The Sage (a pseudo-archetype for Bard)


Homebrew and House Rules


This is, AFAIK, completely rules-legal. It is not an official archetype, but resembles one, so I call it a pseudo-archetype.

Sage (Catfolk Bard pseudo-archetype).

Prerequisite: Catfolk race, Int: 18 (to max out the potential - one could be less of a sage with a lower int score).

Skills: Max out all 10 Knowledge skills

*Note that Jacobs intends Knowledge (local) not needing to be sub-specialized, as per this thread:

http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2kdw7&page=2?Knowledge

Favoured Class: Catfolk bards get +1/2 to bardic knowledge.

So what do we gain with this archetype and what do we lose? Let us start with the latter:

Well for one thing, if you put int at 18, presumably that hurts one's other stats on a point-buy system or a "roll dice, assign stats as you see fit" system, so that could affect one's charisma, dexterity, etc.

Also, all of one's 10 skill ranks per level being assigned for knowledge means that none is left for such lovely skills as Perception, Stealth or Perform (but see below).

This also means that Countersong and Fascinate, while not lost entirely, are much less useful to this bard. Also, Versatile Performance loses a lot of its appeal, although if one's charisma bonus is higher than one's wisdom bonus, it can improve one's sense motive, and if one's charisma bonus is higher than one's dexterity bonus, it can improve one's acrobatics and fly. And it is still a way to get a (minimal) access to handle animal, which otherwise is a trained-only skill.

Finally, one can probably forget about using Perform to actually earn a decent living, since while one can still sing, dance, etc., one will be relying solely on one's natural talent (one's charisma bonus).

Ok, but what does one gain?

Well you do very well with Bardic Knowledge. Because of the catfolk favoured class ability helping out one's class ability, you gain a +1 bonus at 1st and 2nd levels, and a +2 bonus at every even level, to all 10 knowledge checks. This adds up pretty quickly. When lore master kicks in at level 5, one will already have a +16 bonus (5 ranks + 4 int + 3 class skill + 4 bardic knowledge (class and racial)), so could hit DC 26 knowledge checks (and 1x/day a DC 36 knowledge check). And it keeps getting better. Eventually at level 20 on has an astonishing +47 bonus (20 ranks + 4 int + 3 class skill + 20 bardic knowledge (class and racial)) bonus so one can regularly hit DC 57 knowledge checks and 3x a day hit DC 67. That, for example, is enough to give six useful pieces of information about the Tarrasque.

Wanna know something? Ask the Sage. Frankly I think it leaves even the Lore Master in the dust.

And this pseudo-archetype doesn't cost any feats or traits, and doesn't take into account any magic items or any increases to intelligence (although note that a headband of intellect might, by default, only give ranks in knowledge skills, which would be less useful to the sage that already has those knowledge skill ranks). You still get the bard spells (although fewer spell slots per day with less of a priority on charisma, as well as a lower DC for spells). Bardic abilities are mostly unaffected (although again the DC for some of them is lower). But the "Bread and butter" bardic performances are buffs anyhow, and those don't use save DCs anyhow. It is odd, but one does not need a single rank in any perform skill to use those bard performance abilities.

The only mystery left is why catfolk, of all races, is so very good at this. I don't know if there are any other races whose favoured class ability for bard adds to bardic knowledge.

Liberty's Edge

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You could be a half elf evangelist with breadth of experience, fast learner, improvisation, improved improvisation and (deific obedience) evangelist and have even better bonuses all without even bothering to put ranks in there. The catfolk bonus only improves bardic knowledge from 1/2 level to full level, essentially, while costing 1 hp/level. So by level 10, only +5, not that great. For comparison, the above build of irori has a plus
4 sacred (obedience)
2 half elf
4 improved improv
4 evangelist
4 bard
2 breadth of experience
=+22 + int + equipment to every knowledge without even bothering to put 70 ranks in them...and also most other untrained skills...

or instead of being a bard at all, channel the trickster as a medium:
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/occult-adventures/occult-classes/medium/
and get +3-4 to all skills instead of just knowledge checks. That's +19+stat to every single skill...at level 10.

Liberty's Edge

Correction: 13+stat in all skills, but 19 in knowledge checks.


Interesting, although not useful in my case as there is no way in hell my DM would allow a prestige class that advances all the class features of a previous class (albeit at -1 level).


Also, I think your evangelist adds up to 20 + int (or there is a +2 bonus missing from your list).

The catfolk bard 10 is at 23 + int (10 ranks + 3 class skill bonus + 5 bard knowledge + 5 catfolk more bard knowledge), so a bit higher in the knowledge skills. But doesn't have to invest in any feats for this.

Finally, I assume a medium can't always get trickster, as one needs to be in the appropriate sacred location.

I guess it depends if one wants to lose out on feat slots or skill point allocations.


For the half-elf evangelist, I don't think the Irori Deification Obedience and Evangelistt Multitudde of Talents would stack since they are both Sacred or Profane bounus


I wonder, if you had your Bard be neutral, could you make one bonus Sacred and the other Profane?

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