Giant Slayer and Hell's Rebels advice needed


Pathfinder Adventure Path General Discussion


I run a group of five 3rd/4th level adventurers and am thinking of running the first three segments of Giantslayer followed by the first three of Hell's Rebels (on surface they seem to fit into my campaign plan; north to Hold of Belkzen and then West to the ocean). I am happy to put the effort in to change the challenge ratings. What I am mainly looking for are good storylines. I would hope the party might rise to 8th level after playing all 6 of these (in my campaign, progression is slow-to-medium). Any advice before I purchase the books???


Pathfinder Companion, Pawns Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

Are you talking 6 whole books? The 1st 3 books of an AP are typically 10-11 levels at medium, 8 levels at slow, so you'll have to do a lot of modification to the fighting to handle the pace. By book 3 in GS, they're facing stone giants and some pretty high CR critters that don't have lower level alternatives. If they're only in the level 5-6 range at this point, your task becomes considerably more difficult.

I haven't dug into HR as much as GS (in book 4 now), though I've read the first HR book rather extensively. There's literally no connection between them in terms of style and player character choices. The end of GS book 3 puts you not very far from Korvosa, so the path is about right.


Thanks taks. I'm still mulling but that's very helpful.


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Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Instead of Giantslayer 1-3 and then Hell's Rebels 1-3, how about Giantslayer 1-3 followed by Curse of the Crimson Throne 4-6?

Spoiler:
In this mash-up, the BBEG changes to Kazavon (inhabiting Queen Ileosa) re-building his hordes.

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

I'd just run Hell's Rebels. It's a much better AP than Giantslayer.


Thanks Dargonchess and Gorbacz. I was also attracted to Curse of the Crimson Throne, but hmmm, Hell's Rebels I could just do as I really fancy that one. Thanks. More food for thought


Pathfinder Companion, Pawns Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

CoCT and HR are stylistically and thematically similar, btw, so you're going to get the same flavor from either. GS is quite different.

Another thing to consider is that APs are huge time investmemts. If you have a slow group (both of mine are), even playing weekly may require 2 or more years to finish. People (including you) may simply want to hang out for the full ride once you start.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens Subscriber
Gorbacz wrote:
I'd just run Hell's Rebels. It's a much better AP than Giantslayer.

I'm running Hell's Rebels, I run Giantslayer.

They are very different APs, both are satisfying experiences imo. Giantslayer is more "old style" and straightforward while Hell's Rebels is much more sandboxy and has easier challanges thus far (Giantslayer is simply brutal to the players sometimes... straight from book one!). I don't think you can really compare them.

P.S.

I'd like you to stop presenting your opinions as hard facts.


So you're going to play these 3+3 AP books with the same PCs (as opposed to just the same players)? I'm GM:ing Hell's Rebels right now and even though I haven't read Giantslayer, it seems to be an AP very far from Hell's Rebels in themes, story, focus, style... well, in about everything really. Where HR is a (social and skill-focused) urban campaign, GS seems to be a dungeon-delve, hack and slash to the end boss-type of affair. Nothing wrong with that, but I fail to see how they are going to fit together. And the storylines? Stopping rampaging giants in the wilderness contra slowly building a rebellion in an oppressed city?

I don't want to sound polemic - I'm just curious how (or if?) you're planning for these two to gel.

Silver Crusade

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Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Rogar Valertis wrote:
Gorbacz wrote:
I'd just run Hell's Rebels. It's a much better AP than Giantslayer.

I'm running Hell's Rebels, I run Giantslayer.

They are very different APs, both are satisfying experiences imo. Giantslayer is more "old style" and straightforward while Hell's Rebels is much more sandboxy and has easier challanges thus far (Giantslayer is simply brutal to the players sometimes... straight from book one!). I don't think you can really compare them.

P.S.

I'd like you to stop presenting your opinions as hard facts.

I could, if I was comparing apples to apples. Godfather to Forrest Gump. Catcher in the Rye vs To Kill a Mockingbird. RotRL vs CotCT.

But that's not the case. Giantslayer is just weak and doesn't compare to Hell's Rebels. The first two episodes of Giantslayer are good, but the AP takes a nose dive afterwards, culminating in atrocious adventure 5 (really, somebody got paid for writing it?) and completely forgettable final episode which pits players against a BBEG who has absolutely nothing on Ileosa, Karzoug, Unity or Barizali Thrune.

It's not brutal, it's [Moriarty] bo-o-o-ring [/Moriarty].


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens Subscriber
Gorbacz wrote:
Rogar Valertis wrote:
Gorbacz wrote:
I'd just run Hell's Rebels. It's a much better AP than Giantslayer.

I'm running Hell's Rebels, I run Giantslayer.

They are very different APs, both are satisfying experiences imo. Giantslayer is more "old style" and straightforward while Hell's Rebels is much more sandboxy and has easier challanges thus far (Giantslayer is simply brutal to the players sometimes... straight from book one!). I don't think you can really compare them.

P.S.

I'd like you to stop presenting your opinions as hard facts.

I could, if I was comparing apples to apples. Godfather to Forrest Gump. Catcher in the Rye vs To Kill a Mockingbird. RotRL vs CotCT.

But that's not the case. Giantslayer is just weak and doesn't compare to Hell's Rebels. The first two episodes of Giantslayer are good, but the AP takes a nose dive afterwards, culminating in atrocious adventure 5 (really, somebody got paid for writing it?) and completely forgettable final episode which pits players against a BBEG who has absolutely nothing on Ileosa, Karzoug, Unity or Barizali Thrune.

It's not brutal, it's [Moriarty] bo-o-o-ring [/Moriarty].

Again, your opinion. Did you ever play GS? I did and I also run the AP as GM. Also I'm running HR. The APs are 2 different experiences. People who enjoy hack and slash and "old school D&D" games will probably like GS more than HR. People who want more roleplay, intrigue and sandbox elements will love HR.

GS has some issues, as most APs do, the BBEG is not one of them imo. He's not particularly memorable maybe (but the GM is there to make him so) but froma mechanical point of view is a good challenge, in line with the difficulty level of the AP.

Silver Crusade

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Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

I've read all GS adventures. I don't need to run a slog through virtually identical caverns while fighting 43 vanilla Fire Giants to know that it would drive me and my players crazy. I'm sorry, but it feels like an adventure done by a random generator.

And I know it's "how things used be" before "vidya games and Jap cartoons killed Gary". But some time passed since, Vampire: The Masquerade, Fiasco and Dogs in the Vineyard happened, and stacking 4d6 stone giants, 2d6-1 fire giant clerics and 2d4+1 cloud giant chieftains in a 10' by 10' room doesn't cut it as a benchmark of RPG quality these days.

As for BBEG (and here I do admit it's just my opinion), any heroic story (and that's what D&D/PF is) will be only as good as the villain is. You can't have a good bunch of Bellerophons if your Chimera sucks donkey balls.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

You crazy foreigners and your weird words. Chimera don't suck on donkey balls.

It's more of a clamping down.

I assume Bellerophons can only mean "nipples"


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

I can't really say anything about Giantslayer, as I don't have it (the only AP since Kingmaker I don't have) but Hell's Rebels is one of the top three APs and mish mashing it something else is only doing your players a disservice.

I would certainly add on to it, but I wouldn't cut and paste. :-)


Pathfinder Companion, Pawns Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

Huh, the Giantslayer you have must be different than the one I have. The squares on the maps are all 10'x10' at scale. The maps are freaking huge, on the order of 8'x6' in actual scale.

Silver Crusade

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Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
taks wrote:
Huh, the Giantslayer you have must be different than the one I have. The squares on the maps are all 10'x10' at scale. The maps are freaking huge, on the order of 8'x6' in actual scale.

I constantly need to remind myself that this is a community where irony, sarcasm, hyperbole, allusion and understatement do not work.


How dare you sir! My vole is neither hyper, nor sarcastic!

He's kind of ironic, in that I asked for a puppy. And he might be alluding to something, I don't speak vole, so couldn't tell you what.


Amusing!

Although it would work even better if

Spoiler:
'hyperbole' rhymed with 'vole'...

'Hyperbole' is 4 syllables: 'high-PER-bo-lee'. Still. Many think it's pronounced 'HIGH-per-bowl' or even 'high-per-BOWL'. Quite a common misconception, so I wouldn't worry too much about it.

<shrug>

And now you know.

Of course, given to the implied irony in your post, you most probably already knew that!

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