Taking damage, using spells, when to use armor and how the check phase is broken down.


Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion


Good morning,

I had recently picked up Pathfinder ACGRotr. The wife and I ran into a few snags last night and i went all over the forums last night and had difficulty finding some answers. I hope someone can answer my questions :-)

1.We had a location with "whenever a blessing is revealed, take 2 points of damage that can't be prevented"
My question is when do i actually take it? Is it immediate and i have to discard right away? Or do i do it at the end of my encounter?

2. We had an ancient skeleton henchmen come up. Under the description it said to summon another. Upon defeat of it i can close down a location. If i kill the first do i still have to encounter the second? If so does that mean the location is still closed but a skeleton is still there to fight?

3. Using armor. When can we exactly use it? I get the impression we have to use it before performing our check and rolling the dice. But lets say i lose a combat check and i am about to take damage could i still use it after a failed roll to prevent the damage still?

4. Holy Light spell encounter. My character didnt have the devine trait. On the spell it says to use divine + 2d6 for your check. Then the second part says to banish it if you dont have the divine trait at all. My two questions for this is if i dont have the trait do i still get to roll a 1d4 + 2d6 for the check? Or do i follow the immediate text after and completely banish it because i dont have the trait?

5. Taking damage and resolving it. Towards the end of the rules "taking damage if necessary" it mentions about if you played a spell to effect the check then you cant play a spell to reduce the damage. Then right after the paragraph it talks about taking damage and players can play cards to prevent it. I feel it completely contradicts what it said prior and now im reading it as you can prevent it if able to. I understand about only being able to play one card type per check step but is taking damage part of the check phase or completely separate phase and i could play a spell to prevent it?

6. Attempting check and break down of steps. Is the attempting the check consider the complete phase, hence i can only play one card type of each till the very end? Or is each individual step considered a phase and i can play one type of card every card(theoretically) on each step such as attempting die roll, taking damage and etc?

7. I had an ally that could add 1d10 to a perception check. If i dont have perception could i have used it at all?

8. Using the characters powers i assume is like using one card type per step or can i use it as much as i need?

I know it's a ton of questions and ive been looking all day for the amswers but am having a hard time. The wife and i absolutely love the game and would love to play it all the way through.

Thank you.


Good afternoon, my good Sir,

Quote:
1.My question is when do i actually take it? Is it immediate and i have to discard right away? Or do i do it at the end of my encounter?

Reveal blessing, take damage, then proceed with your encounter.

2. What do you mean? Did you encountered Ancient Skeleton henchman in your location deck, and then looked at "when closing" requirements? If so, there is "summon and encounter" phrase. Summon means you create a virtual copy of the card and unless you are SPECIFICALLY instructed otherwise, after your encounter summoned card goes right back to the box. And you only can close location when you meet requirements of "when closing" text block. Otherwise, location remains open.

3. You can use cards only one card of each type per step. But "Attempt a check" step says:

Mummy's Mask Rulebook wrote:
After you attempt the check, deal with any effects that were triggered by the check. If any cards played while attempting a check include their own checks, resolve the current check in this step and the new checks in subsequent steps.

So, IF you didn't play armor earlier (there are some armors that help you with passing the checks), AND you were dealt damage, then you may play armor to prevent damage.

Quote:
My two questions for this is if i dont have the trait do i still get to roll a 1d4 + 2d6 for the check?

Yes, exactly.

Quote:
Or do i follow the immediate text after and completely banish it because i dont have the trait?

No, you may use it once, then banish.

Ad.5. It goes the same path as point 3. You may play spells that prevent you from damage ONLY if you haven't played spell earlier in this check step.

6. Read manual carefully. "Attempt a check" consists of playing cards for the check, assembling dice, rolling the dice, all the modifiers after the roll, taking damage after failed roll, and all consequences that card(s) tell you to do after failed/successful check.

7. Yes. You roll d4 +d10 from your ally.

8. Once per step, unless stated otherwise.


Pathfinder Card Game Subscriber

Hi, and welcome to the forums!

Nilfgaard wrote:

...1.We had a location with "whenever a blessing is revealed, take 2 points of damage that can't be prevented"

My question is when do i actually take it? Is it immediate and i have to discard right away? Or do i do it at the end of my encounter?

Yes, you take damage immediately. Furthermore, since the Shrine to Lamashtu was updated (or the Rules were updated themselves?) - the damage is NOT "when you encounter" (as the old wording was) - so you cannot just evade the blessing and NOT take the damage.

Nilfgaard wrote:
2. We had an ancient skeleton henchmen come up. Under the description it said to summon another. Upon defeat of it i can close down a location. If i kill the first do i still have to encounter the second? If so does that mean the location is still closed but a skeleton is still there to fight?

By "the description" , do you mean the location's "To Close" condition? If so: you defeat the first Skeleton; it says you may immediately *attempt to close* the location; to do that, you summon the second skeleton - if you defeat it, that's when the location becomes Closed; if you do not - the location remains open.

Nilfgaard wrote:
3. Using armor. When can we exactly use it? I get the impression we have to use it before performing our check and rolling the dice. But lets say i lose a combat check and i am about to take damage could i still use it after a failed roll to prevent the damage still?

Normally, in RotR you use armor to prevent Combat damage from a failed check (so, after the check). Some monsters however may deal Before You Act damage - in that case, you can still use your armor to prevent it, and then you can you another armor for the Combat damage if you fail the check. (Before/After You Act are different steps of the encounter and armors played during them do not count as "playing armor on your check", for purposes of your combat)

There are some tricky moments - most notably with the Snakeskin Tunic. It says you can reveal it to add 1 to your Dex check - if you do that to boost your Ranger's combat, this counts as playing you 1 allowed armor on the check, so you CAN'T use armor to prevent damage if you fail.

Nilfgaard wrote:
4. Holy Light spell encounter. My character didnt have the devine trait. On the spell it says to use divine + 2d6 for your check. Then the second part says to banish it if you dont have the divine trait at all. My two questions for this is if i dont have the trait do i still get to roll a 1d4 + 2d6 for the check? Or do i follow the immediate text after and completely banish it because i dont have the trait?

Yes, you roll d4+2d6. Then you banish the card.

Nilfgaard wrote:
5. Taking damage and resolving it. Towards the end of the rules "taking damage if necessary" it mentions about if you played a spell to effect the check then you cant play a spell to reduce the damage. Then right after the paragraph it talks about taking damage and players can play cards to prevent it. I feel it completely contradicts what it said prior and now im reading it as you can prevent it if able to. I understand about only being able to play one card type per check step but is taking damage part of the check phase or completely separate phase and i could play a spell to prevent it?

Taking damage is part of the Attempt the Check step. So, you could play a Spell to prevent damage if you didn't play a Spell for you combat (or if it's a spell like Aracne Armor that explicitly says "You may play this spell, even if you played another spell on the check"; or, if you played a Spell for you combat - you can now play armor to soak up the damage, etc..

Nilfgaard wrote:
6.Is the attempting the check consider the complete phase, hence i can only play one card type of each till the very end?

Yes.

Nilfgaard wrote:
7. I had an ally that could add 1d10 to a perception check. If i dont have perception could i have used it at all?

Yes. You would be rolling d4 (your "untrained" Perception) + d10.

Nilfgaard wrote:
8. Using the characters powers i assume is like using one card type per step or can i use it as much as i need

Yes, *except* if the cards has a trigger like "When something happens..." Then you can use the power each time that thing happens.


SimonB and Longshot11 thank you for the welcome and taking the time to answer all of my questions. I really appreciate it. I know it was alot to go through.

I apologize for the wording on my second question but you both did answer my question. Thats exactly what i meant to ask.

Thank you again. I would've replied sooner but website apparently was running into problems.


The wife and I went through another scenario last night and it went much smoother :-) i do have two more questions?

1. With the character seoni. She has two powers. The first is she can discard a card to use her arcane skill for a combat check. Then at the end of it it says to treat it as a spell. Then her second power i can recharge a spell instead of discard. I assume i can use both in a row since the first description states to treat it as a spell? Even though its listed as a power?

2. Is revealing a card considered playing it? I was using valeros and his power is i can recharge a weapon card whenever i play a weapon. Or do i have to discard it to consider played it?


Pathfinder Card Game Subscriber
Nilfgaard wrote:
1. With the character seoni. She has two powers. The first is she can discard a card to use her arcane skill for a combat check. Then at the end of it it says to treat it as a spell. Then her second power i can recharge a spell instead of discard. I assume i can use both in a row since the first description states to treat it as a spell? Even though its listed as a power?

Seoni's second power is not relevant to the first one.

That second power allows you to "automatically recharge a spell with the Arcane trait" - however, you must have been granted a legitimate opportunity to Recharge. So, even if you discard a spell for her first power - this is NOT "playing the spell", it's playing Seoni's power. So you disregard any powers on the discarded spell, including the "You may attempt a check to recharge..."
The first power's "This counts as playing a spell" is relevant to your "one card per type per step" limitations, and also for some other effects (look for the "When/If you play a spell..." wording), especially magic-immune or resistant monsters ("You may not play spells with the Attack trait", "Before you play a spell with the Attack trait, succeed at an Arcane/Divine check...")

Nilfgaard wrote:
2. Is revealing a card considered playing it? I was using valeros and his power is i can recharge a weapon card whenever i play a weapon. Or do i have to discard it to consider played it?

Revealing IS playing the card.

However, Valeros' power is (smth like): "When you would discard a weapon for its power, you may recharge it instead". Or at least, this would be the modern wording, maybe it's more confusing in those early heroes. The point is - you only get to recharge the *weapon that you play by discarding it*.
So, if your idea is that you wanted to get rid of some extra weapons - just discard you least desired weapon for its extra die, and the you get to recharge it.


Thank you for the clarification. So we were definitely playing seoni wrong last night. We were using her first power and then using her second. So if i understand correctly it comes down to we have to completely resolve a situation from top to bottom. It goes back to the "cards say exactly what they do and cards cant do something they dont say"

So on that note with Seonis as a character and playing it wrong...its going to be rough for her to do regular encounters for combat checks. Spells dont enable her to keep them in her hand but only to recharge them. Based on that notion i take it she is more of a support character?

Perhaps she relies on milling through her character deck so she always has a spell in hand? Or really has to rely on going after cards to discard for her first power.

Are there any magic users that can fight like valeros with reveal spells? Or is it going to be very common for magic users to have to recharge and discard alot?


Pathfinder Card Game Subscriber
Nilfgaard wrote:
So on that note with Seonis as a character and playing it wrong...its going to be rough for her to do regular encounters for combat checks. Spells dont enable her to keep them in her hand but only to recharge them. Based on that notion i take it she is more of a support character?

Not really. That's how ALL casters work. This is their drawback against fighters, but their spells are also usually more powerful (see how a Basic combat spell had 2d4 damage, while a Basic weapon has a d8).

However, different to other combat casters, Seoni never has to worry about not having a combat spell in hand (we won't mention the couple Fire-immune monsters in higher decks)! You just discard whatever is least valuable in your current hand - and here you're correct that Seoni sees value in picking up random crappy cards - to turn it into fireball! Having that in mind, Seoni could also really benefit from the company of a healer (either a character, or one of the healing allies/items).

As for combat VS support - I've seen a couple of support build for Seoni:
- one player had her have a weapon (Deathbane Crossbow)for combat, pumping points into Dexterity to make her more versatile against Barriers/Closing Requirements
- another player was pumping her Charisma, both to highly specialize her for Ally/To Close checks, and to boost her "fireball" power for combat
- both of those build didn't have a single combat spell in their deck, instead preferring stuff like Clouds/Examine/Evasion spells.


I've never played Seoni with her carrying a weapon.
She's a very reliable fighter, until you run into a Fire-immune monster that is (for that reason her Acid role feat is worthwhile).

Playing her without any kind of healing is painful, though. Father Zantus, Poog(<- that's a promo card), Staff of Minor Healing -- these are your friends.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Card Game Subscriber

Yeah, Zetha has a similar come-to-Iomedae moment when she meets monsters immune to Cold.


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Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Card Game Subscriber

I can't speak for small group (we always play with 4-6 players), but in large group, running from time to time against a monster somehow immune to YOU is quite fun because it breaks the habits and forces you to improvise:
Can I switch place with someone else?
Can someone move that card on the bottom of the location?
Can someone come here and defeat it for me?
Can I just close the whole thing without meeting the baddy again?
Can I just wait here until someone else elsewhere finds the villain?
Can someone lend me a spell for once, yes I know i will banish it, but since M. Bad doesn't like weapons, I'd like to try?
Can someone fetch me a beer?
Can I get that guy with just my bare hands and 6 blessings?
No one wants to help, fine I just discard my whole hand, end turn, reset, and then cry out loud for the healer to stop whatever he was doing and come right here!
Where is that beer?.


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I can't count the number if times casters in our games have managed an absurdly high check using d4s, by means of blessings and bows and the kitchen sink.

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