Stealspell and Runes


Rules Questions


Can a Sandman bard steal an above 6th level spell and then use a runestone of power to cast it?

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/wondrous-items/wondrous-items/r-z/runes tone-of-power/

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/bard/archetypes/paizo-bard-arc hetypes/sandman/


no. Runes lets you cast a spell you normally can without using up your slot. No slots means no casting. So a lv1 bard that happened to have a lv5 rune couldn't cast a lv5 spell.


Chess Pwn wrote:
no. Runes lets you cast a spell you normally can without using up your slot. No slots means no casting. So a lv1 bard that happened to have a lv5 rune couldn't cast a lv5 spell.

Is there somewhere that specifies you need to be able to cast the spells first? What I'm reading doesn't say so. I'm hoping it's based on spells known, which Sandman does specify the stolen spell is added to his spells known list.

Grand Lodge

Stealspell wrote:

(Su): A sandman can use performance to steal spells from his foes and add them to his list of spells known. Once the performance is started, the bard can steal a prepared spell or a spell known from another creature with a touch attack as a standard action. [...]

it is always of the highest level that the bard can cast, if possible. The target loses the prepared spell or spell known and the sandman adds it to his list of spells known for as long as the performance continues, after which it reverts to the original recipient. While stolen, the bard can cast the spell using his available spell slots. This use does not consume the stolen spell. If the bard steals another spell while a spell is stolen, the previous spell immediately reverts to its original owner. This ability requires visual components.

Emphasis mine. Spell is always of the highest possible spell the Bard could cast, using his own slots.

Since the bard can't cast anything beyond 6th lvl, unless you house rule Epic progression, he doesn't have any spell slots available to cast anything higher than 6th.

Runestones recharge a spent slot. Bard doesn't have any 7th lvl spells slots, let alone any to recharge.


Stealspell wrote:
The sandman may choose a spell to steal, but if the target does not possess the spell, the bardic performance immediately ends. Otherwise the spell stolen is random, but it is always of the highest level that the bard can cast, if possible.

It reads to me that the highest level clause is for the randomly selected spell. Otherwise, if I choose a spell, do I have to choose one at the highest level I can cast? That doesn't make sense to me. How I read it seems to indicate there is no limit if I choose the spell.

Runestone of Power wrote:
Once per day, a spontaneous caster can draw upon a runestone of power to cast a spell—doing so is part of the spellcasting action, and expends that runestone’s power for the day rather than one of the spellcaster’s actual spell slots for the day.

Runestones don't recharge a slot. It says here their power is directly expended. Nothing is mentioned about needing spell slots.

I apologize if I'm being annoying. I just want to understand how I'm wrong if I'm wrong. Thanks for the feedback! I do appreciate it!

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