Can Arcanist's "Redirect Spell" take control of Summoned creatures?


Rules Questions


3 people marked this as FAQ candidate.

Pardon me if there has been any answer about this before. I've been digging in the forums and elsewhere and I haven't seen this addressed.

Can the Arcanist's Greater Exploit ability "Redirect Spell" be used to take control of an enemy Summon spell (Summon Monster, Summon Nature's Ally, etc.) and then control the summoned creature?

Redirect Spell from Arcanist on Paizo.com:
Redirect Spell (Su): The arcanist can gain control of a spell cast by another spellcaster. As a standard action by expending 1 point from her arcane reservoir, the arcanist can make a caster level check opposed by the creature controlling the spell. If the arcanist is successful, she can direct the spell as a free action for 1 round, making any decisions allowed by the spell. This only functions on spells that can be directed or changed once they have been cast, such as flaming sphere or spiritual weapon. The spell returns to its owner's control at the start of the arcanist's next turn, unless the arcanist expends another point from her arcane reservoir at the start of her turn to extend the duration of control by another round. She can continue to control the spell for as long as the spell lasts, provided she keeps spending points from her arcane reservoir.


Summon Monster spells aren't spells "such as flaming sphere or spiritual weapon," which are the examples of what the exploit gives.

Those spells have specific clauses that state that they can be redirected/changed as a Move Action, which is what it's referring to. Summoned Monsters lack that clause, so it's not feasible.

Spells like Aqueous Orb and Spiritual Ally do have those clauses, so they would be affected by the exploit as well.


Summon Monster I wrote:

Duration 1 round/level (D)

If you can communicate with the creature, you can direct it not to attack, to attack particular enemies, or to perform other actions.

If you can control the summoned creature for any length of time, and you can dismiss it at anytime, you should be able to take control with this exploit.


Dr Styx wrote:
Summon Monster I wrote:

Duration 1 round/level (D)

If you can communicate with the creature, you can direct it not to attack, to attack particular enemies, or to perform other actions.
If you can control the summoned creature for any length of time, and you can dismiss it at anytime, you should be able to take control with this exploit.

Fair enough, but I highly doubt the intent behind the exploit was to take control of summoned creatures.


The summon monster spell can not be changed or directed after it is cast. You cast the spell to transport beings to wherever you are. Then you get to control those beings if you can communicate with them.

Spells that can be directed or changed are spells such as flaming sphere or a spell such as blessing of fervor which can have a different effect every round.

Being able able to control those summons is more like being able to control an undead that is created by animate dead. You would also not get control over any skeletons by that spell if you use this arcanist exploit.

This also needs an FAQ to be more clear about what counts.


wraithstrike wrote:
Being able able to control those summons is more like being able to control an undead that is created by animate dead. You would also not get control over any skeletons by that spell if you use this arcanist exploit.

Not quite the same. Animate dead is instantaneous.

I agree that this needs a FAQ, though from what I can see SM spells should fall under this qualification as duration spells.


Witches and Shamanic types get a hex that allows them to seize control of summoned creatures on a more limited scale than OP is suggesting for the Arcanist Exploit. Adding this to the common interpretation of the exploit, really does charge into the negative definition of Exploit. You are asking for too much from one exploit. If you really want this ability, homebrew a new exploit based on the Hex.


I hit the FAQ button, and Felyn that is a good point, but I also think that the summons are not controlled in the same manner as flaming sphere. Spells that create effects are what I think it was intended for.

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