PFS Rogue build advice request


Advice


Having recently returned to PFS from a fairly long break, I decided that I wanted to try out a sylph scout type of character, but having mostly only played arcane casters, I'm not entirely sure if my build attempt at this is going to be good enough at combat in order to actually be useful at higher level combat scenarios, since I heard that rogues in Pathfinder tended to have accuracy issues.

Spoiler:
Sylph(Breeze Kissed, Like the Wind, Whisperwind) :

Rogue (Scout, Thug) 1-3
Slayer 1-2
Rogue 4-10

Favoured Class: Rogue
Favoured Class Bonus: +1 skill point

Str: 8 (-2)
Dex: 19 (13)
Con: 12 (5)
Int: 14 (2)
Wis: 12 (2)
Cha: 10 (0)

Feats:
1: Toughness
(1)Rogue 1: Weapon Finesse
3: Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Elven Curve Blade)
5: Iron Will
(5) Slayer Trick (Combat Style [Two-Handed]): Power Attack
(6) Rogue 4 Talent: Cornugon Smash
7: Airy Step
(8) Weapon Training: Weapon Focus (Elven Curve Blade)
9: Wings of Air
11:

Rogue Talents:
Rogue 2:
Rogue 4: Combat Trick (Cornugon Smash)
Rogue 6: Weapon Training (Elven Curve Blade)
Rogue 8:
Rogue 10:

Rogue's Edge:
5:
10:

Combat wise, this is my core build, but I'm simply not sure what else I should be picking, and even to some extent whether the things that I've already thought were important enough to take are actually good choices.

Scarab Sages

What you have looks fine to me. Accuracy can be an issue. Having Dex to hit and only using a single Weapon helps that. I would consider fitting Furious Focus into the build, since you're going with Power Attack. Make sure to pick up whatever items you can to help your to-hit (Ioun stone for +1 competence, keep a potion or scroll of heroism on hand for big fights, etc).

The 8 STR might be an issue for encumberance. A Mithral chain shirt is 12.5 pounds. An Elven curved blade is 7 pounds. That leaves you 6.5 pounds for the rest of your equipment. A Handy Haversack is 5 pounds, leaving 1.5 pounds of other equipment that is not in the haversack.

First and second level are going to be rough, with a penalty to damage and likely a d6 weapon (something finesseable, like a Shortsword or rapier).

Grand Lodge

I would take my first level as slayer for the increased starting HP. You might also reconsider Cornugon Smash...with only a 10 Cha, your intimidate won't be all that intimidating.

If you are aiming for flight, you might switch to a more ranged combat oriented build and snipe away at people from the skies.

Scarab Sages

I thought about recommending a Slayer level early. With an 8 STR, though, Slayer at level 1 would be painful. +0 to-hit/-1 damage. Or +1/+0 with studied target. I guess you could take advantage of the rebuild rules and take finesse as the level 1 feat, then swap it out before playing at level 2. That makes it slightly less painful. It still delays dex to damage until level 4, and that's an important part of making this build not feel weak.

I just went through levels 2 and 3 on an Unchained Rogue with a Snakebite Brawler dip at level 1. But I took a 13 STR and GM credited the character to level 2. Also, it was two levels of Emerald Spire, so I only had to put up with not having Dex to damage for two games. Power attack at level 1 and 2d6 sneak attack at level 2 also kept the +1 damage from STR from feeling underwhelming. Now, at 4th, damage will jump from 1d8+4 (w/power attack) to 1d8+12 (w/ 20 DEX, Power Attack, and a +1 Elven Branched Spear) and 3d6 sneak attack with Gang Up helping me get flanking and the Dirty Fighter trait adding another +1 damage with flanking for 1d8+12+3d6 a good bit of the time.

The posted build would be +4 to-hit at level 1, +5 when masterwork becomes affordable, and 1d6-1 damage. That goes to +6/1d6-1 at 2nd. So getting a sneak attack is incredibly

3rd level leaps to +7 to-hit, 1d10+7 damage +2d6 with a sneak assuming a +1 weapon.


How are you getting Cornugon Smash?

Has a feat tax of Power Attack which requires a 13 STR.

If you have the Dragon Empire book, there's a trait in their that gives a +1 bonus when making a attack with flank. Think it's called something like Militia (maybe?) and is a regional trait. Will help some with accuracy.


Cornugon Smash also only works when you power attack which as a 3/4 bab class is always going to be tricky. I assume you qualiy with the slayer talent and two handed combat style.

With cha of 10 and nothing boosting your intimidate skill you are not likely to get much from it. I would dump charisma and take the bruising intellect trait to use Int instead.


I was thinking about Slayer at level 1, but I really don't want to delay Dex to damage. Level 1 is mostly irrelevant since I can use a much higher strength setup there, and I think I can tolerate 3 scenarios on the way to 3, but 6 might be pushing it. 1HP and slightly more flexible skill points overall probably isn't worth the hassle.

I also haven't really decided on traits yet, but if I need a better intimidate score, I recall there being one that let you use your intelligence for the purpose of intimidate. I could switch int to 16 and con to 10, then change from +skill points as my favoured class bonus to +hp and use that trait + an int headband of some sort later on to help boost intimidate a bit. I'm not exactly sure what benchmarks I should be trying to hit though.

Also, power attack is actually the entire reason behind dipping slayer. Ranger combat style feats allow you to ignore their prerequisites, and the two handed style allows power attack as one of its options.

Furious focus is an interesting option though. I'm not sure how I'd fit it in though. Would my will saves be acceptable even if I delayed Iron Will until 11 and picked up Furious Focus in its place?

The equipment weight issue does seem quite significant though. I guess I'll think about increasing strength a bit, but I'm not entirely sure what I'd drop for it, the only thing that makes much sense as an alternative is charisma since I'm pretty MAD as is given that I need Dexterity, Constitution, Intelligence and Wisdom.


Something to remember, ranger feats bypass the requirement for that feat, but not feats that depend on it. So furious focus for example would still need 13 str to take, unless you were getting it via ranger feat too.

Scarab Sages

Chess Pwn wrote:
Something to remember, ranger feats bypass the requirement for that feat, but not feats that depend on it. So furious focus for example would still need 13 str to take, unless you were getting it via ranger feat too.

Ah, good catch. For some reason, I thought it only listed Power Attack as a prerequisite. So Furious Focus is off the table.


Why not stick with Rogue and get the 13 Strength? Having low strength is actually quite detrimental throughout your career, particularly since you want to be carrying gear easily enough without going over your light load encumberance, which you're not going to be able to do with only 8 strength. Any rogue worth their salt is going to want equipment, and you have 2 levels to deal with that will be pretty painful without power attack. Moreso, get Exotic Weapon Proficiency early or don't bother and go with a rapier. Get Toughness at 3rd instead. Early levels will kinda suck for health (welcome to low con race choices for martials), but you'll want Weapon Focus at 2nd and can get Toughness at 3rd, then take Combat Trick for Power Attack at 4th. You'll be nice and set for some time then. Look at the edit

Secondly, you want to look for ways to get sneak attack more easily at later levels. My personal recommended build for Scouts is using Stalker Talent advanced rogue talent to get Up Close and Personal from the vigilante talents, which allows you to make a swift action attack as you tumble through a creature's space and get sneak attack. This usually means you move about 10 feet, so once you have tumbled you can then use your standard action to proc Skirmisher with an attack action. Combining this with Vital Strike, you have a good amount of damage, even though you need to invest HEAVILY into Acrobatics to get it all to work, and probably the Acrobatics skill unlocks just to be safe. To be doubly safe, get Slow Reactions to never provoke while tumbling even if you fail, and may Certainty if you can fit it.

I had a more detailed build somewhere but I didn't check if it was PFS friendly, but Stalker Talent is PFS legal apparently, (According to Archive of Nethys, anyway) so I would take that opportunity to really make good use of it!

Edit: And then I remember that Exotic Weapon Proficiency has a +1 BaB requirement. EURGH. Life is so much harder for races other than half-elves....

Oh well, get Power Attack at second and just go swinging a rapier or something. At least picking up Toughness at 1st will keep you alive and once 3rd rolls around for proficiency, you can just get weapon focus at 4th. I guess it's not too bad.


Be an unchained rogue. They are vastly better. If you don't have unchained , take a coin jar to the bank and get it.


Since they've listed Rogue's Edge and Weapon Finesse at first along with Toughness, they are Unchained.


Garbage-Tier Waifu wrote:
Since they've listed Rogue's Edge and Weapon Finesse at first along with Toughness, they are Unchained.

Ahh i see, they have weapon finesse FROM the rogue not that they're taking it. Got it.

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