Looking for suggestions on how to build this character.


Advice


Hello, everyone. I have this concept for a character I'm interested in keeping as a back up for a character I'm currently playing. Level 8, 20 point buy. The concept is that of a rabble rouser, master manipulator, silver-tongued deceiver, an unknown instigator of many a kingdom's civil wars.

To do this, I was thinking high charisma, with diplomacy and bluff as a base. Magic will be needed, likely making heavy use of Sow Thoughts, even going so far as to make that a sort of signature spell for him/her. More in the sense that they use it often and efficiently than mechanically. This one isn't really focused on battle, but should be capable of it, as this is Pathfinder and it will happen at some point. They should be unassuming, yet often gain the trust of others fairly quickly.

Currently between Bard, Mesmerist or Sorcerer. That said, I'm not sure which might be best, and which archetypes may improve the chances of making this a thing.

P.s. Might be interested in going 3 into charlatan rogue to gain early access to rumormonger.

So, how about it? Any suggestions on making such a character?


Kitsune get Sorcerer


Go fey bloodline I'd assume. Seems reasonable, as sorcerer would give more uses of sow thought. Might not be quite as good as humans or other races for bluff, but still solid.


Third Mind wrote:
Go fey bloodline I'd assume. Seems reasonable, as sorcerer would give more uses of sow thought. Might not be quite as good as humans or other races for bluff, but still solid.

Yes Fey bloodline.

Bluff will be just fine if you max it and your CHA mod will be nice. Level 1 you can have +9 to bluff. Sure you can go human for better bluff but I thought you wanted better DCs for your spell Sow Thought.

Kitsune get a FCB for +1 to Enchantment spell DCs. So was trying to maximize the spell you really like. The Kitsune will provide the Highest Save DC to resist the spell.


1 level dip into synthesist summoner with a trait and skill focus can get you 21 bluff at level 1 as well as a whole bunch of skill bonuses to other stuff

Grand Lodge

If you took 4 levels of Unchained Charlatan Rogue you would get full weapon finesse, with dex to damage, and debilitating injury...truckloads of skill points, evasion, 2 rogue talents, 2d6 sneak attack, etc.

Then 4 levels of mesmerist would get you Consummate Liar, 3 mesmerist tricks, 2nd level mesmerist spells, hypnotic/painful stare, etc.

If you want to focus solely on the bluffing and magic side of things start with an 18-20 Cha, rest into Dex/Con to keep you alive.


Bard is an obvious choice. I was also thinking maybe Arcane Trickster. There are some really nice Rogue Talents that would help with this: Honeyed Words and Coax Information. There are others.

There is a very inexpensive Wondrous Item: Mask of the Stony Demeanoer, which gives you a +10 on Bluff Checks to lie.


A lot of great suggestions here. Thank you, everyone! I'm going to see about building out a 4 unchained rogue / 1 Synth Summoner / 3 Fey Sorcerer using kitsune sometime this week and see how that turns out.

I will, of course, have to make sure my DM will allow the Charlatan archetype for the unchained rogue as they technically don't have trap sense to replace, they have danger sense. That said, they're apparently pretty much the same thing, so I don't expect him to mind.


bard will get you more skill ranks and higher totals for things like bluff, stealth, sense motive, sleight of hand, knowledge nobility, knowledge history, etc...

You can make up for most of that with spells, but you won't have many with 3 classes.
Somewhere there is a build that had a bluff in the 50's in the mid levels like you are talking about. I think it was all bard, but it might have had a single level dip in something else. Search should eventually find it.


Instigator Skald.


Eldritch Scoundrel.


Third Mind wrote:

A lot of great suggestions here. Thank you, everyone! I'm going to see about building out a 4 unchained rogue / 1 Synth Summoner / 3 Fey Sorcerer using kitsune sometime this week and see how that turns out.

I will, of course, have to make sure my DM will allow the Charlatan archetype for the unchained rogue as they technically don't have trap sense to replace, they have danger sense. That said, they're apparently pretty much the same thing, so I don't expect him to mind.

danger sense is treated as trap sense for the purposes of trading it out for archetypes

Danger Sense (Ex)

At 3rd level, a rogue gains a +1 bonus on Reflex saves to avoid traps and a +1 dodge bonus to AC against attacks made by traps. In addition, she gains a +1 bonus on Perception checks to avoid being surprised by a foe. These bonuses increase by 1 every 3 rogue levels thereafter (to a maximum of +6 at 18th level). This ability counts as trap sense for the purpose of any feat or class prerequisite, and can be replaced by any archetype class feature that replaces trap sense. The bonuses gained from this ability stack with those gained from trap sense (from another class).

you should also use the other evolution points from the synth summoner level for +8 perception and either +8 sense motive or diplomacy


Hoaxer bard. really great if you play him right. cause being able to use skills to change people mind is NOTHING to using magic and cursed items to boost it.
also very powerfull in combat once you understand you can make at level 5 this nasty thing for real chip
-125 gp via making a cursed dust of Tracelessness, dc 15 fort fail and 3d6 con damage even if you save it's 5d4 rounds of stunned!! in 20 ft spread that is tpk material right there.
(normaly cursed items are rolled when failing to make a specific magic item. the fact you can pick to make it cursed from the start is very powerfull. pick craft cursed wondrius items at level 5 and you got a new set of tools at your desposel)


zza ni wrote:

Hoaxer bard. really great if you play him right. cause being able to use skills to change people mind is NOTHING to using magic and cursed items to boost it.

also very powerfull in combat once you understand you can make at level 5 this nasty thing for real chip
-125 gp via making a cursed dust of Tracelessness, dc 15 fort fail and 3d6 con damage even if you save it's 5d4 rounds of stunned!! in 20 ft spread that is tpk material right there.
(normaly cursed items are rolled when failing to make a specific magic item. the fact you can pick to make it cursed from the start is very powerfull. pick craft cursed wondrius items at level 5 and you got a new set of tools at your desposel)

pretty sure there are already rules for any one to craft specific cursed items.


they hadn't had these rules back then.. still a good option for a rabble ruser cahracter and unlike other who can make cursed items this one has a specific class mechanic to make sure others TAKE the items and or use it.

Dark Archive

The vizier mesmerist is pretty much made for this. A weaker PC option than the fey sorcerer, though.

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