DM question: a player wants a draconic eodolon for his unchained summoner.


Advice


So, a player wants a draconic eodolon for his unchained summoner.
Problem is, there is no Draconic outsider subtype/type for the list of eodolon types he can use. I want to help him in this as I forced his hand in choosing an unchained summoner over the overpowered original. Any balanced homebrew solutions you know of that would allow him to have a draconic eodolon that is not OP?
Thx
This is my first time DMing, we are doing Crimson Throne.


It's your choice whether you want to bend the rules on this. Keep in mind that one of the major factors in creating the unchained summoner was imposing strict limits on the eidolon.

That said, how much dragon is he looking for? You still can do a lot with evolutions, and appearance. You just can't expect the entire package at first level.


I'm unsure. Probably just the typical winged, breath weaponed, quadruped lizard with a tail???


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Gorethel wrote:
I'm unsure. Probably just the typical winged, breath weaponed, quadruped lizard with a tail???

Evoloutions can give you that... but it's a work in progress. Just start with a quadraped form and work at it over time.


what outsider suptype should I encourage him to choose? Will I be able to add Draconic to its known languages later? I'm pretty new to this as you can see...


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I recommend an air elemental as the starting point. It makes a pretty good (and unusually nimble) dragon. After eighth level, just give it free fake wings, or allow the player to trade magical flight for winged flight and Wing Buffet. Evolution Surge is a great spell for temporarily grabbing pricey evolutions like a breath weapon.

I'd give them Draconic for free.


For languages note that the eidolon speaks all languages that the summoner knows.


the elemental is your best bet for dragon feel.


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Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
QuidEst wrote:

I recommend an air elemental as the starting point. It makes a pretty good (and unusually nimble) dragon. After eighth level, just give it free fake wings, or allow the player to trade magical flight for winged flight and Wing Buffet. Evolution Surge is a great spell for temporarily grabbing pricey evolutions like a breath weapon.

I'd give them Draconic for free.

I've made dragons out of air eidolons before. Turned out pretty well I must say.


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Consider just letting him use the chained eidolon rules, but with an increased pounce cost. The unchained eidolon is way too constrained.


Got to agree with air elemental. Fits so well the immunities are correct.

If you were letting the player swap for real wings and wing buffet, add improved damage (wings) on there so the equivalent cost is the same.


You could even say that the dragon said summoner is summoning is a Cloud Dragon, which has the air elemental subtype.


As a DM, you are within your limits to give him the pre-unchained eidolon as a sort of buff for the class. You might want to make some evolutions more expensive, I am not an expert there. Considering that the summoners spell list was also strongly nerfed, he will still be weaker than the pre-unchained summoner.

I agree with the option for elemental as well. Some of the others can be refluffed as draconic creatures, but it is the easiest fit.Note that this type does not cover only classical elementals, but also other creatures from the elemental planes such as salamanders (i.e. serpentine fire elemental).


Two of the design objectives of the Unchained Summoner's Eidolon were to make the Eidolon less broken, and more planar-thematic. Besides the Synthesist Summoner, Pounce was the most broken part of the Eidolon. Removing that from the toolkit, or making it pricier, will go a long way towards having a balanced dragon. If you're willing to sacrifice the Outsider theme imposed by Unchained, then it shouldn't be a problem. A player who wants a Dragon instead of cheap Pounce seems like the sort of person who won't abuse it (too much).

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