Swapping out for the Cleric/Oracle Spell list, using Wis to cast/class features instead of Int, and trading out the removal of the Arcane Spell Failure chance of Light/Medium/Heavy armor with the fighters Armor Training.
Would this be too powerful to cast Divine magic and have a full attack action?
Is there any particular reason why the warpriest doesn't do it for you?
The spiritualist can cast a fair number of cure spells and has the Phantom Blade archetype.
Warpriest only has self-buffing skills and the Ascetic Oracle from Villain Codex had me curious.
The magus spell list is more narrow than the wizard list. I think you would need to make a smaller version of the cleric list.
I think the armor training is a bit much, if you allow advanced armor training. If you make it so that this version of the magus doesn't qualify for Advanced Armor Training it's probably okay.
As well, you should probably reduce down the list available to this "divine magus" as Ciaran Barnes mentions.
I understand you might not like the Warpriest, but that's essentially what you should end up with. Divine casters aren't flashy spell casters for the most part.
Really, you might be better off making a warpriest archetype that trades out some stuff for spell-combat and spell strike.
Warpriest only has self-buffing skills and the Ascetic Oracle from Villain Codex had me curious.
The cleric spell list consists largely of healing spells, numerical combat buffs, and out-of-combat utility/restoration spells. You won't get much mileage out of using spell combat and spellstrike with the cleric spell list unless you somehow get inflict spells.
I think there is room in the cleric spell list for this concept.
I can't offhand think of a first level touch range spell (aside from the inflicts) that would work well, but Spear of Purity (and the Magus Arcana that lets you use ranged touch for spell strike) would be incredible against evil outsiders.
You assume that the character needs to cast an attack spell? There are other ways to use spell combat.
I feel like it would be redundant with the paladin and war priest.
The paladin is a 4-level caster, while the magus and warpriest are 6-level.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think a major difference between between the magus's spell combat and the warpriest's ability to use fervor to cast spells as a swift action is that the warpriest can only target himself with the spell. Thats stops him from helping allies or debuffing/controlling enemies. He can't use fervor for cure wounds or remove paralysis, for command or hold person, or bless or resist energy.
Casting all of your spells on yourself is one way to play a spellcaster, but not the most interesting I think. There is the -2 to attack of course, but it could be fun. A lot of people don't want to play a healer/support type spellcaster because they don't want to miss out on smashing enemies. This class could do the support job and still have an active role (making attack rolls) in the combat.
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Swapping out for the Cleric/Oracle Spell list, using Wis to cast/class features instead of Int, and trading out the removal of the Arcane Spell Failure chance of Light/Medium/Heavy armor with the fighters Armor Training.
Would this be too powerful to cast Divine magic and have a full attack action?
I dont think so, and because the divine spell list tends to be weaker and less flashy than arcane spell lists, should fit about right.
Armor training, Im not sure, but I think it would feel and play much more lime a Cleric/Fighter Hybrid than the Warpriest.
It might be better to allow Touch and Close Range single target spells so Command or Cause Fear can work, although I think Cure/Inflict spells would still be pretty awesome.
You assume that the character needs to cast an attack spell? There are other ways to use spell combat.
My magus will spend as much time casting buffs as he does casting touch spells.
Haste tends to output more damage than anything else I could cast. A divine magus could substitute any number of buffs, include Fervor.
That's why I would prefer a divine magus over warpriest. You have the choice to cast spells what spells to use. Warpriest is self only.
That's why I would prefer a divine magus over warpriest. You have the choice to cast spells what spells to use. Warpriest is self only.
The downside is, the magus has to make a concentration check to cast defensively in melee. The Warpriest does not; swift actions do not provoke.
I think holy or sacred knight would be better names.
There's a lot of cleric spells, even at 0-4, that would be useful for in combat.
So, I had a similar thought at one point while making a custom race for a campaign I was running. I'll link the Google doc with the magus Archetype below, but if you're interested in the full race just ask and I'll see if I can't post that as well.
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I think using the Inquisitor Spell list would be a good fit for this. Would be more balanced than just the Cleric list. Armor training sounds fine for the ASF stuff. I would change there Weapon Prof, for the Cleric as well. This is a flavor thing but has some balancing to it as well. I would even say that they could spend one of their Magus Arcana(you should change the name of this) to gain the first Domain power, and taking it again to get the second power. I would say you limit when you can take this MA, so you need X Levels in Class = to Cleric level that the Domain gives powers. Like only being able to take Advanced Domain MA at/after 6th level if you took healing Domain. Inquisitions could work with this as well as well. I would not give Domain spells.
So is there a way to do an Inquisitor archetype that gives up something for Spellstrike and Spell Combat?
So is there a way to do an Inquisitor archetype that gives up something for Spellstrike and Spell Combat?
Give up judgement, Solo Tactics, and the teamwork feats.
That seems to work.Maybe add something else.
I can't quite put my finger on it, but the warpriest just doesn't excite me. I suppose thats why I'm against using it instead of making a divine equivalent of the magus.
The inquisitor would be a fine place to begin the spell list, but it should still be a unique. The magus has a reduced wizard list, and this class should have a reduced cleric list. The inquisitor has to many "find the infidel" spells for my taste. This class doesn't need that.
The disadvantage in my mind of fervor is that you are limited to casting spells with the caster alone as the target. I think this limits play style, and it's boring. The advantage I can think of is that you can decide between using the point pool for quick casting or for its lay on hands type feature (and most divine classes are given some means to make healing easier0. I would be in favor of fervor if the self-only aspect were lifted.
I can't quite put my finger on it, but the warpriest just doesn't excite me. I suppose thats why I'm against using it instead of making a divine equivalent of the magus.
The inquisitor would be a fine place to begin the spell list, but it should still be a unique. The magus has a reduced wizard list, and this class should have a reduced cleric list. The inquisitor has to many "find the infidel" spells for my taste. This class doesn't need that.
The disadvantage in my mind of fervor is that you are limited to casting spells with the caster alone as the target. I think this limits play style, and it's boring. The advantage I can think of is that you can decide between using the point pool for quick casting or for its lay on hands type feature (and most divine classes are given some means to make healing easier0. I would be in favor of fervor if the self-only aspect were lifted.
I played an inquisitor. The spell list is actually pretty decent and could work for a divine magus. They have some helpful utility spells that would offset the issues the cleric spell list would have.
I feel you on the warpriest. My biggest problem with the class is that they have too many features that feel like bad versions of other class features. I'm not as miffed about the self-only fervor because the most useful combat spells on the cleric list are buffs or heal spells. Fervor also has the major advantage that you can use it with archery.
I wrote up a rough draft of this class on the 8th, and I think I will switch spell combat to a version of fervor that includes the change I mentioned. I have divine versions of the arcane pool and arcane talents (not many yet), plus some stuff involving domains (in the way that inquisitors have inquisitions and warpriests have blessings), but this is all subject to change or removal. Its a first draft after all.
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I've decided on this for now.
-gains diplomacy/knowledge religioun, losses arcana and use magic device.
-4 + int spells per level.
-inquisitor spell list, wisdom class features casting, prepared caster, magus spells per day.
-can pick up a cleric domain instead of a magus arcana
-light armor gets armor training at 3, 7, and 11. No advance.
-medium armor gets armor tainting at 11. Can move at full speed at 7.
-Heavy gets full speed at 11.
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Oh, maybe you could have an Arcana that would let you spend Points from your Pool to heal HP? Like as a swift action you can spend a point from your Pool to heal 1d6. You may spend more points to get more d6s, But you are limited to half your level/use if this ability. You can spend a standard to make this a Touch attack, to affect others.
Basically paladin lay in hands, only to heal more it cost you more?
Unlike paladin, it's not restricted to lawful good and gods either lawful or good.
The arcana would include healing and or harming. My warpriests can't heal themselves.
I'm not a fan of the divine magus getting the ability to move at full speed in medium and heavy armor. Let's not give away the fighter's toys to a class that can cast movement speed buffs on themselves.
They gain ability to cast spells in heavier armors without arcane spell failure.
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I'm still unsure on the Inquisitor Spell List. The Cleric one seems to me to be a better fit, especially if there is an Arcana option to add a handful of spells on.
I also kind of agree, I don't think that options to increase their armor mobility are the way to go. Perhaps instead look at Deity Favored Weapon options unique to the Class/Archetype.
A game I played in tried this, but the broad Cleric list gave it too much oomph. Never really spent game time with that player and character, these are the observations of others.
I would like to see the more finalized form and more kibitzing.
Cherry pick spells from several religious classes.
Drop all combat useless spells.
I don't agree with dropping all spells useless in combat. I think it should have better offensive options than the cleric, but there should be a theme that includes out-of-combat stuff.
The more I work on my version of this class, the less I want to be held to the two original parent classes. The magus is already sort of a fighter-wizard combo, and a fighter-cleric is getting awfully close to a paladin or warpriest. Here's what I have so far.
3/4 BAB, good fort and will, 4 skill points
Bard's spells per day and spells known
Cha-based spontaneous caster
There will be a point pool (level + Cha mod), which will be used to power multiple abilities:
-Instead of a bond with a weapon wherein it gains an enhancement bonus, I used a variant of the divine favor spell. The luck bonus can be spent to add weapon enhancements drawn from a list.
-A variant of lay on hands with the die progression of fervor. Rather than delivering negative or positive energy based on the alignment of the deity, it heals or harms based on how many steps away from the deity's alignment the target is (with some middle ground where the charcater chooses).
-He gains access to the deity's various domains, one domain at a time. In addition to his small number of spells known, he can spontaneously cast spells from those domains' domain spell lists.
-Like the magus, there will be talents that can be chosen. Some of them could allow points to be spent.
I'm still working on a feature than is somewhere between spell combat and fervor. I prefer spell combat's version that requires a full-attack and allows spells cast on others. However, spell combat requires a free hand, and some deity's favored weapons require two hands. Rather than simply allowing any weapons, I want to find a reasonable medium. Still working on this one.
Rather than the magus's ability to expertly cast spells defensively that is gained in a few different class features at different level, I want to do a scaling bonus on concentration checks. Starts at +1 while using "spell combat" and goes up from there.
A list of talents. Yay. My list is still small and haven't expanded it much yet. Typically I like to get the list to a too-long state for brainstorming purposes, and then prune it down later.