Swashbuckler1/InvestigatorX is a strong build (especially if you're going Dex focused), so it looks fine to me.
For tips on where to go, look up "swashtigator" and you should find a lot. There's also a few Investigator guides out there that will probably help with extract chioces, and you could check out some Alchemist guides too if you're super keen (there'll be a lot of double-up, but you might find something interesting).
For skills I'm a big fan of getting some skills maxed leaving at least 1 skill point per level for a random 1-rank skill. As an investigator you should be able to get 1 rank in a whole bunch of skills and still be ahead of most of the people at the table with your maxed-out skills.
As for how much to focus on combat vs skills etc, that's totally up to you. What are you looking to accomplish with this character?
You won't really be a buffer/debuffer with an investigator since your formulae typically only affect one character at a time (even with infusion, though there are sort of exceptions). For the same reason, you aren't a good healer, though having cure formulae on your list is a good idea in emergencies (as well as restoration, etc.), particularly if you leave a few slots of each level open every day (only takes 1 minute to whip up a formula).
Whether or not you take quick study or infusion first depends upon how badly the rest of your party wants to leech off of your formulae. The investigator I play is a NPC filler on a Giantslayer AP campaign, so his sole purpose is to help the team. Infusion came first for him. If you'd rather be a bit greedy, quick study then mutagen (which you could get at 5th level by taking an extra talent for your feat choice).
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I am playing an empiricist investigator in PFS, and one in a home-game AP of Mummy's Mask. They are ninth and eighth level, and pure investigators without the swashbuckler dip. Neither is weak in combat once studied combat/strike came into the picture.
Giuseppe Aldonaldo
Male elf investigator (empiricist) 9 (Pathfinder RPG Advanced Class Guide 30, 100)
LN Medium humanoid (elf)
Init +4; Senses low-light vision; Perception +32
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Defense
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AC 18, touch 13, flat-footed 15 (+5 armor, +3 Dex)
hp 57 (9d8+9)
Fort +7, Ref +11, Will +9 (+4 save vs. illusion and disbelievable effects); +2 vs. enchantments
Defensive Abilities trap sense +3; Immune sleep; Resist unfailing logic
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Offense
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Speed 30 ft.
Melee +1 agile keen rapier +10/+5 (1d6+4/15-20) or
. . mwk cold iron rapier +10/+5 (1d6+1/18-20) or
. . silver cestus +9/+4 (1d4+1/19-20)
Ranged sling +9 (1d4+1)
Special Attacks studied combat (+4, 7 rounds), studied strike +3d6
Spell-Like Abilities (CL 9th; concentration +7)
. . 1/day—comprehend languages, detect magic, detect poison, read magic
Investigator (Empiricist) Extracts Prepared (CL 9th; concentration +16)
. . 3rd—absorb toxicity[UC], bloodhound[APG], displacement, fly, heroism
. . 2nd—acute senses[UM] (DC 19), alchemical allocation[APG], barkskin, darkvision, false life, investigative mind[ACG]
. . 1st—adhesive spittle[ACG] (DC 18), ant haul[APG] (DC 18), comprehend languages, disguise self, expeditious retreat, heightened awareness[ACG], shield
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Statistics
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Str 12, Dex 16, Con 12, Int 24, Wis 12, Cha 7
Base Atk +6; CMB +7; CMD 20
Feats Combat Reflexes, Extra Investigator Talent[ACG], Inspired Alchemy[ACG], Technologist, Weapon Finesse
Traits forlorn, student of philosophy
Skills Acrobatics +10, Appraise +11, Bluff +11 (+20 to lie (as a result of using Int instead of Cha)), Climb +5, Craft (alchemy) +19 (+28 to create alchemical items), Diplomacy +16 (+25 to gather information (You can use your Intelligence Modifier instead of Charisma), +25 to persuade others but not to gather information (as a result of using Int instead of Cha)), Disable Device +27, Disguise +2, Escape Artist +9, Heal +5, Intimidate +2, Knowledge (arcana) +16, Knowledge (dungeoneering) +12, Knowledge (engineering) +13, Knowledge (geography) +11, Knowledge (history) +11, Knowledge (local) +15, Knowledge (nature) +12, Knowledge (nobility) +12, Knowledge (planes) +16, Knowledge (religion) +13, Linguistics +15, Perception +32, Ride +4, Sense Motive +20, Sleight of Hand +7, Spellcraft +15, Stealth +16, Survival +2 (+7 when tracking), Swim +2, Use Magic Device +19; Racial Modifiers +2 Perception
Languages Abyssal, Ancient Osiriani, Azlanti, Celestial, Common, Draconic, Dwarven, Elven, Infernal, Sylvan, Terran, Tien, Undercommon, Vudrani
SQ alchemy (alchemy crafting +9), ceaseless observation, inspiration (13/day), investigator talents (combat inspiration[ACG], enhance potion, expanded inspiration[ACG], mutagen[UM], quick study[ACG]), keen recollection, mutagen (+4/-2, +2 natural armor, 90 minutes), trapfinding +4
Combat Gear boro bead (1st level)[UE], mutagen[APG], oil of daylight, potion of heroism, potion of resist acid 10, potion of resist cold 10, potion of resist electricity 10, potion of resist fire 10, potion of resist sonic 10, potion of shield of faith +2, potion of tongues, wand of create water (50 charges), wand of cure light wounds, wand of endure elements (50 charges), wand of heightened awareness (50 charges), wand of mage armor (50 charges), acid (4), air crystal (3), alchemical grease[APG] (6), alchemist's fire (2), alkali flask[APG] (3), antiplague[APG] (3), antitoxin (3), armor ointment[UE] (3), bladeguard[APG] (3), bloodvine rope[ACG], bloodvine rope[ACG], bloodvine rope[ACG], smelling salts[APG] (3), soothe syrup[APG] (3), soul stimulant[UE] (3), tanglefoot bag (4), weapon blanch (adamantine)[APG] (3), weapon blanch (ghost salt) (3); Other Gear +1 darkleaf cloth lamellar (leather) armor[UC], +1 agile keen rapier, mwk cold iron rapier, silver cestus[APG], sling, sling bullets (10), cloak of elvenkind, cloak of resistance +2, cracked dark blue rhomboid ioun stone, cracked dusty rose prism ioun stone, cracked magenta prism ioun stone, cracked mossy disk ioun stone, cracked mulberry pentacle ioun stone, cracked scarlet and blue sphere ioun stone, first aid gloves, handy haversack, headband of vast intelligence +2, ioun torch ioun stone[APG], lenses of detection, wayfinder[ISWG], alchemy crafting kit[APG], bandolier[UE], bedroll, belt pouch, canteen[UE], chalk, fishhook, ink, inkpen, journal[UE], masterwork backpack[APG], masterwork thieves' tools, silk rope (50 ft.), skillchip mark iii, skillslot (technology guide 38) (worth 2,000 gp), string or twine[APG], trail rations (6), vial (4), waterproof bag[UE], waterskin, 11,513 gp, 7 sp, 2 cp
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Special Abilities
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Alchemy +9 (Su) +9 to Craft (Alchemy) to create alchemical items, can Id potions by touch.
Ceaseless Observation (Ex) Use INT instead of CHA for gather information (+9)
Combat Inspiration (Ex) Applying inspiration to attacks/saves only costs 1 point.
Combat Reflexes (4 AoO/round) Can make extra attacks of opportunity/rd, and even when flat-footed.
Comprehend Languages (1/day) (Sp) With Intelligence 11+, cast Comprehend Languages once per day.
Detect Magic (1/day) (Sp) With Intelligence 11+, cast Detect Magic once per day.
Detect Poison (1/day) (Sp) With Intelligence 11+, cast Detect Poison once per day.
Elven Immunities - Sleep You are immune to magic sleep effects.
Enhance Potion (7/day) A number of times per day equal to his Intelligence modifier, the alchemist can cause any potion he drinks to function at a caster level equal to his class level.
Expanded Inspiration (Ex) Free Inspiration on Diplomacy, Heal, Perception, Profession, Sense Motive (if trained).
Inspiration (+1d6, 13/day) (Ex) Use 1 point, +1d6 to trained skill or ability check. Use 2 points, to add to attack or save.
Inspired Alchemy You can recreate an extract you consumed during the past hour.
Keen Recollection At 3rd level, an investigator can attempt all Knowledge skill checks untrained.
Low-Light Vision See twice as far as a human in dim light, distinguishing color and detail.
Mutagen This discovery gives the alchemist the mutagen class ability, as described in the Advanced Player's Guide. (This discovery exists so alchemist archetypes who have variant mutagens, such as the mindchemist, can learn how to make standard mutage
Mutagen (DC 21) (Su) Mutagen adds +4 to a physical & -2 to a mental attribute, and +2 nat. armor for 90 minutes.
Quick Study (Ex) Use studied combat as a swift action.
Read Magic (1/day) (Sp) With Intelligence 11+, cast Read Magic once per day.
Studied Combat (+4, 7 rounds) (Ex) As a swift action, study foe to gain bonus to att & dam for duration or until use studied strike.
Studied Strike +3d6 (Ex) As a free action on a melee hit, end studied combat vs. foe to add precision dam.
Technologist You are familiar with the basic mechanics of technology.
Benefit: You are considered to be trained in any skill used against a technology-based subject. If the skill in question requires training to use even against non-technological su
Trap Sense +3 (Ex) +3 bonus on reflex saves and AC against traps.
Trapfinding +4 Gain a bonus to find or disable traps, including magical ones.
Unfailing Logic +4 (Ex) +4 save vs. illusion and disbelievable effects
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From Oppara in Taldor.
I made him at the beginning of season 6, so he has the technologist feat; you will probably not get that one.
There are six knowledge skills used to identify creatures, so you might only want to put a few ranks in the others. I have found that perception and use magic device are critical skills and I worked hard to get them up. +19 in UMD means that without penalties, wand activation is automatic and no chance of breaking it for the day.
In combat, 3 ranks of acrobatics lets you hit at -4 and and have +3 armor class. You won't have too much difficulty hitting as your 3/4 BAB and studied combat makes you about as good as a fighter. The feat Crane Style can really help there. You have to watch your buffing, and really use those 10-minute per level ones. Time spent buffing in combat seems really difficult to find.
You will find your fortitude save lacking, and have to find ways to improve it. Heroism is a wonderful 3d level extract.
Studied Combat, Expanded Inspiration and Combat Inspiration combine to give you the Inspiration you need to fight. I like to end Studied Combats with Studied Strike pretty often, but it is precision damage. Before Studied Combat, you may find yourself a placeholder in the Line, but you can get your armor class pretty high, making it somewhat safe. I like to maneuver a lot to provide flanks to my team.
These are thoughts off the top of my head. If you have questions, I'd be happy to respond to them.
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Here is the list I use for finding Guides online. There are others, but I find these very useful to collect my thoughts for character building.
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You can't take Bruising Intellect and Student of Philosophy (they're both Social Traits).
I'd recommend Pragmatic Activator to boost your UMD.
He could take Pragmatic Activator..or he could take something that his class/archetype doesn't already do for him..
A few good traits that aren't social traits that would work well for you
Theoretical Magician - +3 to spellcraft checks (you aren't a spellcaster so you get the +3 instead of +2)
Armor Expert - some day buy a mithral breastplate with no ACP for no penalties.
Accelerated Drinker - drink a potion as a move action if you already have it in hand, works really well with Alchemical Allocation
Oh, and once you get infusion... tears to wine is on your list. Starts at +2 to all INT and WIS skils, goes up to +5 at caster level 9, +10 at CL 15.
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Oh, and once you get infusion... tears to wine is on your list. Starts at +2 to all INT and WIS skils, goes up to +5 at caster level 9, +10 at CL 15.I thought that spell was not allowed in PFS.
You are correct. Tears to Wine is not legal for PFS per the Additional Resources.
I was unaware you were playing PFS.
Because I didn't read the WHOLE title. :)
PFS Investigators get a alchemical crafting for 1/3 cost. Keep sacks of handy stuff to distribute to teammates at the beginning of the scenario. Give them each a list to check off what they consume and replace whatever gets used.
Other PCs can't keep any of it, but they can use it up and you'll replace it for cheap.
I'll edit with my list of stuff my Empiricist hands out.
BTW, I stole this idea from someone on these forums. Can't remember who though.
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Too late to edit my post.
Here's Golek's handouts: https://www.dropbox.com/s/4m5t8q239xiewm4/Alchemical%20Items-Golek%20Bundle .pdf?dl=0
I'm actually glad you posted it here because I don't browse the PFS board normally. Investigator is probably my favorite character (magus ranks high, too), so I like it when people discuss them since guide support is minimal (and not updated to the latest and greatest features). Another interesting build is the questioner, basically a bard that uses INT instead of CHA.
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Other options for Int-focused Investigator-type PFS PCs...
Traits:
Precise Treatment (magic) - use Intelligence with Heal.
Clever Wordplay (social) - use Intelligence with any one Cha-based skill.
Feats:
Additional Traits - allows you to pick up two additional traits.
Kirin Strike - after a few rounds of swift actions, add double your Int bonus to a single melee or ranged attack.
Classes:
Mindchemist (alchemist archetype) - at 2nd level, add your Int x2 to all knowledge checks.
Magical Items:
Investigator's Hat (7k) - +2 knowledge rolls to ID monsters, use inspiration roll with knowledge checks to add to attack rolls.
Inspired weapon enhancement (+1) - either cheaper use of inspiration in combat, or add double inspiration to damage roll.
Race:
Half elf - preferred class bonus +1/4 to all inspiration rolls.
As others have mentioned, though...the 'advice' forum has guides for all sorts of builds, including guides on traits, utilizing stats for 'alternative uses', investigators... Check'm out.
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The heal skill isn't often used to heal hitpoints. It's more often used for helping fight of disease. However, the main reason an Investigator might want a decent heal skill is that it's what's often referenced for determining how a creature was killed. I don't know that it's worth spending a trait to turn it into an INT skill. It's not like you've tanked Wisdom.
I went with a higher INT than DEX on my investigator, but I was very skill focused for the first 4 or 5 levels, and my combat effectiveness suffered. But I still only have a 16 DEX at 10th level and I can buff to be more than just effective in combat. If you want your combat abilities to keep up with other martials, though, the 18 DEX will help.
It is a complicated class, more so than most (to me at least) given the variety of things you have to consider.
Heal skill: unlikely, IMO, but I don't play PFS so I can't be sure.
DEX<-->INT: I'd definitely go with 18 INT, but I like my smart guys to be smart. That's 5 inspiration points per day, which you'll use pretty quickly. That's also an additional +1 bonus to 4 non-INT skills (plus gather information) at level 2 rather than level 4 on top of the +1 to all of your INT skills. Consider that you're trading for +1 AC and +1 reflex saving throw (which is already your highest).
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All you guys are doing is making my decisions harder with all these great options. Lol.
A couple more questions:
Is the heal skill worth worrying about given the prevalence of wand of cure light wounds and so forth?
Would it be a bad idea to swap my DEX and INT to 17 DEX and 18 INT? My intelligence is involved in almost everything, skills, panache, intuition, language. I feel like with that being the case and all the ways I am going to have to boost DEX, that I might get more use of the bonuses from INT being 18.
The use of the Heal skill has been extremely rare for me, but has actually happened. Giuseppe has a rank in it, but I didn't bother to find a way to tie it to intelligence.
I have found intelligence to be incredibly important to Giuseppe and his home-game counterpart, Byron. However, both are single-classed investigators and I don't know how much dexterity you need to work with swashbuckler dips. The way I would 'empirically' try to test is by building a character both ways and leveling it up to about 8th level. A real character will develop differently, I would expect, but you might see some issues you want to address.
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Yeah, a 17 DEX will be fine to start. Like I said, I've got a 16 (starterd at 14), and I've still managed to be better than average in combat (after much planning for buffs, etc). If you're wanting to maximize combat, go with the 18, but you can be very good starting with a lower stat. If I had it to do again, i'd have started at 16 or 17 DEX.
Having my INT where it is (started at 18, up to 22 now, I think) means I can have only 1 rank in most of the knowledge skills, and between Breadth of Experience and Inspiration still be excellent at them. I think he's at +12 base with one rank, +14 with Heroism going, and +16 with Heroism and Heightened Awareness. Plus a d6 Inspiration. And if it's a really skill focused scenario, you can throw Investigative Mind on top to roll twice. Knowledge Local, which I have boosted to max, is at +21 before the buffs. So having a high INT makes it easier to spread skill points around and be good at a lot of things.
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Having my INT where it is (started at 18, up to 22 now, I think) means I can have only 1 rank in most of the knowledge skills, and between Breadth of Experience and Inspiration still be excellent at them. I think he's at +12 base with one rank, +14 with Heroism going, and +16 with Heroism and Heightened Awareness. Plus a d6 Inspiration. And if it's a really skill focused scenario, you can throw Investigative Mind on top to roll twice. Knowledge Local, which I have boosted to max, is at +21 before the buffs. So having a high INT makes it easier to spread skill points around and be good at a lot of things.
You can also add Clear Ears to this and Pathfinder Chronicles (out of combat). Investigators are the kings of cranking skills.
I will just mention this as well. Blood-boiling pill for +2 INIT.
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Yeah, I didn't even get into alchemical items.
I don't personally use clear ear, because I still use Charisma for most of the skills. He was made during the playtest before Empiricist existed. I took a level dip into Sleepless Detective, which lets me add INT on top of CHA or WIS for Sense Motive, Perception, and Diplomacy to gather information. I took Pragmatic Activator to get INT on UMD, but I still use CHA for Bluff. Student of Philosophy would have been a good fit, but I'm not sure it was around yet either. Clever Wordplay probably was. I went with Tireless Logic instead, which lets me roll twice and pick the best once a day on an INT skill. As a gnome, I didn't bother with Intimidate, because of the additional size penalties. I think I've put a few ranks into it for like a +8, and Underworld Inspiration gives me free uses of Inspiration for it, but there's usually someone in the group that's better at it.
For someone tanking CHA, clear ear is great.
Blood-boiling pill is a good one, as long as you aren't anticipating bleed effects. At 25gp apiece and with an 8 hour duration one will get you through a lot of scenarios. I also UMD a wand of Heightened Awareness when I'm in a dungeon crawl. Chances are, you're going to get into a fight in the next 10 minutes in a dungeon. When you do, expend the active spell for the +4 bonus to initiative. In the meantime, make use of the bonuses it grants. Then burn another charge after all the post-fight healing and loot gathering is done.
I've got a long list of alchemical items I carry around. There are some very useful ones out there.
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As a gnome, I didn't bother with Intimidate, because of the additional size penalties.
You're probably aware of this but this doesn't make it clear. It's penalty (singular). You get a +4 bonus if you're larger than your target and a -4 penalty if you're smaller--it's not per size, but just a static ±4.
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I know. I made it work on a Halfling Inquisitor that specialized in Intimidate and just had a high enough bonus to make the penalty insignificant. I just didn't want to put the resources into it on my Investigator. Got to leave one skill for the rest of the party. :) It's definitely possible for an Investigator to be good at Intimidate, along with everything else.
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"Got to leave one skill for the rest of the party." This should be tattooed on every investigator.
I don't even know how to play mine sometimes. Seven person table. I let everyone roll get there information and then roll and get much better 90% of the time. I don't want to roll first and not let them play. It also seems crappy to just sit out.
I can imagine in PFS that's an issue. In home games, parties (ours at least) tend to minimize skills overlap. The investigator really is that good, however. Since I'm the GM playing the investigator, I basically do the same. Any skills the rest of the party doesn't cover, I know ahead of time.
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Hmm... I have a longer list actually printed with the character, but can't find the spreadsheet. Here is a basic package, though.
Item GP Per Qty Cost
Alchemist's Fire 6.67 3 20.00
Acid Flask 3.33 3 10.00
Scent cloak 6.67 1 6.67
Weapon Blanch, Adamantine 33.33 1 33.33
Weapon Blanch, Cold Iron 16.67 1 16.67
Weapon Blanch, Silver 1.67 1 1.67
Antiplague 16.67 3 50.00
Antitoxin 16.67 3 50.00
Smelling Salts 8.33 1 8.33
Soothe Syrup 8.33 1 8.33
Salix, Wismuth 10 1 10.00
Tea, Meditation 10 2 20.00
Tanglefoot Bag 16.67 1 16.67
Thuderstone 10 1 10.00
Tindertwig 0.33 9 3.00
To that, I would add
Item GP Per Qty Cost
Alchemical Grease 5 3 15
Alkali Flask 5 3 15
Anointing Oil 8.33 3 25
Blood-boiling Pill 25 3 75
Clear Ear 5 3 15
Light Detector .33 3 1
Peptus Salix 10 3 30
Soul Stimulent 100 1 100
Twitch Tonic 15 1 15
I'm sure there are others. It's not his main thing, so I don't always keep up to date on the latest alchemical options. I tend to craft the less expensive things in groups of 3 to keep the cost calculation simple, but some items, like Smelling Salts, have multiple uses.
As for what to keep at low levels... I wouldn't go too crazy until you've got some money saved up. The alchemical weapons are good, because of swarms. Smelling Salts. Antiplague and Antitoxin.
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If you are going to make extensive use of alchemical items then I recommend picking up the full pouch extract. Any sort of travel time will allow you to stock up on stuff for the adventure and saves on a significant amount of cash.
Has there been a clarification on that spell yet?
Last I was aware there is so much internal contradiction and confusion that it really wasn't worth dealing with the wild table variations. (Not to mention the still unanswered question of how an alchemist/investigator can use it at all since it is a swift action.)
There's a lot of controversy regarding many formulae on the list. You'll see a device comment about a,strict RAW interpretation, then the next book contains a formula that shouldn't be usable. For PFS, I can imagine it gets interesting.
A developer, not a device.
Cool. I built your concept to 20 myself just to see (in Hero Lab) and I liked it a bit more than my current rapier build (12th level, part 2 of book 4 of Giantslayer AP) in some regards, particularly the free weapon finesse and weapon focus at 1st level. I don't normally like multiclassing, more so with these cross-breed classes like the investigator, but this one doesn't matter as much as I think it does for a class like magus. Besides, you don't get to level 20 in an AP anyway.