sniper this, sniper that.

    give me this the big nasty
    and I'll take out your sniper, the jerk behind him and then your sniper rifle.

    and that brick wall you are hiding behind wont help///

    anyone want to spoil me if AM rifles are in SF?

    The link doesn't work.


    The gun he linked and its bullets (They're the one on the left.)


    there is always a bigger fish...

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denel_NTW-20

    And its bullets

    http://imgur.com/OG8JtSu


    always a bigger gun, not really the point.
    AM and sniper riffles are one hit one kill weapons.( unless you can kill 2 with one shot hahahahahahaha). thing is, to get one and use it in a rpg type of game, would still take alot of skill points to even get that.

    and lets not even get into a discussion on the futility of head shots...

    oh and I do know taht you can 1 shot 2 kill with a am/sniper


    I'm not sure that sniper rifles have to be OSK weapons. After all, pretty much any modern military rifle will one-shot a human, and we certainly aren't expecting all longarms to be OSK weapons.


    Well, the thing is I would consider the osk to be a modified coup de grace. The target is ideally unaware of your presence, and you most certainly aren't pressed for time to the same extent as someone in combat proper. Really, my guess is that sniper weapons are intended for support fire. Heck, with the ranged aid another options you could probably park the operative "offscreen" and just have them roll to boost defenses or attacks for an entire encounter, or an exocortex mechanic with sniper proficiency if you'd prefer.


    "."


    any rifle modern combat or not can 1 shot a human.
    but sniper rifles tend to come with a long range scope and usually have accuracy and range ( for an example of 900 yards)

    think assassin's death attack for a sniper's shot////


    If you are talking RL, you can one-shot a human with a hat pin if you know where to insert it.


    Gilfalas wrote:

    Exactly this.

    As well, in the future perhaps gundpowder as we know it has been replaced completely with a different common, stable explosive compound. One that bonds easily so does not require a case, reacts 100% clean and requires no oxygen whatsoever.

    Or magnetic accelerator weapons that need no chemicals at all. The future is bright with destructive possibilities.

    SCIENCE!

    I'd love to see magnetic fire guns, or electronically fired ceaseless rounds. I used to play a lot of Shadowrun and the wide variety of guns, ammo and mods was staggering. Half our playtime was dedicated to arms smuggling and crafting.

    There has been a little bit here and there mentioned about the crafting system with the universal polymers. But have they mentioned craft skills yet?


    Tie Len wrote:
    Gilfalas wrote:

    Exactly this.

    As well, in the future perhaps gundpowder as we know it has been replaced completely with a different common, stable explosive compound. One that bonds easily so does not require a case, reacts 100% clean and requires no oxygen whatsoever.

    Or magnetic accelerator weapons that need no chemicals at all. The future is bright with destructive possibilities.

    SCIENCE!

    I'd love to see magnetic fire guns, or electronically fired ceaseless rounds. I used to play a lot of Shadowrun and the wide variety of guns, ammo and mods was staggering. Half our playtime was dedicated to arms smuggling and crafting.

    There has been a little bit here and there mentioned about the crafting system with the universal polymers. But have they mentioned craft skills yet?

    Yeah. I forget the exact details, but there are three skills, handling machines, magic, and biological systems. The skills all seemed to double as other useful stuff- knowledge checks and the like.


    Steven "Troll" O'Neal wrote:
    Well, the thing is I would consider the osk to be a modified coup de grace. The target is ideally unaware of your presence, and you most certainly aren't pressed for time to the same extent as someone in combat proper. Really, my guess is that sniper weapons are intended for support fire. Heck, with the ranged aid another options you could probably park the operative "offscreen" and just have them roll to boost defenses or attacks for an entire encounter, or an exocortex mechanic with sniper proficiency if you'd prefer.

    This sounds more like a job for critting instead of OSK mechanics like Coup De Grace. A crit could represent the target being completely unaware and being open for an attack, sometimes. Even then, the base damage of it alone is probably enough for a normal human being to die from (most NPCs).


    I mean if Coup De Grace is even still a thing in Starfinder and it works like it did in Pathfinder it is in essence a crit anyways, just one that carries an extra rider.

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