i need some advice on my boltace.


Advice


this boltace is lvl 5. which means it will get crossbow training. i am also taking all the feats to get crossbow mastery. should i focus all these things on one weapon or can i get away with splitting them up between two kinds of weapons? the DM is giving this character 2 kinds of repeating crossbows a set of hand crossbows and a heavy crossbow.

if i took crossbow mastery and rapid reload for the repeating hand crossbows and crossbow training for the heavy repeating crossbow, would that work?


It wouldn't be worth it. Crossbow mastery isn't worth it either, you should just use a light crossbow. The slight damage difference isn't worth the extra feat expenditure.

I would also suggest exiting Bolt Ace and multiclassing into something else, as after gaining the crossbow training there isn't anything strong enough to stick around in the class for.


Yea I was guna drop boltace after lvl 5 like a bad habit. Crossbow Mastery allows me to reload any crossbow as a free action. Which seems to be a good thing.

I don't get a light crossbow. I got a pair of repeating hand crossbows and a heavy repeating crossbow.


With a repeating crossbow you need at least one hand to fire it and at least one other hand to operate the reloading lever. You can't effectively dual-wield repeating hand crossbows unless you have at least one more hand than usual. Therefore you probably want to focus everything on the heavy crossbow.

Did you ask about this before zainale? I'm sure I remember reading this recently.


get rid of the repeating crossbows and just use a normal heavy crossbow or a minator double crossbow then go fighter or warpreist after lvl 5 bolt ace


yea i did, but i was looking in on it on my own as a possibility. but i never asked this exact question. and the DM wants me to make a bolt ace with those as it's weapons. i have one lvl to play with. i was thinking of going summoner and keeping to the crossbow theme and having the little guy run and hide and shot bolts from out of reach or having it rid my PC and and lend me an extra pair of arms for cocking and reloading. but my dm got all hinky. so instead i will go with what the story is providing and making the character a changling and taking witch for the sixth lvl.


Crossbow, Double

This heavy weapon fires a pair of iron-tipped bolts with a single squeeze of the trigger.

Benefit: Make one attack roll. If the attack hits, the target takes damage from both bolts. Critical hits, sneak attack damage, and other precision-based damage only apply to the first bolt.

Drawback: Due to its size and weight, you take a –4 penalty on your attack roll if you’re proficient with it, or –8 if you’re not.

Load: Loading one bolt is a standard action; the Rapid Reload feat reduces this to a move action. Crossbow Mastery allows you to reload both bolts as a single move action.

thats the only pathfinder double crossbow i could find.


the minitor crossbow is a really old one that is hard to track down its basically a double crossbow but it doesnt have the wording were crossbow master doesn't reduce it to a free action it also only gives a -2 to hit aswell i think instead of a -4


I'd recommend going into Fighter and taking the Mutagen Warrior archetype. You get mutagen, one of the best martial buffs (if not the best), to get a huge bonus to your Dexterity (at the expense of your Wisdom, but that should already be fairly decent since you're a gunslinger, so I wouldn't think you'll take too much of a hit, and it doesn't impact your Grit total). This also gives you an increase to natural armour. In addition, you get access to AWT, which has some great tools for any martial (Armed Bravery is of particular note, Warrior Spirit and Versatile Training (crossbows) are also good options). It'll also get your feats faster, and provide a decent damage boost and utility boost through Item Mastery (or doing a bit of light Iron Caster'ing by taking Barroom Brawler and Abundant Tactics), and reasonably solid.

Another option is Ranger if you want some feats and some spellcasting, without compromising your your BaB, and getting keeping your good saves high as well as get some good class skills. Though I'd just go Archery combat style rather than crossbowmen, since the latter is simply a weaker combat style overall.


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I also encourage going fighter but vote for Weapon Master archetype. Don't waste a feat on Crossbow mastery, as they already told you, you are expending a feat to gain 1 point of extra damage on average. Totally not worth it.

About the archetype, stick with a light crossbow and make it your weapon of choice for the class. When you reach 8th level (3rd in wpn master fighter) you get weapon training and can choose the advanced weapon training option every time you gain one of the fighter's bonus feats. Some good recomendations for this are versatile training, warrior spirit, abundant tactics (explained later) or trained initiative.

The archetype also grants some bonuses to criticals, so going that route on later levels is a good idea.

About abundant tactics, the barroom brawler or item mastery feats are excellent choices for the expanded uses it grants. You can get BB and use it to grant the Advanced weapon training option: item mastery, which essentially gives you an item mastery feat of your choice, and allows for a wide range of magic utility options.


Pathfinder Lost Omens Subscriber
zainale wrote:

this boltace is lvl 5. which means it will get crossbow training. i am also taking all the feats to get crossbow mastery. should i focus all these things on one weapon or can i get away with splitting them up between two kinds of weapons? the DM is giving this character 2 kinds of repeating crossbows a set of hand crossbows and a heavy crossbow.

if i took crossbow mastery and rapid reload for the repeating hand crossbows and crossbow training for the heavy repeating crossbow, would that work?

Once you reach lvl 5 in bolt ace there's little incentive (machanically at least) to stay a bolt ace. My personal suggestion would be to multiclass into a Fighter (mutation warrior). Extracts to dex and all those sweet advanced weapon training options to get eveno more damage/utility out of the crossbow.

As for the weapons I find an heavy xbow is more than enough if you go for crossbow mastery. Huge range and good damage are granted once you reach lvl 6 and begin shooting twice (or thrice...) a round, getting the feat as early as lvl 2 is possible if you start with 2 lvls of fighter and then multiclass into gunslinger (bolt ace) until lvl 5 (for dex to dmg) then fighter again.


zainale wrote:
thats the only pathfinder double crossbow i could find.

The Minotaur Double Crossbow is in Classic Horrors Revisited.

Unlike the normal double crossbow it has the text:

Quote:
Reloading a double crossbow takes 2 standard actions (one for each bolt), although the Rapid Reload feat reduces this to 2 move actions (meaning that it can be accomplished in 1 round). The Crossbow Mastery feat can reduce this even further and allow a Minotaur Double Crossbow to load both bolts as a Swift action or a single bolt as a free action.


zainale wrote:

Yea I was guna drop boltace after lvl 5 like a bad habit. Crossbow Mastery allows me to reload any crossbow as a free action. Which seems to be a good thing.

I don't get a light crossbow. I got a pair of repeating hand crossbows and a heavy repeating crossbow.

And you should sell them and just have a light crossbow. Seriously, it's a waste of a feat to be able to reload all crossbow as a free action. Rapid reload allows you to reload light crossbows as a free action. The difference between a standard light crossbow and other crossbows that are "better" is 1d8 vs 1d10 damage die. But you have to spend extra feats to be able to reload them as a free action.

That extra feat is better spent on so many different things that it's a waste to spend it on crossbow mastery.

Precise Shot
Point Blank Shot
Rapid Shot
Rapid Reload
Deadly Aim
Improved Precise Shot
Point Blank Master (if you can get it by taking levels in Fighter)
Improved Critical

Then there's Overwatch Style which can be pretty great.
And if you take levels in Fighter for PBM you can take Weapon Focus, Greater Weapon Focus, Weapon Spec, and Greater Weapon Spec. Anyone one of those feat is better than Crossbow mastery (because a +1 to hit is on average worth +2 points of damage).

Sovereign Court

PossibleCabbage wrote:
zainale wrote:
thats the only pathfinder double crossbow i could find.

The Minotaur Double Crossbow is in Classic Horrors Revisited.

Unlike the normal double crossbow it has the text:

Quote:
Reloading a double crossbow takes 2 standard actions (one for each bolt), although the Rapid Reload feat reduces this to 2 move actions (meaning that it can be accomplished in 1 round). The Crossbow Mastery feat can reduce this even further and allow a Minotaur Double Crossbow to load both bolts as a Swift action or a single bolt as a free action.

The Minotaur Double Crossbow from Classic Horrors Revisited isn't PFS Legal, but the one from Classic Monsters Revisited is; it doesn't have that added line about reloading both bolts as a swift action and there is no Campaign Clarification about it.


i just wish pathfinder would just port over the great crossbow from 3.5


Lady-J wrote:
i just wish pathfinder would just port over the great crossbow from 3.5

what is that? a shoulder mounted crossbow?


I would really like to have one of those.....

Sovereign Court

If you and a partner take the Artillery Team teamwork feat you can kind of have a shoulder mounted crossbow.


zainale wrote:
Lady-J wrote:
i just wish pathfinder would just port over the great crossbow from 3.5
what is that? a shoulder mounted crossbow?

its basically an exotic heavy cross bow that does 2d8 damager per shot


The great crossbow-loved to use that in the opening rd of combat. See gnoll. Impale gnoll.


Impale gnoll?


I rolled a critical hit. Guess it was more of a 'had to be there moment'.


ohhh >.<

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