Animal Companion Reach. Diplodocus & Elasmosaurus


Rules Questions

Dark Archive

I have a question regarding reach of quadruped animal companion when the base monster has reach.
I.e. Diplodocus monster is Colossal and it has reach 60. Elasmosaurus is huge and it has reach 20.
However it seems like Diplodocodus and Elasmosaurus companions has no reach beacause both of them are quadruped and quadruped has no rech.

In the CRB, table 8-4 states that large (tall) creatures have a reach of 10', while large (long) creatures have a range of only 5', with the footnote that:
* These values are typical for creatures of the indicated size. Some exceptions exist.

Seems clear that Diplodocus and Elasmosaurus are excepcion because of their large neck. Besides, we can reasonably base a creatures reach on the reach of the original creature, but from a PFS point of view tehere is nothing write thats support this statement.

Is there some errata or FAQ, or anything else to support the reach of these kind of companions?

Scarab Sages

It would certainly make sense for them to have reach, but game mechanics, player logic and real life logic don't always go hand in hand.
I to am curious of the result of this.

Personally I'd compare the diplodocus to "Mokele-Mbembe" (which often is depicted as a sauropod this one should have 10f reach at medium size and 15f reach at large size)(haven't checked if Mokele-Mbembe is pfs legal yet)


As far as I am aware, animal companions do not automatically gain the reach of their bestiary counterparts. Where that falls on the 'oversight' vs 'considered game balance' decision making spectrum I do not know.

Sczarni

Starfinder Charter Superscriber

Animal Companions do get the reach of their Bestiary counterparts, because their is no other source to go off of.

The classic question "What is the reach of a Horse?" should highlight the issue. If your answer is "5 feet", how did you arrive at that answer?

It's because you consulted the Bestiary.

There is no general rule that all Companions get 5 feet, or that all Companions get 10 feet.

We may not have the clearest direction on what to do, but the Bestiaries are required to answer several questions about Animal Companions already, such as the definition of their special attacks. Consulting the Bestiary for reach is not a stretch of the imagination.

Sczarni

Starfinder Charter Superscriber

Also, for PFS, this isn't much of an issue, since Diplodocus isn't legal (most of the exceptional reach Companions are not), and you wouldn't want an Elasmosaurus because it's ill-suited as a land-based Companion.

Scarab Sages

Nefreet wrote:
Also, for PFS, this isn't much of an issue, since Diplodocus isn't legal (most of the exceptional reach Companions are not), and you wouldn't want an Elasmosaurus because it's ill-suited as a land-based Companion.

Well using the "Bestiaries" should note the size differance between the animal companion and the actual "Bestiary monster", a Large Stegosaurus shouldn't have the 15f reach of a huge stegosaurus, but in a home game i could see it having a 10f reach.

As for the Elasmosaurus, true it isn't ideal, but it could be interesting and if theres others in the party of the same speed or slower it helps justify the choice imo.

Sovereign Court

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You can use the Bestiary to determine if a creature is Tall or Long.

Then, assume the companion version of the creature (which may be smaller) is also Tall or Long; it doesn't get a grossly different body shape from being a companion.

Then calculate reach for your companion based on body type.

Dark Archive

Nefreet wrote:
Also, for PFS, this isn't much of an issue, since Diplodocus isn't legal (most of the exceptional reach Companions are not), and you wouldn't want an Elasmosaurus because it's ill-suited as a land-based Companion.

Ok, Diplodocus is just an example. I really want the Elasmosaurus ( I´m playing the chain of modules about pirates in the shackles).

The issue is the Elasmosaurus and diplodoucs are quadruped, so:

pulgoso wrote:

In the CRB, table 8-4 states that large (tall) creatures have a reach of 10', while large (long) creatures have a range of only 5', with the footnote that:

* These values are typical for creatures of the indicated size. Some exceptions exist.

People thinks Elasmosaurus is long, so it has only 5´reach. My point is that Elasmosaurus (and diplodocus) have a long neck, and they use the bite attack, so from natural weapon point of of view both are tall. Therefore they should have reach. I can show the bestiary with their counterparts as proof....

Saddly, I dont have a statement saying "Elasmosaurus is tall..." and some GMs do not accept my point of view. Because of this, I am looking for a source clarifiying reach of companions

Sczarni

Starfinder Charter Superscriber

Ask your GM what the reach of a Horse is, and how they came to that conclusion.

When they tell you, "The Bestiary lists it as...", then you'll have your Elasmosaurus reach.

Sczarni

Starfinder Charter Superscriber

Alternatively, point them to every Snake in every Bestiary.

They all have reach equal to their space.

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