Max weapons sheathed / Samurai Sword Saint question


Rules Questions

Sovereign Court

Ok to give you the background for the question you need to know the Samurai archetype Sword Saint's main ability, Iaijutsu Strike. After you have challenged your foe but before you've attacked your challenged target, you can make a full-round action to strike your opponent with your weapon while pulling it from its sheath. It must be sheathed at the start of your turn. (The bonus which doesn't matter but for those that are curious is +1d6 sneak attack-ish damage)

My question is, if you challenge a target and full-round action to Iaijutsu strike and it kills them (or in later rounds) and you challenge a new target, instead of sheathing your weapon can you just free action drop your weapon and use another sheathed weapon and if so, what is the limit to the amount of sheathed weapons you can have on you?

The only dumb reason I'm asking is because of the Order of the Flame, since Samurai get to pick a Cavalier order you can use Order of the Flame to get multiple challenges within one fight since you get free challenges whenever you down a challenged opponent.

The idea: have like 10+ sheathed swords, challenge, full round action Iaijutsu, kill, glorious challenge, next round, drop weapon, full round action Iaijutsu with a new sheathed sword, kill, glorious challenge, rinse repeat.

Sorry if the post was long, came up with this concept awhile ago and just now got around to asking about it.

Scarab Sages

Maar the Volcano Monk wrote:

Ok to give you the background for the question you need to know the Samurai archetype Sword Saint's main ability, Iaijutsu Strike. After you have challenged your foe but before you've attacked your challenged target, you can make a full-round action to strike your opponent with your weapon while pulling it from its sheath. It must be sheathed at the start of your turn. (The bonus which doesn't matter but for those that are curious is +1d6 sneak attack-ish damage)

My question is, if you challenge a target and full-round action to Iaijutsu strike and it kills them (or in later rounds) and you challenge a new target, instead of sheathing your weapon can you just free action drop your weapon and use another sheathed weapon and if so, what is the limit to the amount of sheathed weapons you can have on you?

The only dumb reason I'm asking is because of the Order of the Flame, since Samurai get to pick a Cavalier order you can use Order of the Flame to get multiple challenges within one fight since you get free challenges whenever you down a challenged opponent.

The idea: have like 10+ sheathed swords, challenge, full round action Iaijutsu, kill, glorious challenge, next round, drop weapon, full round action Iaijutsu with a new sheathed sword, kill, glorious challenge, rinse repeat.

Sorry if the post was long, came up with this concept awhile ago and just now got around to asking about it.

Order of the Flame's bonus challenges could be argued to not count as challenges for this ability (they are glorious challenges, not challenges). Personally, I think it should be fine.

Though regarding your order of operations, I think you'd have to drop the weapon at the end of the turn, to count your weapon as sheathed for the start of the next turn. Not sure there.

As for viability, it's a challenging class ability to use, just because it requires you to have your weapon sheathed at the start of the turn, so you are essentially unarmed and waiting for your opponent to get in range. And as a full round action, means that you can't use it as a readied action, or move prior to attacking. Having "like 10 swords" means that you have to pay more to enhance them - I doubt this will be affordable to have more than 2 or 3 swords when you get to levels where magic damage really matters.

Regarding combinations, it is worth noting that the class doesn't require you to use one of the eastern swords with this ability, so you could potentially combine this with a Longsword, Scimitar, Shortsword, bastard sword, and so forth - the advantage here would be to combine with deity specific, or just other feats, as those weapons have many more feat options than the eastern weapons do.

Additionally, the -4 AC for using this would stack with the Glorious Challenge AC penalty, so the potential to die while using this combination is quite high.

Scarab Sages

I don't see any reason why you couldn't do that, just keep it under encumbrance I guess. There at economic reasons against that build, but it sounds cool.


The answer to your rules question is "It should work fine to do as you describe."

The advice answer you didn't ask for but should know is that it's a terrible plan that isn't going to work well, because the ability remain terrible.

Please keep in mind, that even at 19th level the Iaijutsu Strike only adds 10d6 damage, that is an average of only 35 damage. It also at best only becomes a standard action to perform, meaning that you can never use it with a full-round action.

At 20th level enemies have hundred(s) of HP, Iaijutsu Strike isn't going to be killing enemies in a single blow.

And you will find that that damage you can deal from a single attack will be nearly as much as the bonus damage you get from the Iaijutsu Strike. Think about it like this. A challenge at 20th level lets you deal 20 bonus damage on each attack. Iaijutsu Strike will deal on average only 35 damage. After two attacks in a round, you have dealt more than you would have by using Iaijutsu strike.

Iaijutsu Strike is an okay opening move, once it's becomes a standard action to perform and absolutely terrible before that. Bear in mind that as a full-round action you have to move up to your enemy, not attack, and probably take a round of attacks to the face.

It's really a terrible archetype.

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