Offensive Oiling of Others


Rules Questions


1. Is there an advantage to using potions over oil, asside from interactions with build elements involving drinking liquids?

2. Can you forcefully oil someone against their will?

3. If yes to 2, would it be an "armed" unarmed touch? (Would still provoke for oil usage...)

4. Is it a problem that oiling an unconscious creature is harder than oiling an object or a conscious creature?


Anyone? Aggravated your alliteration alergy?


Applying an Oil is a Standard Action that provokes an Attack of Opportunity, which an enemy can make against the flask of oil. Given their fragility, this makes it fairly hard to effectively pull off as an offensive technique. Other than that, though, I see nothing in the rules limiting the use of oil to willing targets (although we do get the line about it taking longer to apply to unconscious creatures), particularly because the list of which spells can be made into potions/oils is pretty broad.

Sovereign Court

1) Some alchemist powers specifically work with potions, like Alchemical Allocation.

2) I don't think rules exist for that. In fact it's fairly ambiguous if you can oil conscious creatures at all. We only have rules for applying oils to objects and unconscious creatures.

Potions wrote:

The person applying an oil is the effective caster, but the object is the target.

...

Likewise, it takes a full-round action to apply an oil to an unconscious creature.

3) N/A.

4)

Potions > Activation wrote:
A character can carefully administer a potion to an unconscious creature as a full-round action, trickling the liquid down the creature's throat. Likewise, it takes a full-round action to apply an oil to an unconscious creature.

Clearly this is intentional game design to make both delivery methods equally effective.


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This so belongs in the grappling succubus thread lol.


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Starfinder Charter Superscriber

I have no answers, but have to applaud you on the best thread title I've seen in a long, long time.

Dataphiles

Pathfinder Adventure, Maps, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Wouldn't it be similar to applying Holy Water?

From the PRD wrote:


Holy water damages undead creatures and evil outsiders almost as if it were acid. A flask of holy water can be thrown as a splash weapon.
Treat this attack as a ranged touch attack with a range increment of 10 feet. A flask breaks if thrown against the body of a corporeal creature, but to use it against an incorporeal creature, you must open the flask and pour the holy water out onto the target. Thus, you can douse an incorporeal creature with holy water only if you are adjacent to it. Doing so is a ranged touch attack that does not provoke attacks of opportunity.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I'm not so sure you get to choose what is a potion and what is an oil. I think it is determined by the target of the spell. Spells that target object are oils rather than potions, and spells that effect creatures end up being potions rather than oils.

Barkskin would be a potion. Magic weapon would be an oil. Invisibility could be either.

From the Magic Items chapter of the Core Rulebook:

The drinker of a potion is both the effective target and the caster of the effect (though the potion indicates the caster level, the drinker still controls the effect).

The person applying an oil is the effective caster, but the object is the target.


Yesssss...

Scarab Sages

If it takes a whole round to apply to an unconscious creature, then I don't think it is possible to apply an oil against a conscious creature against its will without first at minimum pinning them. Even then, it would have to take at least 1 full round for pinned.


Ravingdork wrote:
I'm not so sure you get to choose what is a potion and what is an oil.

Is this an intentional change from your previous stance?

6 years ago you were fine with a monk using clw oils to sidestep a vow.


Ravingdork wrote:
Spells that target object are oils rather than potions, and spells that effect creatures end up being potions rather than oils.

I don't think that's true because the rules also state:

Core Rulebook wrote:
Likewise, it takes a full-round action to apply an oil to an unconscious creature.

This implies that oils can absolutely be used on creatures, not just objects. Although it makes no sense to have a potion of a spell that can only be used on objects, like a Potion of Warp Wood. An Oil of Cure Light Wounds absolutely makes sense, though.

ArmchairDM wrote:
This so belongs in the grappling succubus thread lol.

Oh my...


What a shame that first reply was not made by Lamontius.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
toastedamphibian wrote:
Ravingdork wrote:
I'm not so sure you get to choose what is a potion and what is an oil.

Is this an intentional change from your previous stance?

6 years ago you were fine with a monk using clw oils to sidestep a vow.

It's only natural for people to change and grow. Happens all the time.

That being said, thanks to Nixitur's find, I still hold to my previous stance of six years ago. :P

Nixitur wrote:
Ravingdork wrote:
Spells that target object are oils rather than potions, and spells that effect creatures end up being potions rather than oils.

I don't think that's true because the rules also state:

Core Rulebook wrote:
Likewise, it takes a full-round action to apply an oil to an unconscious creature.
This implies that oils can absolutely be used on creatures, not just objects. Although it makes no sense to have a potion of a spell that can only be used on objects, like a Potion of Warp Wood. An Oil of Cure Light Wounds absolutely makes sense, though.

Very perceptive. Surprised I missed it.


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toastedamphibian wrote:
Can you forcefully oil someone against their will?

Oh, no, sir, plaase PLEASE don't oil me! [shivers]


*Draws Itching Curse Oil*

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